Reporting my 17 son to the police for theft

[PurpleMagnolia]

I really want to hear from other parents who have experience of police involvement with their teens. I feel like we are at the end of the line with him and we are seriously considering bringing charges against him ourselves. He has been stealing from us in ever greater amounts from 10 onwards, can be very threatening and abusive when challenged, has tried to push his stepfather around if he 'dares' to get involved, has thrown things at me, is extremely intelligent, bullying and manipulative. He has every kind of support, I quit my job to try to love him and support him through his GCSE's he got 3 C's and a B, slept through most of them but had target grades of straight 8's. He is unbelievably lazy and disgusting, bottles of wee under the bed, room fully of rotting food, backpack like an actual compost bin rotting down in there. Is really overweight, smokes including a little pot. We live in a house of locked doors to every room, steals food all the time, lifetime of stealing other kids toys, sisters lego, money etc. Was just trying to survive until he leaves home and edge him through his college course in the hope that he could get a job and leave, which he is in danger of being thrown out of. He lies about absolutely everything and often has carefully constructed stories he builds up over time to put me of off the scent of what he is doing. His small group of friends are vile, nasty characters. He has always had consequences for his actions, paying money back etc. He has had all his xbox etc confiscated over the years and in the last year has no access to lounge (he nicks videos and sells them), no phone contract, no wifi, not even a door on his room. End of a long road of consequences. He has been to CAMHS, private counselors, Early Intervention youth services, family counseling. He has swallowed our life up trying to work out how to help him. BUT just recently I got a text from another trusted parent, telling me he has stolen over 200 pounds and another time been caught with her wallet in his bag. She had a serious talk with him, but didn't tell me, then the final straw was him stealing £900 worth of graphics card and memory from her daughters computer to sell on. We managed to get it back from the other little a%^&ole he sold it to, found he has tools in his bag for the job. She even told me that she had a warning from another Mum that he has stolen from her too. He is totally unrepentant and is really gloating about the fact that his mate had to give up the computer gear, and he got to keep the money. I don't given him money, both my kids (sister is a sweet hard working kind soul) earn their pocket money, but he can't be arsed. Somehow always has cash, I suspect through more stealing. ANYHOO, it's been a month since I got the text, he hasn't done and single job here (lawn mowing etc) to earn a penny and says he is 'looking into' getting a job. Totally unrepentant and I have given him 2 weeks to pay her back something decent (he owes her £265) or I will press charges. I have already called the cops on him for stealing my phone and threatening me, and they were amazing, said they would keep him in till late at night without pressing charges to try and teach him a lesson. Has no effect. What I really want to is to hear from other parents who have been devoted stable parents who have taken ever possible step and ended up with an amoral monster and what on earth they have done! Stepfather has been in his life since he was three, always supported him been great husband and dad. Bio Dad was total bastard as well, no hoper, nasty and selfish and died a few years ago. All this started well before his Dad passed however. I can't talk about to most people because they always say stuff like 'I wouldn't let him get away with that'. What can you do when is he massively tall and 24 stone! We have no conequences left and I am afraid he has found some new friends to steal from their parents. I had to text round all the ones I new to tell them to protect then from people robbed! I have been through the crying, the depression, the hysterical grief, the horror, have read a million books on how to raise boys, challenging sons, strong willed children, confident boys ad nauseum. Nothing! Sorry for the long rant but I just don't feel he should be allowed to get away with it and pick up some new victims. Help!

Oh god Youjust, that's is the stuff of nightmares. I feel that this kind of stuff is almost guaranteed to start happening. :-(

OP I think he needs to go - for everyone’s benefit, even his own. I can’t imagine how hard that would be to do but there are so many people he is affecting. I would contact social services, contact the police and then pack his bags.

Even if he has a personality disorder it doesn’t give him a free pass to behave like this.

I don’t know what suport there is out there for him or you and the rest of the family but I don’t think it is safe to have him in your home a day longer.

This is the leading PDA centre and they take referrals up to 25.

www.autismeastmidlands.org.uk/family-child-services/diagnosis-assessment/

Also:
www.pdasociety.org.uk/adult-life/adults-with-pda-overview
www.pdasociety.org.uk/resources/pda-case-studies/case-studies-adults
www.pdasociety.org.uk/resources/blogsandfacebookgroups

It took DB to have a mental breakdown to get the help he needs, I hope your DS can get the right help soon.

Oh my fuckin' god Purple you need to get him out now before he ends up killing one of you. You have done everything you can. You cannot reason with evil and unfortunately some people are - much as we can't fathom how.

There are some astonishingly disgusting comments on here! This is this woman's son ffs!! Where do people get off calling a 17 year old boy evil and saying he's going to kill??

Op, your son is very definitely mentally ill. The police is not the way to go, you need to push for the root cause.

I would start by trying to find out your ex's medical history and speak to his family.

At the end of the day, you've brought this child into the world with problems. You can't just turn your back on him and chuck him out. You need to get help to deal with this.

...smokes including a little pot...

I doubt it is ‘pot’ & I doubt it is ‘a little’ of what ever it is he gets his hands on. Same with his mates. Do not be surprised if he is involved in some activities relating to drug trade as his body mass will make him ‘useful’ & this may already be so given his sense of entitlement & invulnerability.

You are no longer the dominant influence on your son’s behaviours, beliefs & actions. A long time ago, you were & you did your best - your DD is turning out well .

I am by no means saying disown or deny your relationship with your son, but it is now time to disengage from him & his life choices. You have provided him with a nurturing home, & you are clearly a loving & diligent mother, but it is now time for him to face up to the realities of life, his place in the world & the impact of his beliefs & behaviours - AKA growing up.

Many young people stay in the family home & this works as they are contributing to the overall family good.

I expect your son has spent his inheritance in advance & several times over. The consequences of this will manifest soon... & likely on your doorstep. So you need to move him on now.

Over recent times, I have seen several young men so like your son in our neighbourhood, & the impact of ruthless &/or criminal activities on their loving families. You have done what you can, & now you need to distance & disengage for the protection & wellbeing of your family.

It does go with out saying, but I shall do so anyway, that you still love your son.

I've done the PDA test before, and just done it again. Some of it matches and some doesn't. When it suits him he can do what's asked of him and he has certainly had periods during his life when he did what was asked of him by very strict demanding teachers without a melt down. He doesn't score high enough to be a likely PDA sufferer. He has night terrors his whole life, but doesn't get particularly anxious. He used to be quite loving, and would hug me in front of his teenage friends, but to have a loving relationship with him, you are not allowed to get angry with being stolen from and lied to all the time, which is of course impossible!

Purple, you sound like the most amazing parent, but I think you know that he has to leave your home. The police involvement is almost irrelevant as if he carries on he will get a record anyway.

I had an older brother like this and it ruined my childhood. My parents gave him chance after chance and he never learned/didn't care. It was such a relief when he left and the locks were changed. I could invite friends round, leave my valuables around the house, talk freely without my words being used against me. It was like the sun came out and I got my parents back too.

My brother went on to get a record including jail time. I don't know what he is up to now as I have chosen not to have contact with him, not that he has noticed or cares.

My parents have sporadic, civil contact with him, but they chose to move to another area so that they wouldn't keep running into him or hear stories of his antics. I don't think they would have any relationship with him at all if he had continued to live with them and abuse their trust beyond 16 when he left.

CallMe I would have agreed with you even a year ago. But not now. I think this last month has made me see real evil in him. We are scared as well as angry. Scared that if we are not longer useful something terrible will happen. None of his Dads family or his Dad had any kind of diagnosis, they weren't really of the generation that had that kind of help. His Dad was bad enough but he had an older brother that was the real black sheep of the family, a criminal who got shot by a gang in his 40's. He was banned from the houses of his entire family for stealing off them all. I haven't turned my back on him! I have been working tirelessly his entire life to help him, love him and set a good example. He has dominated the family for his entire life. We have to fight for air every day. You can't help someone who just doesn't give a shit and is perfectly happy with how things have worked out. He is not bothered at all. Described the people he was stealing off as 'resources', these are people that took him on holiday, fed him endless lovely roast dinners and so on. The sad part is, something died in me when this last event happened. It's all just duty and survival now.

@KitchenDanceFloor I remember when I moved in with DF - that first day I shut the front door closed my eyes and said I'm safe

I suspect he has been pinching cash all over the show as he always has money. ...or he is dealing (maybe).

He stands to inherit some money from his Dad at 18, which is a disaster as he has been borrowing against it from all his mates I think and will probably just live of it until it runs out. Are the funds in a Trust & if so, can the age of inheritance be deferred? Are you, or do you know, an Executor of his late father’s estate? I could argue that deferring the inheritance until he has proven himself to be responsible could be in his better long-term interest, but it could land him in the proverbial shit if he doesn’t settle his debts as he has promised. If there is a potential deferment & this could be instigated by his sole parent before he is 18, you may find this useful leverage with him to get him to move out, or make other changes, rather than evict him.

He even has two sims in his phone, which so dodgy!...because he is dealing (maybe).

Kitchen, that is exactly what its like when he is away. Leave my handbag around, say things without having to watch every word. We feel as light as air. I can't have friends over unless they know, or he might steal from them too. DH and myself are pretty strong, but my lovely DD has learning diffs, and she has her mouth sealed shut when he's around because he will jump on her and start ridiculing. Just gross. I am going to let this sit with me now for a a couple of days. I gave him 6 weeks to turn his life around after the big theft text and start paying back. We are now down to 11 days. Not looking good. I think throwing him out is better than pressing charges, as many of you have pointed out, that will happen anyway.

Solicitor says we have to hand over the inheritance. I worry about the dealing. I haven't seen him drunk or particularly wasted looking ever. Once or twice looks a bit suspiciously hypo, but he has a room full of monster cans. God I hate those drinks. We dream of what it would be like to live free of all this.

I'm so sorry to read this OP.

You sound like you've done everything you can for your son.

From what you've posted there's simply nothing left for you to give, other than sacrificing the needs of your daughter, yourself and your husband with very little prospect of anything changing.

The upshot is despite all the punishments he's still being rewarded by having a roof over his head and food provided.

He knows he's causing distress to everyone else in the family home but doesn't care.

So as sad as it is I do think you need to report him to the police and insist he leaves the family home.

You perhaps have to acknowledge that you can't save him from himself but you can save your daughter, husband and self from him.

Again, I'm so sorry, your heartbreak is evident in your posts

OP , two SIMs , ready cash, would be obvious signs of drug dealing in my neck of the woods (adults) . In some senses it's better to kick him out before 18 as he'll get more support with housing

Callmerachel- agree with you about the disgusting comments and it’s not helpful for people to be making the OP feel even worse than she does.

But frankly it’s not helping to go the other way with comments like:

‘Op, your son is very definitely mentally ill. The police is not the way to go, you need to push for the root cause.’

So dangerous and actually quite arrogant to say things like this. None of us can possibly know if he’s mentally ill. He’s clearly very disengaged from the reality of life and probably unhappy. But it takes specialists to diagnose mental illness not some well meaning internet chat. And even if he does have a diagnosis, as we keep saying, he has to live in the real world. There is no suggestion that he’s so disabled that he can’t function and is incapable of making decisions independently. Therefore he needs to be held accountable. Even if he were diagnosed with PDA (and the OP who knows him isn’t convinced that fits, and not all health authorities recognise it anyway) but even if, it doesn’t let him off the hook for criminal behaviour, or the disgusting lack of respect for others. I work with young people who have a whole range of disabilities, and in some cases severe emotional problems but it is never an excuse or a reason for how he’s behaving. Knowledge of it may give some insight to the underlying inclinations. So yeah there may be a genetic predisposition to certain behaviours. But it’s never a simple reason, because of course countless other people have all those same ‘bad luck’ cards such as genetic traits and environmental influences yet don’t choose to take drugs, steal from Others etc

CallmeRachel then I can only surmise that you are in the fortunate position to have not had dealings with people who can only be described as 'evil'. There are two in my family sadly. I wish it were not the case though.

Sorry posted too soon!

for you and for your DD too

The worst thing about living in this sort of environment was the sense of secrecy and shame, when my parents and I had done nothing wrong.

I just wanted to reiterate that I really think you have done everything in your power to help your son and there should be no sense of guilt or shame on you or the rest of the family.
Once your son has moved out (whenever this happens) , please allow your daughter to talk freely about her experiences with you and with anyone else.

I was told we had to keep everything in the family and it was poisonous. It meant that I had to make up ridiculous excuses why there was a lock on my bedroom door, for example, rather than saying to friends 'when my brother lived here he used to steal things unless we locked them away.' It made the guilt mine rather than the responsibility his, if you see what I mean.

I don't blame my parents for this. They did the best they could and it nearly broke them both.

I think you have to kick him out for your own sanity and for your DD's sake. Do it on Tuesday morning when the council offices, and he can go straight there and present himself as homeless and vulnerable.

The council will make enquiries which will probably involve ringing you to see if a) he's trying it on and b) if there's any hope of a reconciliation.

They will have a duty to help him because he's under 18. They will probably place him in a "foyer" type establishment where young people get support and until they've earned their "passport to independence", when they may be entitled to a council flat (they do in my area, but I realise it may be different elsewhere).

He will be entitled to housing benefit and income support because he is "a young person estranged from his parents and in full-time education".

Don't beat yourself up, an awful lot of parents would have called time on him years ago. You've gone above and beyond trying to help him and without a diagnosis (which surprises me somewhat) I don't see what more you could have done.

Be strong, stay firm and good luck.

Sounds so much like my older brother. My mum and step dad had an awful time with him. They were strict and there were always consequences to his actions but nothing worked. His behaviour just go worse and worse. They waited until he was 18 and then gave him a week to move out. He organised nothing and fucked around for that week. When his time was up my step dad physically dragged him out the house and locked him out. Told him they'd call the police if he didn't leave the property. I don't think they needed to in the end - he vandalised the front garden but then went off to stay with a friend thinking he'd be allowed back home soon but my parents stuck to their guns and changed the locks. I can't say he had a great time and it all turned around after he left because it didn't. But there was nothing more they could do to help him, and at least with him out of the house we weren't all living in fear of being robbed, hit, drug dealers coming to the house for money owed, police raid looking for drugs and stolen goods etc. It had to be done for our safety.

So there’s an inheritance coming. If he pisses it up the wall you just have to sit back and watch it happen I’m afraid. I would evict him today and advise social services he can’t come home. At his age he would likely be out in a foyer if there’s a local one. And he will learn he has to get on with people or get kicked out. They will support him in doing so and in accessing cambs. You’ve tried everything and at the rate he’s going it’s get evicted, go to young offenders or get hurt due to his crimes. Getting evicted might be the swift landing on his arse he needs.

Ah thanks for the flowers KitchenDance. I have been opening up more about it and not hiding in shame any more. It does feel better. My friends know how much I have done and support me. I did go through the shame, isolation and humiliation phase. But now I am just sick of it. I feel I have to walk the whole path, try everything for his sake and my own. I am not upset about people comments about getting to the root cause and so forth or not giving up on him etc. Honestly, I probably would have thought the same not that long ago. I really believed I could help. Until you have experienced it, it is just impossible to really understand. I do believe he has mental health issues, but which is why I have been fighting to get him seen, bankrupting us paying for it privately blah blah blah. Don't be to harsh on each other! I'm looking for all thoughts and opinions! Interesting side story, my DH has a friend in NZ , a Dr of Psychology who works for the prison service. He has been talking to her about my son and her response was, sounds like 'classic cluster B type, the prisons are overloaded with them, they are almost universally intractable'. That is the cluster B personality disorders, Anti-social, narcissistic, borderline and histrionic. Apparently to a psychologist in her line of work they the main group in prison. :-(

Is Brat Camp an option?

They look way out of our league at £1600 per week! he has already been on mountain camps and so forth. If you pour loads of everyone's energy and time and strategies and resources into him, school meeetings, special help etc, he will pick up, sometimes even be amazing, but if you want to go back to a normal balanced life where the rest of us get a turn, it just falls away, or he starts manipulating things after a few weeks and you realise he's abusing the trust you gave him. Its literally the definition of a waste of time. It's has cost us so much money over the years, lost incomes, terrible mistakes in DH's work (own business), me retaking university courses becasue of all the trauma. Too stressed to work.

Anyway, I really REALLY appreciate all the thoughts and comments. It is so reassuring that so many of you have taken the time to write. Bloody amazing. Why did I struggle along without this for so long. I really feel so much more human!