Would you judge me?

[clairemcnam]

I hold my knife like a pen. I did not even think about this until MN. Would you judge me for this if you met me?

"Yeah. I hate it. It looks wrong and I have no idea how PP say they don’t notice. It sticks out a mile.

This.

In my entire life I have never had the time nor the inclination to look around at fellow diners and judge how they are holding their knives. What a ridiculous concept.

And as for the PP who reckons I am am bad mannered by how I hold my knife, I have no idea how this can be construed as manners - it doesn't impact on anybody.

While we're at it - both my right handed DCs - now in their twenties - hold their fork in their right hand and knife in their left. What a bad-mannered pair of savages I have dragged up [grin grin grin]

Of course it isn't bad manners to hold your knife life a pen.

But it isn't considered the correct way to hold a knife and I suspect that the reason for that is that it makes using a knife less efficient and comfortable than it would be if you were holding it the correct way.

It's not just the British that have these sort of ideas with eating utensils, there's a correct way to hold chopsticks for instance. If you hold them correctly it's much easier to eat with them.

Ooh I hold my pen weird (not left handed) so I would be interested and strike up a conversation!

I probably would, because everyone I have seen who holds their knife like a pen can’t cut properly. They kind of tear at their food and it makes me feel a bit sick.

It looks awkward to me and I have noticed that people who hold their knife like a pen seem to have more difficulty in using it with ease.

However, I wouldn't judge you unless you also held your fork upright and perpendicular to the plate, grasped in your fist and tore your food apart with it while your knife anchored the food to your plate.

Yes, I've seen this on several occasions. It's at least partly due to the fact that the person's knife technique is less than efficient.
But it looks daft.

Sometimes, I imagine what it would be like to live in a world like the mumsnet community. Do these people really exist? Some people are so bizarre. I can't understand why anyone would get offended by the way someone else holds their cutlery, as long as they're not threatening someone with it. I'm very amused by the poster who would get offended because it is bad manner but didn't know why it was bad manners.

I cannot bear people who hold their cutlery incorrectly. It IS bad manners if you were brought up correctly to observe etiquette. When I met my DH, he used to hold his cutlery in the right way - now he holds his knife like a pen - drives me completely batty - and I don't know why he has reverted!

Yes, I would notice. No, of course I would not say anything. My stepson holds his knife that way, and I do find it unattractive, but as that is how they eat in his other house it’s not my place to correct it.

I might notice, but certainly wouldn’t judge. I might think you have arthritis or something. My mum has arthritis and sometimes has to hold her knife this way.

I wouldn't judge. I'd just think you had a working class background, as everyone I know with that background does the same. I don't think people care as much about etiquette & manners these days. I live in the South now and saying please & thank you in shops or at work gets me surprised looks & comments daily. ( thinking about it, I never hear them day to day any more).

It looks childish.

I wouldn't judge as do the same. I'm left handed, hold my knife in right hand. For the PP who asked about cutting veg - I hold the knife in my left hand to do that and hold it "normally"

Not at all. I used mines in the wrong hands and I find it ridiculous when people try to correct me. How it makes a bit of difference to anyone else how I use cutlery is beyond me!

I'd just think you had a working class background, as everyone I know with that background does the same. I don't think people care as much about etiquette & manners these days. I live in the South now and saying please & thank you in shops or at work gets me surprise
Etiquette is important in many circles, manners is important in all circles.
I always say please and thank you, most people respond.
I hate when I thank a customer in work, some refuse to acknowledge it on the call, you might get "yes ok huhum"
I may get flamed it is usually new money customers, I can tell the difference from those with genuine class, how they respond.
Manners are free.

I’ve never seen it held like a pen before seeing that picture. How do you cut? There’s no pressure behind the knife?

No.
My parents didn't really teach me table manners

I remember the huge embarrassment, aged 20, of an older colleague 'walking me through' how to use my cutlery before a Co event :(

Thus I vowed that any children I might have would not suffer that as I would teach them properly. Both are Dyspraxic & ASD so my best efforts have come to nought - they are FAR worse than I was and will chew and speak with their mouths open still, aged 14 and 12 which drives me crazy , so I remind but try not to stress (them or me!)

My final conclusion is that I would judge anyone who judged you!

MN is hilarious, it's another universe, I didn't know people were so ignorant about basic manners!

the amount of threads complaining about the rudeness of friends, colleagues, neighbours make more sense.

I am as common as you can get and working class, but we were still being taught about table manners. It's insulting to pretend we are all living like cave men.

Honestly, I don’t understand how dolls can cut like that. I might make assumptions about your upbringing but I wouldn’t judge you. I prefer eating my rissotto with a fork (mouth too small for spoons) so I have no right to judge here.

Silently, yes. I judge table manners:

People who take their face to their food rather than their food to their face.

People who eat without pausing; who don’t ever put the cutlery down and finish what’s in their mouth before reloading their fork.

Elbows on the table.

Eating with their mouth open / talking with their mouth full.

Starting to eat before all have been served (unless the host / chef / cook has said ‘do please start’).

Serving yourself before offering to serve others

Reaching over your co-diners food to get to other food / condiments.

Using a fork to ‘stab’ food and sawing at it.

Not taking all food on a fork / spoon into one’s mouth in one go (sucking food off spoons / chewing food whilst it remains on a fork).

Seasoning before tasting.

Cultural differences allowing...

I would never say anything (unless a relative) but I would silently judge and avoid eating with the worst offenders.

Thus I vowed that any children I might have would not suffer that as I would teach them properly. Both are Dyspraxic & ASD so my best efforts have come to nought
Snap.
That was at the top of things to teach my DC, unfortunately both have SEN too.
I was never taught either but also have DCD it took concentration and pain age 20 when I started my first official job.
People wonder if privilege truly gives you steps forward, not just hard work.
When basic etiquette lessons need to be learnt for some at university.

I saw a table full of twenty year old men in Nando’s eating with their knife and fork in the wrong hand. They were struggling to eat properly and looked ridiculous.

I wouldn't judge. I'd just think you had a working class background, as everyone I know with that background does the same.

Ah - now we are getting there. People thing it is common.

I didn't know people were so ignorant about basic manners!

Again - what makes holding your knife a certain way good or bad? Or ignorant? Maybe making judgements about how people hold an implement is more bad manners?

I might make assumptions about your upbringing.

Because of the way someone holds a knife? That says far more about your upbringing.