About SIL and BIL asking PIL to look after their children for 6 weeks?

[Beachcomber]

I'll try to keep this short.

For complex reasons, basically related to SIL and BIL making unwise choices, they have asked my PIL to look after their 2 DC for 6 weeks this summer. Neither SIL nor BIL will be present at all during the 6 weeks. This is not just day care it is full time care. DC2 will be 6 months old and DC1 nearly 3 yo.

SIL will be at one end of the country working and BIL at the other end with PIL and DC in the middle.

PIL are in good health but they are both nearly 70 and although they have said yes because they want to help they are both stressed out about the whole thing (unsurprisingly). They had DC1 for nearly a month last year and MIL, in particular, was exhausted for a while afterwards. Both DC are in nappies and they both wake up at night.

I think SIL and BIL are being unreasonable by asking this of them but the main reason I'm ready to stick my nose in is because PIL have asked if we (DH, me and DC13 yo and DC15 yo) will help out.

We have said that we will do what we can but we have visitors for a total of 3 out of the 6 weeks and are away on holiday for 2 weeks. When we are not on holiday we will be working. DC obviously will be on holiday but the visitors are their family from another country that they only see a couple of times a year.

MIL was upset (not with us but stressed) when we explained that of course we would help but we had other priorities.

I think DH or I should make a phone call to SIL and BIL and ask them if they realize quite what they are asking and how stressed PIL are and ask them to consider breaking up the 6 weeks in some way.

I think they have got a bloody cheek and I'm concerned about the DC. PIL are lovely and very responsible but 6 weeks is far too long IMO for such young children to be away from home and their parents.

Should we leave well alone or say something?

rookiemere, you are so right. My CHILDREN are on BIL's list of people who should look after his children because they have vaginas!!

CrumpetyTea, I agree it would be best in a way if PIL could stay in BIL's parent's house with SIL and the children.

But PIL don't want to. It's 5 hours away from their own house and they have things to do during the 6 weeks. They also have pets and a garden to look after. They would like to see my family who are coming to visit. They care for an elderly relative here. They have lives. And why should they have to move out of their own home for all of the summer and stay somewhere they have no friends or life... I think that would be even more stressful for them.

NewAccount270219, I agree that PIL have been gaslighted into thinking this is somehow acceptable due to constant demands for assistance.

I kind of wish that PIL would stop being so incredibly helpful as I feel they are enabling and it isn't helping in the long run. That's not my business though.

The DC are not in danger of being removed from their parents IMO. They are very messy and disorganized in their home and they make bad choices but there are no drug or alcohol problems and the children are fed and looked after (just quite a lot by their grandparents).

That’s awful. They should at least use some of that saved money to pay for a childminder local to PIL during the six weeks.

But they could have said no if they couldn’t manage it, it’s your pils fault for agreeing to it.

As for sending their kids off for 6 weeks, I was chatting to a good friend last night about what she’ll do with her children over summer, they are 3 and 1. She’s sending them away to her sisters and then her husband’s brothers for a total of 4 weeks. They live 3 or 4 hours from each of them (opposite directions). They earn a lot and could afford to pay for someone to look after them where they live but they don’t want to spend the money. The other 2 weeks they’ll be having the brothers/sisters children at their house as the other 2 couples are doing the exact same thing, sending their children who are all between 6 months and 3 away for the 4 weeks. They all earn over 100k, one couple it’s closer to 300! I wouldn’t do it personally but people do do this to cover summer holiday childcare.

The only issue with your pils is that they’ve agreed to do it when they really don’t want to. If you don’t want to or can’t help just say no, it’s not your problem.

You certainly need to put your foot down re your daughters. It's one thing if you're going to do some helping, but the children will be having a needed break from school and exams over summer, and the benefit of that should go to them not idiot relatives.

They need to pay for some childcare to give PIL's a break - you could suggest this to PIL's? If they could be dropped at a nursery for a few days a week or similar it would be easier for them

Sorry missed the updates about the money situation, agree they were crazy to agree to this

I have more sympathy for your PILs than the last few posters - if your DD is telling you that they're desperate, have no other option, have all these money/job woes then I can see why it's very hard to say no.

I'm not sure how realistic it is to think they'll find a nursery place for them for six weeks, presumably now on short-ish notice. It wouldn't be at all easy where I live, but I know OP isn't in the UK. It would of course be possible to sort something out if money were no object - but it doesn't seem like that's the attitude SIL and BIL are going to take...

In any case, the moment to say something if you're going to is NOW. If you leave it until there really is no alternative - no time for SIL to give in her notice or apply for unpaid leave, no time to book any childcare - then don't say anything at all.

As for sending their kids off for 6 weeks, I was chatting to a good friend last night about what she’ll do with her children over summer, they are 3 and 1. She’s sending them away to her sisters and then her husband’s brothers for a total of 4 weeks. They live 3 or 4 hours from each of them (opposite directions). They earn a lot and could afford to pay for someone to look after them where they live but they don’t want to spend the money. The other 2 weeks they’ll be having the brothers/sisters children at their house as the other 2 couples are doing the exact same thing, sending their children who are all between 6 months and 3 away for the 4 weeks. They all earn over 100k, one couple it’s closer to 300! I wouldn’t do it personally but people do do this to cover summer holiday childcare.

This is a sidenote from this thread, where it's very clear why the need only arises in the summer (PIL going away) but I don't understand why all these children who are too young for school have childcare arrangements that don't run in the summer? My baby DS goes to the childminder in term-time only, but that's because DH is a teacher and so home in the holidays - it would never have occurred to me to consider an arrangement that didn't run over the summer otherwise and I don't understand why anyone here has done this?

newaccount I think that's a bit short-sighted, in some areas people have to take whatever childcare they can get, particularly if they want to claim full 30 hours. I use two nurseries - the school run nursery allows 30h but closes out of term time, the private nursery will only do 15 but is open throughout holidays.

Also it's all well & good if you can afford to cover the holiday fees too which are not covered by free hours.

I appreciate that this isn't the case here as it's not UK, but it's not always as simple as 'get a full time nursery'.

I can understand it if you're reliant on the free hours (personally I think it's madness to base your entire life around a government policy that could change, but lots of people seem to) or using a school nursery but the pp specifically said that the children were between 6 months and 3 so at least some of them can't be getting any free hours and are too young for a school nursery so I just can't see why their parents would ever have chosen childcare that left them with this problem in the holidays.

OP,
First off, protect your children.

Do not allow them to provide any sort of childcare. They are too young. You would be complicit if anything happened.

Make it absolutely clear to PIL that you are not available.

Consider contacting SS.

IMO the children are being abandoned by their parents.

Two 70's are not capable of looking after two very small children 24/7.

It is too much.

If anything goes wrong, again IMO you and your husband are complicit in this arrangement.

Step away.

What if either of these elderly, stressed people had a health crisis while trying to look after these tiny children.

This is not a school holiday problem.

It's a going back after maternity leave without having planned child care plus having moved to the other end of the country to where SIL's job is. Before going on maternity leave, her DC1 went to her company creche. She became pregnant with DC2 at the same time as they decided to move to the other end of the country. If they had stayed where they were the 2 DC would go to her company creche.

They moved during her maternity leave and were banking on her being made redundant. They don't have child care with her job anymore because they hoped she wouldn't be there anymore and anyway she would have to commute 1h30 each way on public transport with the 2 DC if they did have places.

The situation is a culmination of bad choices. Basically they moved away from where SIL's job is because property is so expensive there and they could not afford to live there and pay for their children. They should never have moved there in the first place because it was obvious from the beginning that they would have to leave.

I really feel for my PIL. I don't think they have been left with much choice. SIL and BIL will be pressuring them with tales of how impossible their situation is (which it is but that is totally their own doing).
I know PIL worry about SIL because BIL isn't terribly nice and is frankly very odd. They won't want to make her life even harder by not helping her. She should never have married and had children with him but it's done now so all PIL can do is continue to assist them or leave them in the shit.

I like to think that if they were my kids I would tell them to sort themselves out and stop coming to me but the reality isn't so simple especially when there are children involved.

Why can’t Sil take them both with her and put them in the company crèche?

billy1966, I agree with everything you say.

I'm worried that MIL will be ill with exhaustion. And that is without anything unexpected happening health wise to either PIL. Last year they had just 1 DC for less than a month and they were done in. I cannot imagine them managing a baby as well without it being a huge strain. I'm so angry with SIL and BIL for being so selfish and stupid as to think that what they are asking is in anyway OK. I think PIL are crazy for saying yes but I understand why they have.

We are definitely going to make it very clear to all concerned that they can take us out of the equation. We will only be available to babysit for literally a couple of afternoons anyway. And yes, I will totally protect my children from being involved in anyway in actual childcare.

I too feel these children are being abandoned by their parents for the summer. DC1 showed some quite tricky behavior last year because he was obviously distressed at being away from his home and parents. PIL looked after him because SIL had a difficult pregnancy. But the fact is that if BIL was a supportive and normal partner, they would have managed (the way everyone else does!)

I'm back to a place where I think DH should call his sister and ask her if she has considered PIL at all and if she has a clue what a huge thing she is asking and what she and BIL plan on doing to support PIL as much as possible. 😠

Alsohuman. She has a complicated and long commute that involves a walk, a couple of buses and a subway (and then more walking) that she has managed in the past with 1DC but with 2 I think is not realistic.

Also she never applied for a place for DC2 as she planned on leaving the company. They gave up DC1's place when she went on maternity leave.

And to be entirely honest, I don't think she would cope on her own with the two of them. Her MIL is looking after them at the moment but SIL is staying with them. Her PIL are going away for 6 weeks over the summer - hence the recent request for my PIL to take responsibility for the DC.

I imagine if my SIL's PIL were not going away they would have continued to do the child care with SIL staying with them and BIL on his todd at the other end of the country with his feet up.

Beachcomber from what you've outlined here it certainly sounds like there has been a series of poor decisions somewhat enabled by well meaning family BUT (and I mean this in the nicest possible way) you NEED to step back!

Look at your posts here on this thread. You know all the ins and outs of their lives, all the things they could have done, everything they didn't do, their reasons for doing this thing instead of that thing and so on and so on and the reason you know all of this about two grown adults who live hours away is because you've been sucked into it. You've got to a point where you're living this with them and expending the kind of mental energy people usually reserve for their own circumstances and choices!

I've been there. I know how difficult it is especially when you're the sounding board for your PILs worries and concerns (in my case my parents) but you cannot change them. There's nothing you can do to make them more responsible or more considerate or to parent as you would.

The ONLY thing you can control here is how much you're prepared to do. The best thing I ever did was put firm boundaries in place both with the sibling who constantly made crap choices and with my parents who were so used to bailing them out and pulling the rest of us into it it became normalised and expected. It's not easy but I've managed to get to a point where I feel able to think "that's unfortunate but it's not my decision/problem/responsibility". It's perfectly ok to do that and in fact DB and sil did step up (somewhat ) when those of us who had unintentionally enabled them for years actually stepped back and left them to get on with it.

I really feel for you Beachcomber. Unless this is dealt with now it is clear that this is going to be an on-going problem where it will become the norm that PIL are expected by BIL to step up. If you also step up at all it's then all ok because the pressure is slightly off PIL. At some point something will give, worst case scenario is that MIL becomes overwhelmed or ill or makes a mistake under all the pressure and something happens to the children.

Whilst it is a difficult situation in my view this needs to be dealt with now. Your PIL sound lovely but unfortunately are enabling their behaviour. I think you DH needs to have a frank conversation with them, explaining that they are enabling as they probably won't understand this. Once you have explained that for this reason and your own commitments you will not be helping out, they may have a light bulb moment. Your PIL need to deal with this with your DH backing them up.

I feel for the grandparents but they really need to be the ones to say somebting. You can put your foot down and say you can’t help much if at all really and certainly make it known your daughters should not be expected to help either. But I don’t think saying anything to the parents themselves is a good idea. They didn’t come to you asking for the help they went to the grandparents. I’d mention to the grandparents about taking back their offer although it’s a little bit shit to do given they already said they would help however, if they are worried now and they haven’t even started looking after the kids they really should say no soon or at least cut down the weeks and the kids parents really should use some of that money for childcare in some way, even if it’s at least during the day so the grandparents only have nights time to deal with. Even that seems awfully tiring for six weeks.

Poor pil.

Could you suggest they hire an au pair or something to help?

PIL as grown adults absolutely do have a choice. I would step right back from this dysfunctional scenario and unlike PIL choose not get involved, as I strongly suspect this is what SIL/BIL will expect going forward. Whether they can cope with their own DC is not your problem and being family doesn't make it so. God forbid a third child ever comes along because 'they' can manage two.
FWIW this really isn't in the best interests of the DC. My elderly PIL once over -committed to having four young boys for one day when they probably couldn't cope, and while they sat with a flask in the car, my seven year old nephew fell unattended off a rope swing and broke both his wrists (+ other incidents). The whole set up has disaster written over it, but if PIL are too weak to speak up they'll live their life as a consequence of their choices.

This thread makes me so sad for the children

Don't show pil your calendar or they'll be desperately looking for gaps where you can dash back to offer support.
Explain all the things you and your children have on and say we can come round on x afternoon for a few hours.
Sadly they shouldn't have taken this on, and they can't pass it on to you, they'll have to suck it up or refuse because she's had a health scare...

ImNotHappyaboutitPauline, you are so right. Your advice is good.

I need to step back. I didn't realize until I posted this thread quite how much I know about the ins and outs of these people's messy life.

I'm concerned for the DC and for my PIL (and my SIL actually) . But there isn't much I can usefully do.

Hi OP. Do your PILs actually know that your SIL/BIL have this 40K cash available to them? Maybe if they know that might help alter how they see both the requests for help from their DD/Son in Law?

I'm assuming that your PILs have not been offered any financial assistance in looking after their DGCs for six weeks - not that that, in itself, will help in the physical and mental struggle they (mainly your MIL) will have in parenting their daughter's very young children as well as their other commitments.
They have fairly active lives and have volunteer commitments and do a lot to care for an elderly relative

Your PILs sound very loving, caring and responsible people but their knee jerk reaction to their irresponsible DD and son in law's request has done nobody any favours.

Your decision to stay clear of this mess as far as possible (and protecting your own children) is the right one. Hopefully your husband can make his parents see they need to step back for the sake of their own health and enable their DD/SIL to make more sensible arrangements.

As another PP said upthread, if your PILs accept this situation now (even with how hard it will be) the requests will just keep coming - and that's really not fair either for these two very young children or their sibling if/when their daughter gets pregnant again.

Hope a resolution can be found OP. Stay strong! 🌹

It's actually very hard to refuse help when you know that kind people, who are trying to do the right thing, desperately need it. So in all honesty I think you will get drawn in because it will be so hard not to if your ILs struggle. I think I'd encourage them to buy in some help for the summer since bil is going to be useless and sil sounds like she really is stuck at this point. A cleaner, au pair or mother's help (do they still exist?) Would take some of the pressure off. Encourage them to get shopping delivered, and talk to them about their expectations of being able to do their usual things with a toddler and baby in tow. There are things they can do to make it easier though - pre made baby milk, for example rather than making up bottles all the time, batch cook and freeze food before the kids get there, investigate any local baby and toddler groups.
I'm glad you are keeping your children away from this - they shouldn't be exposed to the idea that being a woman = being lumbered with other people's kids because their father is a sexist pig.
I do think that someone needs to talk to sil about her long term plans because they cannot lurch from one bad choice to another constantly. At some point the ILs really will be too old to help out.