To think men shouldn’t come to a breastfeeding support group?

[Sexnotgender]

It’s a group SOLELY for breastfeeding support.

I know I’m probably being a grump but a man there totally changes the dynamic.

Baby was 5 months old so not a newborn with an overwhelmed mum which I would kind of understand.

Dons tin hat...

Dungeon - at the risk of repeating myself for perhaps the 7th or 8th time, I asked for 1-2-1 consultations and was told that they weren't offered, just the group. I'm really not sure what's so difficult to understand. They didn't need to make reasonable adjustments because my carer was with me and everyone was happy with that. I'm not sure if you have any experience with living very rurally, but there aren't many services on offer. That was the service.

How did you or they know that "everyone was happy" with your carer being there before you even attended the group. I have lived in a rural area. Perhaps not as rural as where you live though. I would be interested to know where they don't have to comply with the equality act or consider the fact that most women aren't happy to be undressed in front of strange men.

😂 How presumptuous.

It didn't apply to me, and I'm talking about my own experiences. There were no women from ethic minorities in my group, and if there were, then they would have had to come up with something, but there weren't, so they didn't.

I didn't run the breastfeeding group, it wasn't down to me what was on offer. I simply went and did as they said.

The ethnic minority population in my village is something like 0.01% or was at the time I moved there. If something doesn't apply to my personal situation that I am talking about, which is in the past and has already happened, there is no need for me to mention it.

When, not before, Dungeon. When.

They were presumably asked if they minded a man being there as a carer. I'm not sure what they would have done had someone refused, as again, I was told when I asked that they didn't offer 1-2-1 support/areas.

It didn't happen though, so I can't possibly guess.

Again, the attitudes to disabled women on Mumsnet are aggressive and shocking. I really hope I don't come across any of the particularly nasty ones in real life, like the poster above who seems to be under the impression I can do "whatever the fuck" I want. How shit, to think like that about someone who can't do "anything the fuck" that they want. It must be really horrible to be that type of person.

I completely disagree. Everyone should "win".

How? You keep claiming the only possible thing to do was have your husband in the breastfeeding group. A lot of women lost there, whether you admit it or not. You seem absolutely fine with that.

Deflector the thing is that whoever said that it was fine for your DH to go to the group did not think for a second about the other women using the group, and they should have. Women are socialised to just put up with shit so of course no-one said anything. After all, who is going to say to a disabled woman who can't hold their own baby: 'your husband's presence is making me feel really uncomfortable and I'd prefer it if he left'? They're not, so they're just going to have to suck it up.

This is not your fault, nor your DH's. But whoever made that arrangement failed the other women using the group. It would be great if you could at least acknowledge that.

Again, the attitudes to disabled women on Mumsnet are aggressive and shocking

No, they aren't. I'm disabled, and so is at least one other women who disagreed with you. I can see where you got your username, trying to shut people down by saying they are anti-disabled.

It wouldn’t bother me at all as I plan to breastfeed publicly if the need arises and so I’ll be feeding in front of plenty of strangers, male and female.

Well bully for you.

My baby is 12 weeks and I do feed publicly. I’ve fed in a car showroom whilst buying a car (the salesman didn’t give a shit as was desperate for a sale!), Doctors, car show, cafes, restaurants, when he was smaller I fed whilst walking and walking the dog.

But 1 - not everyone wants to do that and not everyone finds feeding easy and

2 - this all takes practice. My baby sometimes pulls a Muslim off in protest. Plus getting your boob out undercover isn’t a skill you are gifted when the baby comes out the birth canal!

3 - not all babies take to feeding. Some babies need a bit of help and it takes a lot of work to get a good latch and technique! This takes practice, and that faff can’t happen undercover!

*sorry muslin, auto correct!

The other women were presumably asked.

Do any of you actually exist in communities where people are really supportive and there is a real sense of belonging? Where people help those who suffer, or have difficulties? Is it really that hard to understand that about five other women were very positive about my DH being at the group as a
carer?

I don't think its appropriate however my partner was very supportivevand we had a couple of very useful 1-2-1 sessions where he was able to ask about supporting me etc. Would be nice if there was more of this plus pre birth info for couples as a lot of women will fail to breastfeed if their partner isnt supportive.

But do you really think women should be accepting that if they desperately need help breastfeeding in early days they have to be willingly to accept a strange man or men in a breastfeeding support group.

@Ghanagirl Im not in the business of telling other women how to think / feel. I can only tell you that I think supporting new parents together is a good thing and including men and same sex partners in parenting activities is a good thing. I have also said elsewhere in this thread that there are aspects of breastfeeding support that have been described here that I would be uncomfortable receiving in front of any group of people - even women and by the sounds of it many breastfeeding support groups need to think about how they deliver that hands on physical support in a better way.

s it really that hard to understand that about five other women were very positive about my DH being at the group as a
carer?

I find it much easier to believe that several of them were uncomfortable but, as women are conditioned to do, kept quiet.

TheDeflector

I understand you were in a difficult situation and as someone who advocates BFing I admire your strength and determination to feed despite your obvious difficulties.

But you are refusing to engage with any other POV. Can you even admit that it’s not necessarily ideal for your husband to have been there?

You don’t know that nobody else had a problem.

You don’t know about the women who perhaps didn’t attend because they knew a man might be there.

So don’t assume you have all bases covered and this was a perfect one fits all solution. It wasn’t.

No, I find it hilarious that you presume such nasty things about me when you have no clue what I am like in real life.

You have absolutely no idea what the backgrounds of all of the other women were

Yes I do, actually, as we all communicated with each other and I am still in contact with three of the five. And they kept returning, so I also know that. Next?

You've repeatedly ignored, mocked, laughed at, trivialised and insulted the needs of women from Minority Ethnic communities (I don't give a fuck how pure white your own little village is, this is a general discussion) as well as survivors of sexual assault

No I haven't, because I refuse to get involved in accusations that I am somehow racially excluding anyone. I haven't made any comments whatsoever other than ask why people are bringing skin colour and race into it. As for laughing and mocking ethnic minorities - you must be reading somthing else. And I am a victim of CSA so you're wrong on that count too.

I'm bowing out of this thread now. If I'm going to be accused of mocking ethnic minorities when I've done nothing of the sort, simply for sharing my own experience, then there is something wrong with the people on this thread. Absolutely vile.

The other women were presumably asked.

Really? Nobody asked yesterday if we were ok with a bloke there.

I think @TheDeflector's situation was unusual. I definitely wouldn't mind if the man is there in an actual caring capacity and I expect that would be the same for most others, it's not the same as any and every DH turning up. It's a good point that there should have been other 1-2-1 options because there could be women who are uncomfortable; that isn't @TheDeflector's fault though it's an issue with underfunded services, so it's clearly not helpful for people to be nasty when she got support in the only way she could.

I don't think other female "helpers" should go along either in general, or would give a completely different vibe. I don't recall ever seeing a single helper at any sessions I went to though, so I don't think it's common.

TheDeflector

I am also a survivor of CSA.

Nobody who attends the breastfeeding groups know this, because I wouldn’t dream of bloody telling them.

Deflector there are questions to which the answer 'no' is pretty impossible. Once the question has been asked the die has been cast.

I do live in a supportive community, very much so. But I've also had experience of a man's presence changing things. A friend set up in her home a pilates class for a group of women. Her DH wanted to join, she asked us if we minded, the first woman responded 'oh no, that's fine, we don't mind' and the die was cast. I backed out of the group, making an excuse as I didn't want to exercise with her DH, who I don't know that well, and I know another woman wasn't exactly happy but didn't want to appear rude so she went.

The woman who set the group up has no idea that at least 2 of us didn't want her DH there.

I bf all my kids anywhere and everywhere so was happy to bf infront of anyone, how ever these Bf support groups are focused on your breasts. Bf in public is just not the same.

CassianAndor
Gosh some people have no clue.

What have ethnic minorities got to do with it?

White women have as much right to privacy as any ethinc woman. Are white women all tarts that don't care which random bloke see their boobs?

EdtheBear
yes exactly every WOMEN has the right to receive breastfeeding support in the privacy of a female only space.

I think Deflector is getting a hard time here. It isn't her fault that whoever was running her group clearly wasn't complying with the EA either in respect of disability or sex.

She deserved to get the same level of care and support as any other woman and it was up to the people running the service to provide it. Clearly the way that they went about it was wrong but it wasn't deflectors fault.

GreytExpectations I know, I know I've been around here for a very long time, and as I typed it I knew that that's never going to happen here!