Who was being unreasonable - vegetarian or host?

[neverendingflorist]

Going to try and keep this as short as possible.

Person A invited a group of people over for dinner, including person B who is a vegetarian. A didn't know B was a vegetarian at the time, but B let A know when accepting the invite. A said this was fine. A made lasagna for everyone for dinner, subbing the meat out for roasted veggies for B to make a separate dish. When dinner came round A explained to B what she had made for her and explained what it contained including parmesan cheese. B said sorry, she could not eat it as parmesan is not vegetarian. A said B should have really told her she could not eat parmesan as A thought vegetarians could eat cheese and wouldn't be expected to know these things as she hasn't cooked for vegetarians before. B said lots of things are not vegetarian that aren't just meat/fish and it would take forever to make a list of all things including which cheeses she could/couldn't eat. A thinks B has been very rude and B thinks A has been a poor host.

So who was being unreasonable? I am aware this is pretty much a non-event and should not have escalated in to a big disagreement, but I am interested on general opinions.

I'm a vegetarian and couldn't have brought myself to eat it, but would have been polite and apologised for not saying what I will and won't eat

However, if I was cooking for someone with specific dietary needs then I probably would have spoken to them before I made it to check the ingredients were ok

A was unreasonable. They should have checked the ingredients before cooking/preparing it.

B probably eats vegetarian cheese.

Not worth falling out over but definately wouldn't expect B to eat it just to be polite!

It's all very well saying A should have checked the packet but if you don't know anything about cheese it simply wouldn't occur to to you that a dairy product wouldn't be vegetarian, especially when cheese is a well known veggie staple. It doesn't help that you still see a lot of pub/restaurant menus using parmesan in their "vegetarian" dishes.

For info some of the supermarket parmesan-style hard cheeses (e.g. sainsbury's basics) are vegetarian.

Im failing to see where either A or B were very rude

Does B realise that cows have to be pregnant to produce milk and therefore the male 50% of the calves born have to be slaughtered? I think dairy eating vegetarians need to have a think about the dairy industry anyway

I would say that most vegetarians are aware of the horrors of the dairy industry, yes. I don't think that should preclude them from being vegetarian.

I should have mentioned the rennet in my post. A true vegetarian won't eat anything which has meant the animal has had to die to get it. Some cheeses, including parmesan, contain rennet which comes from the stomach of animals, meaning the animal has had to die to get it. Other cheeses, like your standard cheddar, do not contain rennet so are suitable for vegetarians, however are not suitable for vegans as they contain milk which is from an animal, but the animal has not had to have been killed to get it.

This is also true for things containing geletine which is from collagen of animals. In alcohol 'fining' process they also sometimes use geletine, blood, bone marrow or fish bladder.

B is definitely just vegetarian and not vegan.

I wouldn't have eaten it to be pilot when I was vegetarian. I'm vegan now so hopefully no one would try and serve me it.

I would be very apologetic about it though and wouldn't blame my host for not knowing.

B should have made that clear as lots of people have no idea that cheese might contain animal byproducts.

DH is strict vegetarian and he doesn't have parmesan at home (we have a veggie version) - if he's in a restaurant he won't have parmesan but in this instance he would just eat it.

I didn’t know Parmesan wasn’t vegetarian and I used to be vegetarian. I think B should have been more specific that she doesn’t eat meat or anything containing animal products. This might have prompted A to look more closely at ingredients. I can understand B not eating the meal but I feel sorry for A in this situation. It’s a headache enough catering for people. It’s not unreasonable for a non-veggie to have assumed that vegetarian = no meat.

I’m always fascinated by the Mumsnet attitude to vegetarians. It’s one of those topics where the mild mannered leftie persona splits its shirt and reveals the Daily Mail attitudes underneath.

@MagicKingdomDizzy - Vegetarians don't eat meat. If B doesn't eat cheese then she should have made that clear. Most people would expect vegetarians to eat cheese.

There's nothing in the op to suggest B doesn't eat cheese, just that they don't eat cheese that isn't vegetarian.

I'm a vegetarian and I wouldn't expect a non-vegetarian to know that some cheeses contain animal rennet. In this instance, I would have been polite and eaten the lasagne. However, as a host catering for a dietary requirement that I don't normally deal with, I would have asked the guest if what I intended cooking was appropriate.

In conclusion, B was rude, A was a slightly poor host. On balance though, I would say B comes across as the more poorly behaved person.

A vegetarian friend was tucking into a Muller yoghurt and I said 'That's got gelatine in it, car you eat it?' and she had no idea.

The thing is, she can eat what the heck she likes but has chosen to follow a vegetarian diet. She doesn’t need people asking her if she can eat XYZ anymore than dieters need people asking if they are “allowed” certain things.

@seatoski, doesn't cheddar normally contain rennet too?!

OP, I think A should have been mortified and apologetic (I would have been). I'm also surprised at the number of people who wouldn't expect people to know cheeses are often set with rennet.

But I also think B could have been more gracious, rather than cross.

Sounds as if both sides were a bit brusque with each other.

It seems strange that A specifically mentioned parmesan though?

A put parmesan on the table to put on top, but explained there was already some in the sauce. She didn't deliberately put parmesan in knowing B couldn't eat it.

DD is a vegetarian and certainly wouldn't eat anything containing parmesan. I've always told her this might throw the odd person, so be prepared to say you'll have an omelette, sandwich and even help with it.

B is being unreasonable, if someone is the kind of vegetarian that is that strict then it is easier to say that you are vegan because as a vegetarian it is easy to see how some things might be a grey area. A tried her best. B is a dick

I did not know that about parmesan. But in this scenario, if I were A, I would be unlikely to invite B again. Win win.

Imagine this Mumsnet post: AIBU? I just invited Friend round to a dinner party. She told me she is veggie - fine - but then she started in with a list of stuff that's not vegetarian - parmesan, marshmallows, gelatine, some wines... it just went on! AIBU to think she's being overly precious and frankly irritating?

I've been veggie for 20+ years and found this out just now!

If someone made me something I knew wasn't veggie I probably wouldn't eat it but be v apologetic. "I'm so sorry I can't eat that. I should have said. You weren't to know. I'll be fine with just the garlic bread honestly" etc etc

In conclusion, B was rude

Really? I mean, OP only said that

B said sorry, she could not eat it as parmesan is not vegetarian

Which is not too rude, is it? I'm sure OP is paraphrasing, but what else can B do if they're not comfortable eating it? From what we know she was apologetic... there's no easy solution to the situation.

What did B do that was rude?

I think in this case it was a misunderstanding and lack of communication on both sides.

I do find it slightly hypocritical that Parmesan is where they draw the line considering what happens to cows, their babies and hens for the cheese and eggs vegetarians eat!

Seems odd for them to fixate on one thing when other things they eat cause just as much harm!

I had no idea parmesan wasn't vegetarian. Person a tried but it was a mistake. I think they both need to learn from it and move on. I think not eating it in itself isnt rude but the comments on here suggest a lot of people didn't realise it wasn't vegetarian so it depends how they said they wouldn't eat it. Person a should apologise for genuine mistake and learn from it for next time, person b should apologise if they were rude about it (did they make out like everyone knows it isnt vegetarian?)

If it wasn't a rude exchange neither are being unreasonable but if pushed to rank them I'd say A was more U.
I've been vegetarian for years and the cheese thing isn't something that popped up yesterday - I remember about 25 years ago there being a fair amount about cheese in the press because of the rennet because lots of people had given up veal but didn't realise where the rennet comes from (same animal).

It has never been easier to cater for a vegetarian. If I'm hosting someone I usually run the menu by them if i think there may be an issue and either adjust or make them something similar but that fits to their dietry requirements. If Hosting a vegetarian now I'd just go for the ultra safe option and offer them something vegan.

A was careless. If you’re cooking for someone who says they’re vegetarian you assume they are a proper vegetarian unless informed otherwise. Just look for the green V or ‘suitable for vegetarians’ label.