My adult DS is not talking to me

[GlamourNana]

Hi, hope you can help me out with some advice. My DD and her 2 DCs are living with me for a while she’s gone back to uni to do masters degree. My DS has one child who we see regularly particularly as he loves to come and play with his cousins.

The problem has arisen because my DS thinks that whatever we do it must include his son also. Even when my DD is booking and paying for activities for her 2 DCs.

Generally this is the case but last weekend I was babysitting my DDs children as she and her partner had booked a trip away for her birthday and my partner had arranged an outing with his DD and DGC ( been arranged for months) with my DDs permission I took her 2 children along and this is where the problem is.

My DS found out ( although certainly not kept it secret) and has gone ballistic saying I should’ve taken my other Gc as well. It simply was not practical and the activity was unsuitable for a child of his age. ( he is younger than the other 2)I have explained this to DS but he’s having none of it and accusing me of leaving him out all the time which is simply not true!

My DD has booked a UK seaside trip with her DCs next month and asked for me to come along for company which my DS has now taken exception to saying we should take his DC too. It’s not my holiday and my DD doesn’t want to have to look after her nephew for a week on her only holiday with her children (she works full time and will barely see her DCs over the summer). She explained to her brother that she’d happily take little one another time but not for a full week. The expense and distance is too much, it’s 5 hours each way in the car.

For context DD and I help a lot with childcare and include my other GC in most excursions and see him several times a week. DS and his family have also recently come back from a 2 week abroad holiday so GC has had a nice family holiday, this UK trip is all my DD can afford and the truth is I think she’s asked me to come just for some adult company.

I have looked after DS’s DC on several occasions when DS and his wife have gone away for weekends away without GC and I see him regularly without my DD or her DCs there so I can have one on one time with him.

My MIL was not a very nice grandma to my children although she was to her others , my DS is now saying I’m like her and I’m absolutely devastated, I look after all members of my family and think I’m very fair, he has now said he is done with me and I am not being allowed to pick my GS up from nursery today as I would usually. Any advice welcome .

I’m in the he’s a brat side.

He wants is son to be included in every trip and expects you or his sister to foot the bill.

He doesn’t invite you or his niece and nephew on his holidays, doesn’t babysit his sisters kids yet expects you all to babysit is child’s and pay for days out for his son.

Do most people have such expectations? If my dc are being taken somewhere I always insist on paying for them and reciprocate the childcare.

You son wants to palm his child off on to you whenever he feels like and expects you to be available for childcare whenever he requires and you’re also expected to foot the bill of trips out for his child.

Why is your daughter offering to take her nephew out separately on trip because he’s not included in her family holiday. Her children haven’t been offered the same by their uncle.

He sounds mean and grabby and very entitled.

It seems to me that your DD has not kicked off about stuff so he takes you and her for granted.

This was exactly the argument my mum and my sister used to use on me - no, she didn't kick off because she had no reason to.

I'm the eldest and was expected to be self sufficient, to cope, to just get on with it. My sister really played on being the youngest and needing help with everything, being driven places that I would have to drive myself to, basically still being treated as a child despite being an adult. I would constantly be left out but they couldnt see anything wrong with it - I was fortunate because I was able to do things for myself - well no, I had no choice.

Biggest bug bear (and this is so outing) my parents did something for every one of my sister's birthdays but my birthday is at Christmas so I have to take it in turns to see my parents on that day " because it's Christmas". Well, no. It's my birthday. Why can't I spend every birthday with my parents, like my sister does? Yes, it's childish but from their view they are being fair by sharing Christmas equally. From my point of view they see my sister every birthday and me only half.

How you view things depends on which side you are seeing them from doesn't it?

Out of the two of you,you and your ds, only one of you is actually related to your mil.... has he always been this entitled? Others have said it better but when does he invite you on your holidays? Your dd hangs out with you, your ds wants grandma childminder to up her hours, it isn’t the same thing at all.

As stated by PP “Why should your dd take her nephew on her holiday when your ds didn't take his sister's kids on his holiday?”

As above a thousand times over ! He does sound a bit entitled imo. I’d nip the thinking he’s “Head of the Household” nonsense in the bud while I was at it too ! All in the one conversation.

@DecomposingComposers a family member has something similar I feel your pain [santa][santa] on one Yuletide occasion they reciprocated the old “this is your birthday AND Xmas present “ to the other family members it was not well received but they got the point !

Your DS is spoiled rotten and I'm afraid I would tell him so. If he wants his child on the trip then by all means tell him to take his child. It is not your responsibility to please your grown son when it suits him!

I think ds is only viewing the ‘childcare ‘ aspect... on your dd holiday you will be providing childcare. So why shouldn’t you do that for him. The situation is of course very different. If you went on holiday with him and his dw you probably would provide childcare... let them go out to dinner etc. This is not really the case with dd, you are company although you do help too . He might also think you’re paying. He needs to understand that you are being as fair as you can, but it’s not an even playing field.

Clearly the ds feels sidelined, and whilst one can suck it up for oneself, when you feel a slight against your own child, you can't bear it.

Obviously the gc who live with the gm will be closer to her. Their stuff will be in her house, they will be comfortable there, there will be in jokes, familiar routines, the general ease of rubbing along together. The gs will, no matter how equal any gifts/days out, always be "just" a visitor.

Surely we can all imagine how the ds feels? Even if it is unjustified, or all very reasonable given the dd's circumstances etc etc, he seems to feel that his family unit is "lesser" than his dsis's.

Added to which the dd and the OP seem to be great chums, which adds fuel to the fire. Given that the ds's df is dead, he possibly feels that he has lost a parental ally.

"my DS seems to think I can’t/shouldn’t make any decision without consulting him whereas my DD has understood my loneliness and eventually my need to make a new life for myself."

So you maybe have a better relationship with your daughter as you "get" each other/get on better/have more in common?

I can absolutely understand how the DS may have his nose out of joint. My MIL lived with my SIL, so clearly her kids were very much the MIL's kids. My sister and mother lived very much in each other's pockets - working together, in the same small town, all that sort of thing, so yes, her kids very much have a different relationship with their GM than mine do.

Difference perhaps is, that I can perceive these differences, their whys and wherefores, and understand, respect, and accept them. Like a grown-up.

I don't expect anything as of right from a grandparent, anything you or your children are given, it is a gift, to be appreciated.

Sorry i still say hes a brat-youre forgoing your own holiday so you can babysit?

What does he want from you

What would he say if your DD asks him if he, his wife and DC want to come along on days out / holidays ? That way everyone is included and each child will have their parent there to look after them.

PS just read NannyOgg’s post and agree 100%

@DillyDilly if DD is working full time AND doing a masters degree I imagine her time with her kids is limited. Especially if she also shares custody with their dad?
Why should DD not be able to book, pay for and go on whatever days out or holidays with her kids that she wants? Why does she have to invite her brother’s family... he doesn’t do that?! She asks her mum to come because she enjoys spending time with her by the sounds of it, not for the kids.
Being a single parent is hard and lonely... I know! I’ve done it for many years!

It’s pathetic jealousy in my opinion.

Having been the sibling less favoured, I can understand why he might feel as he does. Perhaps you could put a bit more effort into seeing him and his family without your daughter so he feels they get that quality one to one time. Whenever my parents have my kids or we go over, I can guarantee my sibling will turn up or need the kids looking after. It's become a running joke. Even when my parents are with me, my sibling will phone up and invite them over, knowing full well they are with me. My sibling lived with them for a while when DN1 was born and so they do have a special relationship. I also know my parents perceive my sibling as less able to manage so offer more help. Maybe your DS just needs that reassurance. Or maybe it's also time you got a life away from your kids too so you aren't all so reliant on each other. Why are his feelings any less valid because he is an adult?

Cabbagesoupsucks

Very similar experience to me.

This isn’t fair. Can’t be. Your other GC live with you full-time. Your daughter decided to live with you for her master’s degree. Possibly not paying rent etc… The whole situation ended up like this because of your daughter. I suppose you could say something for her different circumstances and all that; but is now really an opportune time to go for her degree etc … No way this can possibly even out (not necessary a requirement- depends on the situation). Your son’s child (as is your son) is more of a visitor, since the other ones live there. I can understand why he doesn’t enjoy this particular arrangement. Add to that you seem to have a better relationship with your daughter I can understand why he’s done with you (but don’t necessarily agree- his choice though).

I would let him be; I don’t believe in platitudes about writing letters stating you love x and y equally. Actions speak louder than words; he’s had a whole history with you I suppose he can form his opinion based on that.

Your son is being ridiculous. And very childish.

It sounds like you do your best to be as fair to everyone as you can. You do spend time with your grandson (DS's son) without the other GC, collect him from nursery one day per week to spend time with him and have also looked after him while DS and his wife go away. You can only to be as fair as possible and do what you can.

However, inevitably if you live with your DD and her children, then you will see more of them and have a different relationship. What does your DS expect? To kick them out or make life more difficult for your DD just so he feels better about it?

He could invite you on holiday to spend time with his son, but he doesn't. He could invite you out on family days out with his DS but he doesn't. Why is it all down to you to invite or arrange things? Also, you say DS feels you should run all your decisions past him- I think you have to be very clear that you don't have to get his approval for every decision you make, just as he doesn't need yours.

I think the danger is that if you give into this tantrum, he'll use it all the time and it'll be even harder.

I can understand where a lot of PPs different views on this are coming from.

My kids are older than my nephews, so have had more time getting to know my parents. Also, in order to purchase our first home we had to move back in with them for several months. We are now on the other side of the same town as them. Whereas my nephews live way down the motorway. My kids are a lot of my parents because of logistics and effort on both mine and mums parts. But my parents relationship with my sibling is difficult and sibling cut them out for a long time and is still slagging them off behind their backs. It would definitely look like my kids were being favoured, but it's just a case of us being in the right place and not being arseholes. We ask my parents if they want to be involved in this or that. We include them. And this is reflected in what time, energy and financial gain we may have from my family. Sometimes, things just are the way they are. It sounds like your son is an entitled manchild douche bag who can't see the forest for the trees. He probably thinks you're doing much more for your daughter than you are.

SlipperyWhenWatery

Can you not see your sibling's side to your story?

It reads like you know that you are getting more than your sibling and are trying to justify it.

Your parents helped you to buy your house by letting you move back in with them - did your sibling get the same help?

You say that because you live closer to your parents it's obvious that you get more time, energy and financial gain - how so?

As a parent you have a responsibility not to favour one child. In the ops case yes her dd and GC are living with her so I think she needs to acknowledge that and listen when her son says that he feels his family are missing out. Why not take your son's child out for the day rather than your dd and her children, knowing that you already see far more of them than your son's family?

My mil favours DNiece sils dd and she would argue she treats them all the same. However she doesn't she makes more time and effort with sils child and it deeply hurts dh. Other sil is now pregnant so we imagine DNiece will be blown out for favour of the new baby. I think his POV is valid and theres probably some truth in it.

I wonder whether you spend a reasonable amount of time just with your DS and/or DS's child on their own. Is that the issue?

It's just that we have something similar. PIL and BIL/SIL live very close together and PIL give lots of support. We obviously don't get that and totally understand why. The annoying thing is that when we do visit it always has to include BIL/SIL. We can't do anything just us and PIL. It's like we as a family aren't valued unless we're with BIL/SIL.

Maybe not, he could just be being a brat.

Realised that our issues are similar to Cabbagesoupsucks

But he doesn't include his nephews/nieces, does he? He doesn't include you, either. He goes on holiday whenever he wants with his family, but doesn't include anyone else, yet when you go on holiday, you have to include his family. That's not fair.

^ this in spades.

How old is he? He sounds terribly immature.

Also sounds like he's a bit of a CF looking for free childcare and days out for his DS.
His idea about you and his sister taking his DS on holiday with you is ridiculous . I would've said "sure we'll take him and the next holiday it's your turn to pay and I can come with you and your sisters DCs".

I'm not sure that this is about going on holiday though. I think it's more about the son feeling shut out, that his mum and sister have such a close relationship and he doesn't have that.

In the same way that I get upset about my parents spending birthdays with my sister but they can't do it for me because my birthday is at Christmas. They are all at me that I'm bothered about my birthday but it's not the birthday as such, it's that it symbolises them caring more about my sister than me. To them, they don't see it as not choosing to see me on my birthday. They see it as being fair to both of us by dividing Christmases equally between us - because that is fair. The fact that it's also my birthday is unfortunate, according to them, and I should get over it.

So, for me, it's not really about birthdays it's what they symbolise and I suspect it's the same for the OPs son - it's not the holidays or days out really it's what they represent which is that the OP prefers the company if her dd and her DC than she does the son.