Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

I can't do laundry when you're in your garden

618 replies

Fairylighting · 28/06/2019 13:38

Ok, so I really don't think IABU, but was chatting to a friend about this fiasco last night and thought it would be worth putting it to the MN jury! I'll try not to drip feed, but that means this might be rather long!

I live in the first floor flat of a Victorian terrace conversion in London. It's a share of freehold with the ground floor flat and we technically each own half of the garden; my the back half from my fire escape stairs to the back fence and them the front half, from their French doors to the bottom of my steps. The whole freehold and both properties were previously owned by the same person, who rented each flat out and the garden has never been physically split by a fence or hedge etc. When I moved in (at the about same time as my downstairs neighbours), we had a brief discussion whereby we decided to share the garden since it's very small and that seemed like the most sensible and beneficial way to enjoy it.

Since then, we've had a few (4x over 20 months) minor issues where one of them (let's call her Penelope) has sent a message to our shared WhatsApp group complaining about noise, most of which wasn't actually coming from my flat. For example, once when I was away for a weekend and another time when I was asleep in bed. Then, one morning after they had been disturbed by noise from my flat, after I'd had to make a phonecall late at night I got a WhatsApp message from Penelope requesting that I don't have the TV or radio on in my bedroom after 10.30pm Sunday-Thursday... in some ways that one was easy since I don't have a TV or radio in my bedroom.

After that, we arranged to meet up for a cuppa to discuss their issues and set a date to do so a couple of weeks later. A few days before that date I was in the garden with my mum, having a cup of tea, in the afternoon. Penelope came outside and explained that they were having guests over for lunch and felt exposed because we were in the garden, and requested that we went outside. I said that I didn't think that was a reasonable request and she went inside crying.

We then met for the planned chat and Penelope and her partner (he can be Samuel for the purposes of this thread) explained that the noise wasn't really an issue and that it hadn't happened very often, also that Penelope is a light sleeper and is probably more bothered about it because of that, so we dropped that issue. Penelope then started talking about the garden and how exposed they feel in their home, when I'm in the shared garden before Samuel suggested she might want to apologise for the events of the preceding weekend. She did so, and I explained how rude I had felt that was before she continued to explain how bothered they were by the whole issue. I expressed some sympathy but also said that I like using the garden and that it's one of the reasons I bought the flat. We agreed to share schedules so they and I could plan any events involving guests for times when the other party is away if possible. We did that over the course of the following week.

About a week later I got a message saying it was Penelope's birthday and asking whether I could therefore not use the garden, so they could relax in their home. The following day I got a message with some ideas for changing the garden in a way that would make it more open with fewer changes of level and planting. I replied to say that I was happy to chat it through but that it sounded like a lot of work and might also further reduce their privacy then the conversation went quiet.

Another week later I sent a message saying that I was considering buying some solar powered fairy lights for the garden and I got a really tetchy reply from Penelope, who was upset that they'd be shining light into their property all night long. I explained that we could just turn them on and off as we wanted to use them. This prompted another message asking me not to use the garden on the Saturday of that weekend, followed by a long message explaining how upset they are by my use of the garden and how it prevents them from doing laundry and cooking. Penelope said this has all triggered her depression and anxiety and that they're worried the lights will look tacky and encourage me to use the garden in the evenings.

I replied on WhatsApp saying I wanted to consider a proper response and drafted a long email over a few days, setting out the legal position and the fact that I want to use the garden (or at least my part of it) freely. I proposed a way forwards that included me and Samuel communicating until Penelope feels better, neither party making any changes to the garden in the short term, informing eachother of any abnormal use of the garden in advance, and that our default position would need to be a return to the legal split of the garden.

Anyway, that was two weeks ago and I haven't heard a peep since... What's happened?!

OP posts:
Thread gallery
14
PristineCondition · 28/06/2019 14:23

It will never get better. This will run on and in

Id be putting up a wall ad big as trumps

Beautiful3 · 28/06/2019 14:24

I would without a doubt, fence it. You don't even need her permission to do, so as half is yours. That means you can go into your garden any time you like, without working to a schedule.

toldmywrath · 28/06/2019 14:24

@Bananacloud

"She sounds doolally tap." That's my mum's favourite sayingGrin

Fairyjuice · 28/06/2019 14:25

Fence!!

And yes, we need a diagram please!

mistermagpie · 28/06/2019 14:26

Penelope is off her head and probably shouldn't have bought a property with a shared garden if she was going to be this much of a drama llama about it.

Fence your bit off and get on with your life. Who needs this hassle?

upple · 28/06/2019 14:26

Does the house have a side return OP?

Tawdrylocalbrouhaha · 28/06/2019 14:28

I'm afraid I agree with other posters - it's time to divide the garden. It will also be worth more with a private garden, however small.

She does sound insane though.

SavingSpaces2019 · 28/06/2019 14:28

She's doing the slow burn harassment thing to force you into submission - so she can have the garden all to herself as if she owned it all.
She doesn't want to share the garden with you.
With her list of complaints to date, she's also trying to make you out to be the 'problem' neighbour.
If i were you i'd keep a written/recorded account of what's going on.

She moved into that flat knowing the garden was shared.
If her MH is genuinely that fragile then she should have moved somewhere with her own full garden.
I'd tell her that she was causing you stress and anxiety with her ongoing harassment.

Legally you're allowed to use your half of the garden as and when you want.
You've already tried to meet her halfway and make compromises but she's not happy with that either.

Stick a fence up - good side facing you.
Or lots of potted bamboo.
She's a manipulative arse and proper trying to pull a fast one.

TwoleftUggs · 28/06/2019 14:28

I want to know if the 2% who voted YABU are called Penelope

CrotchetyQuaver · 28/06/2019 14:28

They sound like they need to move to a house in the middle of nowhere. Meantime I think you need to divide the gardens with a fence

YogaDrone · 28/06/2019 14:28

@PettyContractor I'm envisioning it rather like this flat (photos 9 & 10): Flat

BlackCatSleeping · 28/06/2019 14:29

It's not your problem to solve. Penelope needs to put up net curtains or some kind of fence to protect her privacy. Just enjoy the garden as you have been doing.

cannycat20 · 28/06/2019 14:29

We're lucky in that we have lovely neighbours so our shared garden is exactly that, shared - we all use the whirligig and try to be considerate so none of us take up all of the sides; we all contribute to things for the garden (via the little management company, we're also in a converted Victorian house), but I have been in similar positions to you in the past.

I'm afraid unless you can find a temporary solution (one of those louvre screen things or similar, though I'm not sure how stable that would be) then it's fencing or a trellis with nice plants on it like sweetpeas or something; sorry for the ghastly long link, there are some quite nice ones at www.screenwithenvy.co.uk/products/arabesque-medium-garden-screen?variant=15752393097259&currency=GBP&cmp_id=1707105082&adg_id=67356261820&kwd=&device=c&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7eyZy6OM4wIVqbDtCh2PwgwmEAQYAiABEgIrxPD_BwE or (not quite so long a link) www.therange.co.uk/garden/fencing-and-landscaping/garden-screening - I'd be tempted to put mirror film on the side facing them as well but that's my passive aggressive tendencies coming out....

If Penelope doesn't want to be overlooked, then she's in the wrong place and a move to the countryside might be a jolly good idea; given how built up most places are now, though, somewhere like the middle of Exmoor, Dartmoor, Wales, Scotland or Ireland might suit her...

It sounds like you might be prepared to have a bit of a discussion about the deeds though and where the boundary line falls...

Nicolastuffedone · 28/06/2019 14:29

Get a fence and put it around Penelope.

EssentialHummus · 28/06/2019 14:29

If the garden is legally split half/half (sorry if I missed an update OP) then I'd be letting Loony McCrazypants Penelope know that clearly it'll be easier all round if everyone had their own space, and you'll be installing bamboo/a trellis/a hedge/a Rottweiler forthwith.

dottiedodah · 28/06/2019 14:30

You have been more than accomodating enough already TBH!.Facts She does not have an automatic right to the garden Im afraid!Seems she has some difficulties understanding this!.Shared gardens /drives whatever are a pain really ,as its always awkward when someone is like this .Speak to her/ Samuel. just Samuel whatever and explain your half of the garden is yours as vice versa .explain that you cannot always avoid her and would like to make use of your green space in London Town!.I think they know they have backed themselves into a corner!.Short of trying to put up a fence /trellis /hedge .No solution really short of moving TBH!

INeedNewShoes · 28/06/2019 14:31

I looked at a lovely ground floor flat with a garden shared with the upstairs flat and knew that I wouldn't feel happy with the lady upstairs sitting in the garden right outside my French windows... therefore I didn't buy the flat!

Penelope chose to buy the flat despite knowing about the shared garden, thus this is not your issue to solve.

Having said that, if the garden is big enough the clear solution is to put a fence up.

aposterhasnoname · 28/06/2019 14:32

Mahoosive fence, and an equally mahoosive hot tub complete with lights, drinks dispenser and sound system.

Greensleeves · 28/06/2019 14:32

Please do come back and tell us how she reacts when you put up the fence. My guess is she'll be madder than a wet cat - what she really wants is to scare you off and have the whole garden to herself, the spoilt cow.

CustardySergeant · 28/06/2019 14:34

I can't believe anyone has voted that YABU!

tomatostottie · 28/06/2019 14:35

Fence (with the posts on your side so she can't complain).
Just put it up on your side of the boundary. End of problem. She'll probably go batshit crazy but it's not your problem - you are perfectly within your rights to do so.

I think she has been telling people (ie. family and friends etc) that the whole garden belongs to her so can't then have the neighbours sitting in it when she has people round. Samuel sounds quite reasonable. Only communicate with him - but don't ask/inform them about the fence. Just do it.

Celebelly · 28/06/2019 14:36

Penelope is a nightmare and I suspect Samuel knows it.

PintOfBovril · 28/06/2019 14:38

Oh OP you poor thing. I have absolute sympathy... Years ago we had a flat with a chap above who asked everyone (in writing) not to flush the toilets or run the taps after 10pm. He also knocked once to complain that I had been flushing the toilet all day repeatedly, when I said I'd just got home from a 13 hour shift at work he became adament that my cat had learned to flush the toilet and had been doing so all day.
My only advice would be to recheck your lease (even as share of freehold there will be a lease that should demarcate this kind of stuff) then get on to a fencer asap.

Greenglassteacup · 28/06/2019 14:38

Op I haven’t read the full thread but you have to get a fence because Penelope is bonkers

greenwaterbottle · 28/06/2019 14:38

Fence with pretty fairy lights, bbq, and a nice outside radio. Enjoy your part of the garden and stop listening to their complaints.