In Law issues... am I being too sensitive?

[Peppergold]

Can you please offer me some advice.

DD is 14 months old and MIL asked to look after her on Saturday. BIL and SIL (DH's brothers wife) live with PIL but we have always made clear that when she's there it is PIL who are caring for her.

So in the morning SIL text me to ask what time we would be dropping DD off. I didn't message back as it's nothing to do with her. We had made arrangements with PIL that we would bring her round after her morning nap. We were then quizzed when we got there as to why I hadn't replied.

We came to pick DD up in the evening and it turned out that BIL and SIL had took DD out with them to meet some friends who have a child a similar age. They had no right to do this and I am really disappointed in PIL for going along with it.

On its own maybe it is childish of me to feel this way but none of them respect me as DD's Mum and SIL is too pushy. She has to involve her self in everything and I can't stand it. If I send MIL a photo of DD SIL tells MIL to forward it to her. I'm regularly told that I need to let SIL be more involved but I don't feel able to do this because I feel smothered.

At Christmas BIL and SIL bought PIL a calendar that had a photo of DD on for each month. Photos of DD with everyone but me! And a mug for MIL with "Grandma" on it surely this is stuff me and DH should buy, not SIL. She is constantly posting stuff about DD and picture online, if we all go out she obsesses over pushing the pram.

SIL interfered in the christening and then got pissed off when I wouldn't involve her in 1st birthday party. MIL and SIL seem to gang up on me yet they regularly talk behind each other's backs.

It just feels like they overstep the mark but no one sees it. So they tell me she's just being friendly etc. I don't know what to do about it, but it's making me feel upset and pushed into a corner.

Sorry it's so long.

Im auntie to lots of neices and nephews. Some by my sisters and others by my husbands sisters.

Iv always been equally careful with all not to overstep any boundaries but my ILs treat me very much as a valued auntie the same as my blood sisters.

I think you SIL is being a tad too full on, but it probably comes from a good place. Can you try to give her some auntie tasks? And maybe invite her to come play with you baby at soft play or babygroup.

At the same time let her know you felt that she overstepped some boundaries but she is a valued member of LOs family and can she please respect your decision when leaving LO in anyones care.

Just to add i do have a child but i was as trusted and included beforehand too

At Christmas BIL and SIL bought PIL a calendar that had a photo of DD on for each month. Photos of DD with everyone but me! And a mug for MIL with "Grandma" on it surely this is stuff me and DH should buy, not SIL.

That is truly batshit. Surely only the parents of the grandchild do that?

I think @Fizzygreenwater is, as usual, correct. A row is needed and sil needs to be told to back the fuck away. This would make me very cross. My cousin had to be very forceful with her sil re putting photos of her child on social media. It was constant and my cousin had decided not to put up pictures ever, her choice, she's the parent.

You're the mum, OP, you get to choose, no-one else.

@Surfskatefamily I did try to let her know she was valued - I only try and keep my distance now because of her past behaviour. She came to visit me and DD in hospital when only a day old. But the more I seemed to give and let her in, the more she pushes. She came to some baby stuff with me, DD and MIL in the early days but she doesn’t ever seem keen when I’m there. Prefers me and DH out the way. It is not to do with the fact she is not mine or DH’s sister - I’ve just kept repeating that as people keep assuming it’s DH’s sister and therefore we know her well. Which we don’t.

@Surfskatefamily It’s also nothing to do with the fact she doesn’t yet have children. My Brother and his wife don’t yet have children but they are happy to spend time altogether and don’t keep wanting to have DD on their own.

@Cherrysoup I don’t like her putting pictures of DD on social media but find it most weird that she puts pictures of DD on there that she hasn’t even taken.

How old is the SIL? She sounds like she wants to portray how involved she is by meeting friends and putting pictures up on social media that she's a great auntie and involved heavily with child life to her friends etc. Maybe due to personal circumstances of not being able to have children yet she feels its filling a gap.

But that's not right or fair on you. She absolutely shouldn't be taking your child out to meet her friends or trying to take over things. She needs to accept this but that's easier said than done for you.

I'm with you OP. I think she sounds a little unhinged and I would be livid someone I didn't know too well was behaving like this. To me it has alarm bells

My SIL is like this. She loves my DS to bits and they have a great relationship that I love watching develop and I feel blessed that my DS has so many people that love him in his life. Your attitude baffles me.

@Peppergold
I don’t like her putting pictures of DD on social media but find it most weird that she puts pictures of DD on there that she hasn’t even taken.

Then tell her to stop! This is YOUR child, she does not get to choose if her image is online! I'm actually really cross for you, but you need to be brave and have a face to face where you tell her she cannot look after your child, nor can she put pictures online. If she persists or gets arsey, get doubly arsey back and stop allowing your dd anywhere near her. She sounds like a total PITA.

Op, a few points that might help hou to be kind to your SIL while you have that conversation or set up boundaries, despite the resentment built up (justifiably) is as follows :

1- it is possible that her not being a mother does have something to do with it. In a sense when we aren’t mothers but desperately want kids, we might feel a sense of void.. and we might not know what it’s like to have a child that we worry about and so she doesn’t know how she is making you feel and how her behavior is taken by you. She might not have the capacity to empathize with a situation she has not experienced for herself as not everyone has a diverse understanding of emotions.

2- some people struggle to process feelings when it comes to why they feel negativity. It happens to the best of us. She might be feeling insecure about her situation with in laws or around friends or whatever and for whatever reason might be threatened by the fact you have the spotlight.. or might be feeling left out as your in laws might be the type who do favorites “golden dil” and don’t have a big enough heart to fit both of you in, while the other dil gets put down. Or maybe that’s all in her head due to difficult past.. whatever it is, she might not realize that her resentment towards you is due to her own insecurities and might be just used to putting others down to make her insecurities go away. Because unlike other people she can’t talk herself out of it and instead needs to protect herself by being aggressive. It’s a coping mechanism some people develop and it becomes unconscious to them. She might not be aware even what she is doing.

3- you say she robbed you of the experience of being a FTM. That’s hurtful. But try take the positive out of this. You have a daughter who needs a mother who knows how to set healthy but kind boundaries in a world that’s ruthless to women at times. She will face this in school and in her life and the stronger you are in dealing with this behavior the better it is for your daughter. Let her be the reason you motivate yourself and that’s a lovely bonding story. Your SIL will have her own struggles and will one day need to address her own behavior. If she continues to be spiteful then I assure you her parenthood won’t be as enjoyable anyway. In the grand scheme of things, just focus on you and the positives for u and protecting yourself and leave her deal with her own struggles.

You have a lovely time ahead with your daughter. This will make you stronger. It will increase your self awareness and awareness of those around u and will help you be the support your daughter needs to navigate through her social interactions. You are the lucky one here. You haven’t missed out, our kids and parenting them teach us a lot about ourselves and this is just the beginning.

Hmm
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Oops sorry toddler got my phone

@Ohrobin She’s 31. I think you’re right but still doesn’t explain why she feels she has to push me out. If she had been enthusiastic but respected the boundaries she’d probably be closer to DD anyway!

@Kanga83 It’s hard to pinpoint one specific thing but the whole situation makes me feel uneasy.

@Onceuponacheesecake Well to me she’s overstepping the boundaries. Neither me nor DH know her very well and she shows no signs of wanting to get to know us.

@Cherrysoup I am going to tell everyone no pictures of DD to go on social media.

@IABUQueen I am taking it all into consideration. But if SIL was desperate to have a baby then they wouldn’t have made the decisions they have, particularly moving back into PIL’s house.

I genuinely appreciate everyone’s comments and the support I’ve been given. It is helping massively, and I’m getting my head straight.

YANBU OP I'm sorry that your experience as a new mother has been tainted by this.
My SIL had the first grandchild on my side (whilst we were going though IVF) would have loved to be more involved but wouldn't have dreamt of being pushy.
Your DH really needs to have a word. Your MIL didn't want to upset your SIL but fine to upset you! I would take a massive step back from your ILs.

I genuinely don't understand the responses you've had criticising your reaction.

Seems clear to me she's trying to appropriate your child while excluding you.

This is undoubtedly inappropriate and unacceptable behaviour.

Why I really struggle with. Possibly to ingratiate herself with the doting grandparents? Which is bad enough but there are possibly more sinister motivations too.

Has she had mc or fertility issues of her own? Is she wanting to ttc but bil doesn't!

I would be very uncomfortable with someone like this caring for my young child.

And while its rare that women are sexually abusive it sadly does happen and unusual behaviour like this would definitely get my hackles up.

"She regularly makes comments that suggest she disapproves of our parenting and blatantly says about some things that we are dealing with it wrong and it’s not what she would do etc."

Wtf! Not her baby not her place to comment! Who the hell does she think she is?!

"People who groom babies don't do things in plain sight" @Jemima232 I'd absolutely love to know what your experience and qualifications on the subject are because you're wrong! That is in fact what many abusers do, hide in plain slight, push boundaries in the presence of adult guardians, gaslight and criticise adult guardians...

And even where women are not active paedophiles and abusers themselves they do enable men who are I'm wondering if the posters dismissing this concern are completely unaware of or have forgotten of the existence of the likes of Myra hindley, rose west, Vanessa George, Marie Black - just in January this year Sophie Elms was jailed for crimes of this nature, an 18 year old nursery nurse.

And we don't really know how much it happens partly because just as with male offenders victims are reluctant to come forward because they're embarrassed or think it was their fault. Or when they do they aren't believed. With female offenders I suspect there's additional issues relating to it not being seen as something that women do, so victims may feel even more so that they wouldn't be believed (and judging from some responses on this thread they wouldn't be far wrong!) plus women are more likely to be trusted with younger pre-verbal children who can't report.

What does mil say behind sil's back?

@lizzielookattheflowers have you even read all op's posts? Op has given a fair few examples of sil not only overstepping personal boundaries but ignoring basic common sense child safeguarding practice! You're right the child is the most important person but sil's behaviour isn't prioritising their wellbeing far from it! In addition you seem to have misunderstood the relationship to the op, child and grandparents. This is not the grandparents daughter but daughter in law, is only related to either the op or the child by marriage and by the sounds of things hasn't been a member of the family at all for long and has made zero effort to get to know op - the opposite in fact has avoided developing that relationship and even seeks to pretend that their relationship and op's place within the family are non existent!

"The calendar wasn't a deliberate slight against you" if that were true why not one single photo inc op?

"are you the SiL?" Wondered the same myself!

I'll be honest. If I were in your position I'd be getting sil alone and telling her in no uncertain terms to back the fuck off! That your child isn't hers and it isn't for her to behave like their parent in any way, certainly not to ignore your (plural inc dh) instructions and directions as to how the child is cared for! That there is to be no more posting photos of your child on SM without checking with you first, no more disappearing to take your child out and about without your knowledge or permission and no more treating you like you're an inconvenience while suffocatingly overdoing it with baby.

People like this depend on others not wanting to cause a falling out or bad atmosphere. Sod that! If anyone's responsible for that it is her!

I've looked after hundreds of people's children, I would never overstep like this, have never posted any child's photo on SM without parents permission (even though I'm hot on privacy settings), taken a child anywhere other than where the parents expected them to be without permission, taken over from another person put in charge of a child excepting emergencies, let alone gone out of my way to (as a pp rightly said literally) cut a parent out of the picture!

SHE is the one that's batshit!

"My bigger question is why don't you want to develop a relationship with her?" Op has said repeatedly that she's tried to include sil socially and get to know her and develop that relationship - it's been the sil that has rejected this at every opportunity!

"She has nephews on her side on the family yet doesn’t seem particularly interested in them" that's potentially concerning. Is she more interested in your child because she's a girl? If so what motivates that? Or have her own siblings also experienced this issue with her and she is no longer welcome to be involved with those children?

"Was MIL really ill?" I'd be wondering that too!

I think your first post comes across as if you are overreacting but subsequent posts have left me unsure

Ultimately though nobody has the right to provide care for your child unless you say so.

I wouldn't trust mil not to go behind your back on this so I would put off childcare for a while and explain why if asked. Also send a group text saying that you don't want anyone posting photos/info about your child on social media. Just basically keep them all at arms length for a bit. In the long run it's most likely that mil will see you mean business and won't want to risk ruining her relationship with your DS so will do as you ask.

Could agree more with @Graphista

I was in a similar position with my SIL and MIL. I have gone very low contact now because I would not tolerate this behavior. They were so overbearing and blurred so many boundaries, it felt almost like parental alienation for my children from me.

If I had been stronger, at the time I would have put a stop to it earlier.

@roseblush Thank you, I think because I’ve obviously been answering people’s questions it has made some of it seem quite raw again. Especially when I think back to when DD was a newborn and all the in laws made me feel very vulnerable and they all only seemed concerned about themselves. I think MIL assumes we will just play nicely and so panders to SIL more especially because they all live together. I hope your IVF went well, and you are happy.

@Graphista Yes, why is she only interested in DD. I think it has got to be so she can show off to PIL. It’s the only thing that makes sense. And I am definitely going to have to talk to her, probably all of them.

Would you like to discuss here what you would say to her?

Just to play out a scenario in your head? It’s a tricky situation and some people look for ways to create misunderstanding. Especially if your SIL and MIL are into drama.

So take control of the situation and don’t let them intimidate you into drama.

@Graphista And thank you for being so supportive and for such an excellent post. One of DH’s cousin has also mentioned that she thinks it is because DD’s a girl that SIL is so invested.

@Sunshine93 I just didn’t want it to be this way, but I have spoken to DH and he agrees that we need to cite contact back quite a lot until the all start to understand how we feel.

@poglets You have it spot on. That’s how I feel. And when you have a group of other people telling you you’re wrong and reading too much into it I started to doubt myself. Because the in laws all agree with each other then I look unreasonable.

@IABUQueen Thank you. I will probably do that if that’s ok. I am currently writing things down so that I can pick out the things I feel I need to say most. DH is also worried that I feel this way and so he will definitely support me.

The other thing is that I am pregnant and currently in bed feeling poorly. Have been all day. And thinking about it all is making me scared it’s going to be like this with DC2 as well.

@Peppergold I don't think you are wrong. My SIL used to be exactly the same. She is DH's actual sister. It led to me never leaving dc with mil because she did not understand that sil was undermining of both me and dh and disregarding anything we said, in respect of our own dc. MIL would go along with SIL and then cry if we called either of them out on it.

Things have actually improved dramatically with a long period of boundaries being in place and stuck to. I have relaxed a lot with MIL again and sil is mostly fine now.

Sorry I haven't RTFT but I just wanted to say I don't think you're unhinged! You're the child's mother. You gave up a day with your child so that MIL could spend time with her and SIL took her off without even telling you. I would be raging and I wouldn't be sending her back!

Hmmm - I suspect that if it was dh’s sister’s husband then this thread would go a different way.

You’d still be vilified Op - but for not phoning the police, social services and possibly the navy on “grooming BIL” 47 seconds after the thread began.

I have a lovely - but very overwhelming - SIL whose boundaries are very different to mine. (She is an extreme on the extravert scale whilst dh and I are both introverts.)

We live over 100 miles from dh’s family.

We have often talked about moving closer - particularly when the kids were small and we were both exhausted. Roughly 7 seconds after the removal van turned up SIL would be there with a casserole and a gang of friends to help us unpack. And it would be lovely. And easy. And never again would we have to argue about who was most exhausted / stagger through the day on 2 hours sleep / work out who would take the day off work with ill child. SIL would sort it all for us!

But we also wouldn’t be in charge of our own lives. We would be absorbed into theirs.

So we made the decision to stay away and visit sometimes and accept the exhaustion but keep control.

Is moving an option for you?

@Peppergold congrats on your pregnancy. I guess you and DH need to set boundaries, maybe have him talk to his brother and make him see SIL needs to take a step back. Also you need to nip the pictures on social media in the bud if possible