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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

I can't do laundry when you're in your garden

618 replies

Fairylighting · 28/06/2019 13:38

Ok, so I really don't think IABU, but was chatting to a friend about this fiasco last night and thought it would be worth putting it to the MN jury! I'll try not to drip feed, but that means this might be rather long!

I live in the first floor flat of a Victorian terrace conversion in London. It's a share of freehold with the ground floor flat and we technically each own half of the garden; my the back half from my fire escape stairs to the back fence and them the front half, from their French doors to the bottom of my steps. The whole freehold and both properties were previously owned by the same person, who rented each flat out and the garden has never been physically split by a fence or hedge etc. When I moved in (at the about same time as my downstairs neighbours), we had a brief discussion whereby we decided to share the garden since it's very small and that seemed like the most sensible and beneficial way to enjoy it.

Since then, we've had a few (4x over 20 months) minor issues where one of them (let's call her Penelope) has sent a message to our shared WhatsApp group complaining about noise, most of which wasn't actually coming from my flat. For example, once when I was away for a weekend and another time when I was asleep in bed. Then, one morning after they had been disturbed by noise from my flat, after I'd had to make a phonecall late at night I got a WhatsApp message from Penelope requesting that I don't have the TV or radio on in my bedroom after 10.30pm Sunday-Thursday... in some ways that one was easy since I don't have a TV or radio in my bedroom.

After that, we arranged to meet up for a cuppa to discuss their issues and set a date to do so a couple of weeks later. A few days before that date I was in the garden with my mum, having a cup of tea, in the afternoon. Penelope came outside and explained that they were having guests over for lunch and felt exposed because we were in the garden, and requested that we went outside. I said that I didn't think that was a reasonable request and she went inside crying.

We then met for the planned chat and Penelope and her partner (he can be Samuel for the purposes of this thread) explained that the noise wasn't really an issue and that it hadn't happened very often, also that Penelope is a light sleeper and is probably more bothered about it because of that, so we dropped that issue. Penelope then started talking about the garden and how exposed they feel in their home, when I'm in the shared garden before Samuel suggested she might want to apologise for the events of the preceding weekend. She did so, and I explained how rude I had felt that was before she continued to explain how bothered they were by the whole issue. I expressed some sympathy but also said that I like using the garden and that it's one of the reasons I bought the flat. We agreed to share schedules so they and I could plan any events involving guests for times when the other party is away if possible. We did that over the course of the following week.

About a week later I got a message saying it was Penelope's birthday and asking whether I could therefore not use the garden, so they could relax in their home. The following day I got a message with some ideas for changing the garden in a way that would make it more open with fewer changes of level and planting. I replied to say that I was happy to chat it through but that it sounded like a lot of work and might also further reduce their privacy then the conversation went quiet.

Another week later I sent a message saying that I was considering buying some solar powered fairy lights for the garden and I got a really tetchy reply from Penelope, who was upset that they'd be shining light into their property all night long. I explained that we could just turn them on and off as we wanted to use them. This prompted another message asking me not to use the garden on the Saturday of that weekend, followed by a long message explaining how upset they are by my use of the garden and how it prevents them from doing laundry and cooking. Penelope said this has all triggered her depression and anxiety and that they're worried the lights will look tacky and encourage me to use the garden in the evenings.

I replied on WhatsApp saying I wanted to consider a proper response and drafted a long email over a few days, setting out the legal position and the fact that I want to use the garden (or at least my part of it) freely. I proposed a way forwards that included me and Samuel communicating until Penelope feels better, neither party making any changes to the garden in the short term, informing eachother of any abnormal use of the garden in advance, and that our default position would need to be a return to the legal split of the garden.

Anyway, that was two weeks ago and I haven't heard a peep since... What's happened?!

OP posts:
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TruthOnTrial · 30/06/2019 12:51

What a horrible way to live!

I feel for you OP. I feel for penelope, who is clearly suffering in some way too.

I would have replied to the whatsapp messages that i dont hear any radio/tv, where could it be coming from, as i dont have one. Ditto re the other message, so that it was clear it was nit coming from you.

That seems to have been the basis of the next step when shes asked you to leave the garden, but returned home in tears.

She is suffering badly. Both her and her partner have shared that with you, which is a big deal that they acknowledge and shared that.

But....i would let them know that things seem to have broken down beyond repair now and so you will now inly use your part of the garden, at will. You will not be asking for clearance to use your own garden whenever you want to, as its it yours to use.

That you are not interested in looking in on her life, and will try to be mindful of her privacy, but to be bear mind your garden does overlook hers and her windows, and therefore it can be easily seen from your garden, that you will understand that if that still causes discomfort she might resort to erecting a fence in her garden to give her privacy in her garden/home.

It does sound like her privacy is vital to her well-being.

TruthOnTrial · 30/06/2019 12:55

privacy is vital to her well-being

As it is to most. I agree with the adage that good fences make good neighbours. Families need space and privacy.

The less space and privacy people have and the more condensed their living the more their mh suffers.

TruthOnTrial · 30/06/2019 12:58

I am shocked at the abuse on here toward someone suffering with mh issues.

The name-calling, all the old classic rantings of the hateful [shes 'mad', 'nutter', 'barking']

I thought society had moved on and was cultivating a gentler approach to those suffering with mh illness.

MotherOfDragonite · 30/06/2019 13:03

I don't think it's really about her MH, truth people sound quite compassionate about her it's about mitigating the effect on OP, who also has every right to enjoy her life in peace.

ChilliAndRiceIsVeryNice · 30/06/2019 13:06

Having mental health issues isn’t an excuse to treat others like shit, Truth. And Penelope is acting terribly towards OP.

TruthOnTrial · 30/06/2019 13:13

It absolutely is about her MH. Pp have been gross about someine whonis evidently suffering.

The original arrangement was ok only if it was going to work well for both. At best sucj an arrangement is a compromise, for hopefully some worthegile mutual benefit.

However, in this instance the compromise is now broken, the arrangement is broken. It doesnt work for one of the parties and is leading to further upset.

So the only way forward is to revert to tye legal standing and step away from the rest, for everyone's sake!

TruthOnTrial · 30/06/2019 13:14

Chilli
No, its certainly not. Also not sure why you say that, as it isnt what ive said. You seem to have inserted your own meaning there.

MzHz · 30/06/2019 13:16

If Penelope is struggling as much as it appears she is, it’s STILL not OP responsibility to just suck it up and let these frankly idiotic demands go.

Penelope’s husband needs to help her see that she won’t achieve anything by sending texts like she has been doing, to point out her irrational behaviour and help her access the help she needs.

Ok it’s actually Penelope’s responsibility to help herself and get herself help, but it looks like she can’t see the wood for the trees atm.

Just because someone else is struggling, doesn’t give them the right to bully others, and this is what she’s doing.

TruthOnTrial · 30/06/2019 13:21

I dont agree that anything gives anyone any right to bully. Think i said this already. But just to reiterate to save further confusion.

The arrangement is broken. Use your own bit of garden.

IvanaPee · 30/06/2019 13:22

I have no idea why people are saying not to fence it off.

Look;

Penelope’s MH issues aren’t her fault. But it’s all well and good Samuel saying it’s not about the garden. What happens when she has another rough patch and this starts again? A fence solves the problem all round. She has her privacy and her own patch of garden, and you have yours.

The shared schedule is utter, utter madness! Seriously, the hassle makes me itch!

She has anxiety but not so much that she’s backwards in coming forwards about stopping you using the garden when it suits her. Hmm

Honestly, for all your sakes, some trellising/fencing is the best way forward.

None of this will ever crop up again with separate gardens! And you can do lovely things with small garden spaces!

cushioncovers · 30/06/2019 13:25

Send Penelope the link for the Right Move website.

bbcessex · 30/06/2019 13:32

OP

As everyone says - fence is the only way to go.

As it stands, if you were to sell, you would currently have to declare the dispute on the sellers pack, which would very likely put off potential buyers.

Fence it, and theirs no dispute to worry about.

PLEASE TELL ME YOU DON'T ALSO SHARE PARKING WITH PENELOPE 😱😱😱😂😂😂

Whosorrynow · 30/06/2019 13:33

I feel sorry for Samuel, I think Penny is actually a tyrant

fedup21 · 30/06/2019 13:58

a long message explaining how upset they are by my use of the garden

Does she not want you to use it at all?!

Pinkyyy · 30/06/2019 14:09

How on earth have 2% of 3550 people said YABU?!

gamerchick · 30/06/2019 14:12

It always seems to say 2% maybe it's not set up for 100

daisyboocantoo · 30/06/2019 14:13

Fence!

Pinkyyy · 30/06/2019 14:14

I've noticed that too @gamerchick I wonder if anyone has pointed it out to HQ

cheekymouse · 30/06/2019 14:28

Tell her to have a valium! And not to intimidate you as it's bullying she is doing

SagAloojah · 30/06/2019 14:58

Maybe someone people got confused between what YABU and YANBU means? And the rest have Penelope type gardens/entitlements.

Lemonlady22 · 30/06/2019 15:00

as you own your flat she has no right to tell you when you can and cant use your garden....put fairy lights up, buy a pet pig if you want and let it live in the garden, she has NO say how you use or notr use your space!

Ithinkmycatisevil · 30/06/2019 15:08

The only thing to do is fence it off and if they have any down stairs windows that look into you garden they should get some stick in privacy film stuff for them. That way everyone can have their privacy and hopefully prevent a really messy fall out, which would be extremely awkward to live with.

OnceFreshFish · 30/06/2019 15:59

I would have no problem or using the garden over her birthday weekend, it's normal in a shared gardenfir people to reserve it for special events. The only way to resolve the rest of it is to divide the garden surely. Since you're not and will never be friends it would be awkward to both use the garden together and you'll get constant agro otherwise.

MzHz · 30/06/2019 17:18

She has anxiety but not so much that she’s backwards in coming forwards about stopping you using the garden when it suits her.

That’s actually a very good point IvanaPee

When I had anxiety there is no way of confront anyone.

Mind you, smart phones, texts and WhatsApp didn’t exist then, it’s MUCH easier to rant behind a screen than to speak to someone face to face.

MzHz · 30/06/2019 17:18

I’d confront not of confront

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