To cancel cinema trip?

[goodfornothinggnome]

So were really going through it at the moment with DD.

A lot has changed recently with her, shes going through puberty, so were sort of trying to stop babying her, but shes really not being very good at the moment.

Last week I said to her, let's meet in town for coffee and we can do some shopping. DD asked if she could bring a friend, I said ok, that'll be fine- I knew it would change the trip, but that's ok. I waited in Starbucks, she turns up with her friend, says can I have the money for my shopping- ok so she wants to hold money for her stuff, she can learn to budget then I think to myself.
She gets a coffee for her and her friend to take away.....and stroll past me. So i realise I've been left. No shopping trip together. I was a little bit upset, but thought I don't want to ruin this for her or me, I'll go off for a walk around myself. I saw her several times, and she completely blanked me.

I got a call a bit later to take her friends (they gained another friend in town) I'd calmly explained I thought it was a trip for us to talk and shop together without her dad. I just got a stern OK and folded arms.

On Saturday, she started moaning that she needed to go out and get a mothers day present for me, she saw it the other day in primark whilst with her friends, I said, why didn't you buy it then? Her reply, Dad buys your presents. So come Sunday, he says we will go and get you a gift, and got me a pandora bracelet and a few charms. She started saying I'd lost a bracelet of hers when I cleaned her room...mumsnet, I'm telling you all I didn't touch or see it. She then went quiet.
My husband said let's go and get a coffee and doughnut, because she loves it. It's an ongoing joke that every time I go past a travel agency I book a holiday, so was joking that I could run to a travel agency nearby and book next years holiday (see it is a joke because we don't have a holiday for next year planned yet!) She started to grab at me and before I knew it, she had slapped me around the face. I was really upset with her, quite shocked because we don't even play like that so her insistence she was playing wasn't even understandable to me.

Then last night she said to me, don't worry about tucking me in tonight, I'll put myself to bed, so I'm thinking theres something upstairs she doesn't want me to see. So I take her up to bed, and I realise her bathroom door is closed. Unlike her as she likes the bathroom door open and the light on, so theres a little bit of light in her bedroom.

Her bathroom is a complete shit tip. Mumsnet, I don't know how she managed it, but there are full on blobs of conditioner all over the bath, the sink is smeared with nail varnish, the toilet is full of loo roll and there are clothes all over the floor.

This morning she refused to get ready for school, she took an hour and a half to put on a top and leggings- forgot to shower (despite being told 3 times this morning!) She was "ready" 10 minutes after we should have left. She had her shoes in her hand, jumper wrapped around her waist, and she didn't "need" a coat. She told me she would put shoes on when she was in school. So I said, no way, you put your shoes on IN this house. You put your jumper on, and your coat too. We are late, so do it quickly. She huffs at me and rolls her eyes.

I cancelled her trip to the cinema tonight with her friends.

I feel like an absolute cow, because she went into school crying, but I'm actually refusing to take her and 3 friends to the cinema, pay for their tickets and sweets, to then take these children home after, to continue to have our home, and me treated this way.

I'm sorry this is so long and massively detailed, but I just need to vent a little bit.

I know the shopping trip is just 11 year olds not thinking, but i just feel like the way she went about it showed there was no respect at all for me. She could have said, I'd prefer to just go with a friend. It would have saved me waiting around, and a trip to town I didn't even want!

Oh OP, this is a massive issue. Even if she were messing around re the slap and it got out of hand, she should have apologised when she saw your reaction. She upset you and she needs to acknowledge that. Also in the nicest possible way, it sounds like she was back to her normal self, because she was in the shops and knew there could be something in it for her. Now, I have some questions:

1. Was she crafting with a new phone case?

2. Why does an 11 yo have access the internet without supervision (assuming she was following a how to marble video on YT and you didn't know she was doing it.)

3. Do you not think point 2 might explain some of her behaviour?

Of course you can get over it.

Her trying to continue to dismiss it as a joke is an issue. However, you not allowing her to do so, is excellent.

You're different from me, I wouldn't be disappointed. I'd be furious. No one hits me. I don't hit them, they don't hit me. Simple.

It's good that she is trying to modify her behaviour. Do not be too quick to pretend this all didn't happen, by thinking it's all back to normal. There has been a fairly big breakdown in terms of behaviour and trust.

You still sound very anxious-it's the recent return to work causing additional stress? Do you have a good treatment plan for your anxiety disorder?

I just don't want this to be who she turns into. I'm terrified that we will look back to this past week, and say, oh this is when that started!

I was so shocked, then angry, now sad. I like to think that shes embarrassed at herself and that's why shes sticking to the story it was her messing around.

Also she has said she was trying to decorate a phone case and her nails at the same time. In the sink. Which does sound like the sort of thing she would do. Despite being told categorically not to several times fairly recently. We have done the dipping art with stuff before, but never in a sink. She wouldn't have needed a tutorial.

You sound like a great Mum and you are doing really well. One word of advise, you've implemented the punishments and read her the riot act so now allow her some space and time to improve her behaviour. As awful as she has been she is still only 11 and this behaviour if partly caused by hormonal changes can be difficult for her too. My son at 14 changed from being a bright, lovely and engaged young man to being a moody, entitled slob overnight. I didn't recognise him as the boy I was raising. I am happy to report the awful phase didn't last forever and he has matured in to a loving and wonderful young man. As the saying goes, "and soon this will pass" xx

I wasnt aware I came across as anxious online Haha, but yes I'm a little bit highly strung even for me at the moment, thanks for asking. I do have some support, but I find things like the issues with DD always make me a bit more anxious for a few days.

Oh God, I sympathise. It's never their fault. They're just misunderstood. And you're supposed to be alzheimic, so you won't remember the story they told before that varies wildly from the story they are telling you now.

They are forming. This is not them 'formed'.

How you react is important. Mainly, it's making it clear that they are not in charge, they do have to adhere to the requirements, and quite frankly, drinking an awful lot of bloody wine while you bit your lip rather than saying what you'd REALLY like to say. (Oh, and saying to your Mother, yes, Mum, you were right, I was a horrible person, and this is the kid you wished on me. . . while drinking a lot more wine. . .)

Mine are coming out nicer, and I'm sure yours can too.

But there are some behaviours that are shutdown, lockdown, UNACCEPTABLE. For which they have to learn to be accountable.

I think you need to draw a line under this episode and move forward.
A few new rules - maybe around keeping the bathroom clean/earning some pocket money.
You might want to think about whether you have crossed the line from being kind and generous to spoiling her. It's not a terrible thing to give your kids nice things, but rude entitled children are not nice to be around.
She is still your lovely daughter underneath this outburst.
This has been unpleasant for both of you.

You need to move 0n as p.p. said.
Discuss with her the rules and red lines
No one hits.
There could be worse incidents to come. She isnt even a teenaher yet! You can't kerp ruminating on this . Maybe look into a local parenting teens course for some ideas and strategies. Secondary school might run some.

I would have cleaned her bathroom too. Then I would have removed every device she owns, put them in the bathroom then put a big padlock on door to stop her using all of it.
11 years old! An absolute spoilt brat. Sort it out now while you can. An 11 year old has NO excuse for slapping their mother. She has no respect for you at all. Sorry is just a word. It means nothing. The fact that she slapped you to begin with speaks enough of her opinion of you.
Take all her things away. She is a young child. No more friends over, no more days out, no more devices, no more ensuite.
If she wants to act like a toddler then treat her like one.
You have a chance to gain back control now. If you don't you'll be getting it much worse. Guaranteed.

Have well and truly taken back control. Seemed like her usual self this morning, helpful and nice, was rather saddened that it was followed up by her enquiring about making Tuesdays a day to go out with friends, and going to the cinema on Friday with her friends.
She was disappointed to hear that
A- we would discuss Tuesdays with friends in town afterschool at a later time because shes currently grounded and I'm unsure when she will be ungrounded. As it depends o her behaviour going forward too

B- definitely not this Friday. She will certainly still be grounded then.
C- I will not be funding group visits, or even hers. She needs to do chores to earn the money to pay for them.

And for good measure I've told her that if she isn't ready for school on time, I will dock her pocket money £1 each time (i bloody hope that's the right thing to do, i don't want her to view being late as trivial as the £1 loss- I know it's an anxious thing but I'm sort of worrying that she will be like, oh I'll be late then, and over a week shes lost a fiver, and might not really care but I'll be unravelled by the end of the week. Being late to school is really something I don't cope well with!)

Also, just wondering what's the norm for pocket money for 11 year olds? She would like £12 a week.

Her chores are now as follows,
Make bed each day
Wipe over bathroom each day
Hoover bedroom/bathroom/hall these are areas that only she really uses
Empty bathroom bin (daily at TOTM/weekly otherwise)
Open curtains each day + make bed
Generally tidy after herself.
Unload dishwasher each day.
She added cleaning cupboard fronts once a week to her list.
The dog slumbers on them, so that's actually handy. That means one less time i need to do it.

The dog slobbers not slumbers on kitchen cupboard fronts! And I just want to be clear, the bin she needs to empty is her own. Not anyone else's!

£12 a week is a lot at 11 unless she's out and about on her own regularly.
What will she be responsible for buying out of that? Family gifts, cosmetics? Or is all of that £624 pa for er to spend on coffee and fun stuff with her friends?

My 12 year old gets £10 a week pocket money, so £12 doesn’t seem particularly unreasonable. He buys family gifts out of that, sweets if he wants them, or saves up for bigger things like a Lego set or computer game. I did the same with my eldest son, and he’s really good with money now.

I agree with pp ensure she understands that that money is to also include any gifts she might want for others and that outside of birthdays etc it is her responsibility to budget accordingly. Also if she somehow runs out that that is not your problem.

It will be used a little bit like Tatty mentions,
Anything that isn't really covered in normal day to day life. For example if she wants something big, I wont be buying it, she can save up, which to be fair shes really good at. So a fair percentage of it will be saved until we go away on holiday so she can buy some trinkety bits, and she does buy gifts from time to time, clothes that she just wants and aren't really needed, that sort of thing.

Is she Year 6 or Year 7?

Being late for school should be a school related consequence so school should give her detention tell her off etc. What does school do to late's? How does she get to school ?

Agree clear consequences and un ground her. She knows now what is at stake. You may need grounding later. You can't ground for indetermined time or without saying how she earns ungrounding. Be more clear. "Because of what happens no going put for a week. Then we start with clean slate".

Imagine your boss calling you out for something and saying they will decide when the punishment is over?

"Until I decide" is controlling and will make her rebellious.

I'm not trying to be controlling, but also not trying to give her a definite when she will be ungrounded, because if shes naughty, shes just going to say I've gone back on the promise she can go out. But I can go and confirm the situation with her, and that I've worded things clearly.

You should be controlling. You're her parent and she is a child. And I also disagree with the late for school issue.
If DD is disobeying OP over getting up and getting ready on time and is so late for school then she should lose her pocket money privilege.

What I do is for a punishment, make it clear what it encapsulates (i.e. no cinema trips, no going to friends houses, no shopping trips), and for how long - 1 week, 2 weeks, whatever. But to me, punishment needs to be clearly defined, to be fair and unambiguous. You did X. As a consequence, for X, Y will occur.

If they then misbehave during that time - then they get a punishment for that as well. E.g. loss of phone, loss of devices.

If kids feel that no matter what they do, they're going to be punished, they're demotivated to behave the way you want them to. (It's a bit like why we have the parole system for prisoners behind bars).

One that Nigel Latta ('Before Your Kids Drive You Crazy, Try This') suggests, is the Ladder of Doom. So, each time they misbehave - ten minutes off their bedtime. I did find with my 10-12 year olds that nothing got under their skin more than having their bedtime back to primary or pre-school levels. On one memorable occasion when my eldest decided to REALLY test the fences, and go for the burn - she was in bed at 4.30pm. Never really seemed to quite have the appetite to push things so far again, after finding out that yes, Mum really did mean that she was going to bed at 4.30pm, having had a very early tea, and while it was still light outside and she could hear her sister having a fine old time on the trampoline.

If she's still in Primary School that would definitely affect both the punishment I was dishing out, and the "rules" moving forwards (including pocket money).

My DD gets £10 a week. She's yr7. From that she has to pay for any sweets/magazines after school and on a Saturday when she goes to a club - she has to get some lunch. I pay for a bus pass for school and this can be used at other times too.
I would probably give extra money for buying gifts.

Mine get £5 a week and they are 13 & 15. They do a lot less than you ask of yours. Feeding five animals, dishwasher emptying, stripping and making own beds, emptying their own bins though I've never had that as a job.