AIBU - What would you have done?

[TheQueensCorgi]

Name changed. Meeting at work (large company, very big on rights for all) and at the end we shook hands with others. I was the only woman in the room and when I got to a man (not white), I put out my hand and he said ‘Sorry I don’t shake hands with women’, and walked off.

I kind of stood there not really knowing what to do next, a few of the men who had overheard still in the room said he never shakes hands for religious reasons.

What would you have done? Would you brush this off? I felt like a second class citizen and quite embarrassed. Should I just be accepting of the fact this was his view or do I have the right to be annoyed ?

Sorry I can’t remember when. A few years ago I think but exactly the same scenario.

He said sorry, and it’s true he doesn’t; what did you want him to do?

This ^

His faith (Orthodox Jew? Strict muslim?) prevents him from touching a woman he is not married or otherwise related to. He apologised - it's not like he cut you dead.

I would just ignore it and not take it personally. It's no more intended as a rudeness than if a vegetarian said "I'm sorry - I can't eat steak." I'm sure you wouldn't be offended at that.

It wouldn't bother me if someone did as Hefzi described...lots of Muslim men have different actions they'll perform instead - put their hand on their heart and then also to their head (a bit like how men used to touch their hats, only put their hand to their heart, do a namaste, bow their heads, do a half bow with their hands behind them... but a bald "Sorry, I don't shake hands with women" would make me take the hump. It's very belittling and unprofessional.

It's his religion. He said sorry. What exactly did you want him to do? Renounce his faith?

He was rude. He made his issue your problem. He should have declined to shake hands with anyone.

I would just ignore it and not take it personally. It's no more intended as a rudeness than if a vegetarian said "I'm sorry - I can't eat steak." I'm sure you wouldn't be offended at that.

that analogy is shoddy. If a vegetarian gives the steak a miss, then what on earth does it have to do with me? If a man refuses to shake my hand because I am a woman (in a professional setting), then it is discrimination.

His beliefs shouldn’t affect you. He should adapt instead, i.e. don’t shake anyone’s hands, or accept that in this country, in a professional setting, you should shake everyone’s hands. Religion is used as an excuse for many things that are morally wrong, in this case sexism.

I don't respect any religion which believes women are in any way 'less'than men.
Women's rights unfortunately will always be considered less than those of men to practice discriminatory 'beliefs'.

You've got the right to be annoyed, but you've both got a duty to be polite. You should smile and walk on. He shouldn't be shaking hands with anyone. Get HR to have a word.

Just a quick thought. If a woman for religious reasons or not decided not to shake men's hands just because she didn't want to....would you think badly of her? I mean it's partly to do with consent... You don't want to then you don't have to. He gave a reason. Should have been a bit more diplomatic but you know he will learn. See my link above too

Over the course of an average year at work, I come into contact with I'd say approximately 200 or 300 Muslims.

I can honestly say not a single one of them has refused to shake my hand or the hand of any other woman in my company.

It does seem to be a part of their religion that's dying out with the younger generations.

I wouldn't worry about it OP as the likelihood of it happening again (unless with the same person) is probably very slim.

There was a very easy solution for his issue, which is not to shake anyone's hands. Doing this would have avoided discrimination by gender, which is what he did to the OP, and which is unacceptable in this country. Instead, he chose to shake only men's hands, hence causing offence. I would not only have been offended, but I would have complained officially.

The ask a manager site has a couple of good letters about this.

Handshake
www.askamanager.org/2016/09/interviewing-a-job-candidate-who-wont-shake-hands-with-women

Not being alone with women
https://www.askamanager.org/2019/05/updates-the-men-who-wouldnt-be-alone-with-women-the-very-good-dog-and-more.html

I would just ignore it and not take it personally. It's no more intended as a rudeness than if a vegetarian said "I'm sorry - I can't eat steak." I'm sure you wouldn't be offended at that.

Yes but a vegetarian wouldn't eat steak no matter who cooked it, so the OP being female wouldn't come into it

If you work for a large company with equal rights for all, and presumably at least several people in the meeting, how come you were the only woman there?

Oh and by the way, you don't have to understand or agree with someone else's culture or faith to be able to acknowledge and accept that they have different customs.

My current employer is a family-run business and they have some religious beliefs that I might not necessarily agree with. I let them get on with it.

He made his issue your problem.

It's not his "issue"- it's his faith.

And it's only a problem if OP decides she wants to make it one.

If a man refuses to shake my hand because I am a woman (in a professional setting), then it is discrimination.

Take him to court then. You are talking rubbish - he isn't refusing to work with OP, he just isn't allowed to touch her. This would apply whatever faith (or none) she was - even if it was the same faith as him. You may argue it's discriminatory against women, but you can't expect someone to change their religion because someone is a bit precious about handshake.

This is a situation which often gets construed as an example of Muslim men treating women as second class citizens. But this is not the case. Religious Muslim women will also refuse to shake the hands of men. It is equally awkward for the one refusing, as they do not know how the other person will react. But it isn't intended as an insult, simply Muslim etiquette towards members of the opposite sex. The etiquettes of greeting are gender defined in many societies - shake hands with men, kiss women, hug, high five, kiss twice, once, slap on back, etc.

As a woman, I personally do not like being obliged to grasp a man's hand because he has extended it and expects me to comply. If I don't want to be touched, surely a man ought to respect my personal space and not put out his hand unless I put out mine? In fact, that is British etiquette, though it is less observed nowadays, but until recently it was the lady's prerogative to decide what level of familiarity she wishes to allow, and the gentleman would act accordingly.

And yes, I know this isn't the same as OP's case, as she is a woman extending her hand to a man, and it is not always easy to distinguish a Muslim man from any other man, and some Muslim men might not mind shaking hands. But for any men reading this, try to avoid extending your hand to a woman in hijab, unless she first extends hers.

Considering how rare it is for a man to wash his hands after using the bathroom, I'd consider not shaking a bonus. Blurgh.

He was being rude. YANBU.

There was a photo of Justin Trudeau greeting a Muslim lady and he placed his hand on his heart and gave a little bow of his head in acknowledgement. Seems simple and polite enough...

mobile.twitter.com/sarasoueidan/status/748953000203345920

YANBU

Your religious shouldn't make people, especially women feel uncomfortable.

Umm exactly what i was trying to say but you said it better!

Bloody rude. Any religion which treats women as second class citizens is an outdated disgrace. But because we are all expected to put up with it in the name of (ironic) progress and a multicultural society, if you kick off, you'll look bad instead of him.
YANBU, he (and his religion) are.

Hold up - it’s not to do with seeing females as less (although I’m sure there are misogynists in all religions).
It’s to do with the sexual connotations and also respect. It’s not saying oh ur just a woman so I can’t acknowledge you the same as the menfolk, it’s saying - you’re a woman I am not related or married to and therefore it’s inappropriate for me to touch you.
I work with a very diverse team and this is fairly common across different cultures and religions, I’ve never felt insulted because I understand it is NOT a personal jibe towards me.
Assuming me wasn’t an arsehole in any other way I would accept this as part of the multicultural workplace.

I also remember reading this before.

HellYeah

Perhaps OP's extended hand made this man feel uncomfortable.