Not going to daughters wedding

[IAmInimitable]

Am I wrong in saying I won’t go to my oldest daughters wedding because she wants to invite her future sister in laws live in partner - who is the man who raped my younger daughter?

It was acquaintance rape and my younger daughter thought something was off but didn't really process what happened and thought that she somehow deserved to be treated that way.

She buried it for some time and carried on as normal for a while (even around him). Then sometime later he started some pretty awful rumours about her which just confirmed in her mind he was a dangerous person not to be messed with.

She then moved away for work and with the help of her boyfriend was able to confront and understand what happened to her.

She thought he was out of her life, that she wouldn’t ever have to see him again and that she could put it behind her but then she found out he was going to be connected to her sisters future family. She then felt able to share what happened to her and how she felt about her sister spending time with him.

She doesn't want anything said to the future sister in law because she's still scared of the man and really doesn't want to report what happened. Future SIL is happiest she has ever been in the relationship and isn't going to believe what happened.

So my older daughters fiancé can still enjoy family events my older daughter goes to them even though the rapist is often there too. She says she ignores him but photos of them all together have appeared on social media.

The fall out from this has led to total estrangement between the sisters as the one that was raped can't understand how her sister can spend time with him and feels her sister doesn't really believe what happened to her.

The one getting married now feels that as her relationship with her sister is non existent she doesn't want to upset the future SIL and for her fiancé to fall out with his family. So she and her fiancé haven't even been willing to have any sort of conversation with the SIL about how we feel about him being at the wedding.

We don't even think the rape needs to be mentioned to the SIL as we feel the rumours he spread and the fact my daughters are estranged because of him is reason enough for us not to want him to be at the wedding.

My older daughter veers between thinking it will all magically resolve itself or saying we should just be civil on the wedding day for her sake. I feel that to expect us to be in the same room as the man who raped my younger daughter and who has effectively torn my family apart is unimaginable. I can’t even think how I could cope coming face to face with him on what is meant to be such a special day.

I don't want to lose my eldest daughter by not going to the wedding but I cannot see anyway I could possibly go if he is there.

This seems pretty clear. That man should not be going to the wedding. And if he is you can't go. Any reasonable daughter would understand that. Is there any evidence of the rumours he spread? Could that be the public facing reason why he can be uninvited. The SIL probably has hints of his character already. This stance can only help his true character become clearer in her mind.

@springwalk

The in laws know the full story. It's the SIL & other people that don't know. The OP has posted this

Where does your husband stand from the whole giving his daughter away angle?!

I’m really really struggling to put myself in your eldest daughters shoes. I’ve really tried (so hard) but I am filled with a rage each time that she’s treating her sibling so horrendously. This ‘man’ isn’t even a family memeber, he’s just a bf, how is he given priority here. I’d be thoroughly disappointed in my eldest daughter if I was you to say the least and I think you are handling superbly, much better than me probably.

I asked my husband for his opinion and he said there’s no way your eldest daughter believes her sister because if she did she couldn’t be ok with it. I’m not sure what to think about that but good luck with all. I’m so sorry you’re in this shit pit x

burritofan - I was one of those who suggested the compromise of going to the ceremony but not the reception - in that way, the OP and her husband, as parents of the bride, do not snub their elder daughter completely and yet avoid having to be at a party with their younger daughter's rapist. The OP is trying to find a way out that will not irreparably damage her relationship with either of her daughters. I imagine she loves them equally and doesn't want the breakdown of the relationship which it seems will inevitably occur if she favours either of them in this situation. I agree her elder daughter's behaviour towards her sister has been awful.

I'm astonished at the number of recommendations for the OP to go to the ceremony but not the reception

Part of the reason I think OP should consider this is in order to maintain the dd's demand that the rape be kept secret. If the bride's patents aren't at the wedding everyone will be asking questions. Does the bride have extended family going? Surely they will ask where her parents are?

I think the OP has to tread a careful line here. Imo too many people now know the "secret" and anyone of them could expose it in the heat of the moment.

If the groom's family are choosing to believe the rapist then you can easily see how they can spin a story - man and bride's dd dated years ago. Bad break up. Ds been very spiteful. Can't stand that he is happy with groom's sister so telling lies that he was spreading rumours. Because we refused to uninvite him OP threw a strop and refused to come to wedding. Can you believe it? Mother refused to come to own dds wedding.... - you can just hear it being said. Who knows if the bride or groom gets upset at all of this and then blurts out " actually no the reason is he raped ds", or if pil answer the question of where is mother of bride with " well once they falsely accused X of rape there's no way they could come. Who would do that? You know him, would never do that." Then the dd's secret is out there.

I think if it is very important for your younger dd that this is kept a secret then she needs to accept that you have to maintain a facade of normality in order to stop the gossips.

As harsh as it is, I do think that this is a consequence of her choosing to keep it secret. If she insists that no one knows then people will have to maintain a pretence of normality in order to stop the questions. Ultimately it's unusual for the bride's parents not to go to the wedding and people will ask why. I think this is what everyone is missing when judging the older dd so harshly. In my view, she is struggling to come up with a convincing reason as to why the man shouldn't be at the wedding and why she won't be at any family events that he will be at.

burrito as much as the eldest dd is being an arse, she's op's daughter, I don't think she should miss seeing her get married because of this scumbag, however, a stand has to be made in some way, there's no way I could drink, dance, laugh etc at a party with my dds rapist. I think skipping that part is a compromise for the op, not the rapist.

LittleChristmasMouse - yes, I'm afraid so.

If someone raped my daughter I would want to flay them alive

If the In laws also know about the rape as well, this makes the situation eve worse now better.

LittleChristmasMouse have you repeatedly missed that everyone, including the sil knows this man was accused of spreading rumours and nudes of the youngest dd?

Whether they know of the rape or not, they already have a known reason for saying this man would not be welcome at a family event.

DawgLover

No I haven't missed anything.

Depending on how much proof of the rumour spreading and fake nude pictures exist I can see how people who don't know the accuser but know the accused could take his side.

I can see situations where it could be passed off as a disgruntled ex wanting to cause trouble. If there is proof, and the younger dd is willing to share it, then again, different argument. But if it's her word against his I can see that his friends and family are more likely to take his side. I can also see how that makes it very hard for older dd to not invite him to the wedding - it would be very easy for the sil(who seemingly knows very little) to create an enormous drama and then the bride is painted into a corner of being the bridezilla who is refusing to allow the sil partner to come to the wedding because he is her sister's ex boyfriend.

You can just see the arguments. There are threads on here every day from people not invited to weddings, or partners not invited, for seemingly trivial reasons. This is how it will come across imo.

And I don't think that him spreading rumours or fake pictures is a good enough reason for the bride's parents not to go to their daughter's wedding. He isn't a family member, he isn't the groom. He is just a guest. I think many other guests would be shocked to hear that the bride's parents boycotted her wedding for that reason. I think that will cause the sort of gossip that the younger dd is desperate to avoid.

It's only my opinion. I just think that the youngest dd does need to realise that if she is certain that she wants the rape kept secret, that this man is going to be a part of her sister's extended family and therefore other family members are sometimes going to have to put on a front in order to keep her secret.

Can you not see how much more difficult this gets as time passes? Say in 5 years time the bride has a baby and this man is still around. Can the OP justify not going to a christening or gc birthday party because this man spread rumours about her dd 5 or more years ago? It gets more difficult as time passes.

I think the sister really needs to think about what is more important - keeping her secret or snubbing this man because I think trying to exclude this man or trying to make the bride and groom split from the groom's family is actually going to cause the secret to be forced out into the open.

The sister is also scared of this man causing trouble. Do you not think he will retaliate if he is banished from the wedding or excluded from other family events? If he is the type to lash out and retaliate are you not just going the right way about provoking such a reaction?

eldest DD also truly believes that the youngest’s bf has turned youngest DD into a ‘victim’ and that she’d be over it by now and carrying on as normal

You do not "get over" rape. You learn to live with it, but the powerlessness and (often) fear does not go, and in date/ aquaintance rape it is accompanied by self-blame, self-doubt, worthlessness and a sense that what happened was "deserved" ("I must have given him the wrong signals"/ "He's so popular that it must be me in the wrong" etc)

And as for behaving normally around your rapist - shock and social pressure can cause this - and anyway, what is the "right" way to behave?

I can see the situation is impossible for you. If I was in your position, I might go to the ceremony and then go home.

Can I also flag to you op, you know this man is a real and present danger, you know he has raped your daughter. You need to be prepared when he does it again. It might all burst into the open, and there will be serious questions asked as to why it was not reported, addressed. Why you all did absolutely nothing to stop him.

Stop this Springwalk

OP has a duty to her DD; her DD does not feel up to reporting thee rape to the police. It is her own mental and emotional health at stake here.

You are right that she may not be the last victim of this vile man - and she may not have been the first. The fact that he has not only raped her, but blackened her name and reputation with disgusting photoshopped pictures tells me everything about him - and I think his confidence here indicates both that he has done this before, knows how difficult the charge would be to make stick (in legal terms) and is using this as a method of intimidation - effectively saying "this is what I've done even though you haven't reported me; if you do go to the police, things will get much worse". He strikes me as a practised abuser.

I am in the camp that can't understand why ANY family would want their DD allied with this man in any way - or that any woman, even if she doesn't know about the rape, would want to have anything to do with a man who publishes such vile and humiliating material online.

She will live to regret it.

I think maybe what I've been trying to say is that your youngest dd can only really control her own actions. Even if she controls you and her sister she just can't control the reactions of the in laws, wider family and friends, and this man. The more people pulled into it the more people involved the more she loses control.

There's no nice option for you or either of your daughters.

I think you need to war game all the pros and cons and be honest with both that there is no way you can get it right and you can't split yourself or the family in two over it either. Try to bring them together to agree the least worst option but be clear that this is not the time to question or challenge your younger daughter - you believe her, this is an abusive male who does not get to benefit from people's excuses.

I think it's completely believable that the in laws would have doubts given they've been told something from someone they don't know about rumors and pictures (I'm guessing there was no proof shown??) and he has disputed it. I also think the older DD is in a shit situation. I say this as a rape survivor and childhood sexual abuse survivor. I think if the older dd was allowed to talk about the rape, or formal charges had been laid it would be a completely different situation. As it is it is not just older dd's wedding, her df's family is part of it. I think people are being really hard on her. I think you all need family therapy.

Essentially, your eldest DD, her fiance and his family are all stating quite categorically that they don't believe this man raped your youngest daughter. No mother or father would carry on letting their child date someone if they truly believed he was a rapist. I cannot believe your eldest DD has taken the position she has against her sister. Who is more interested in keeping the peace and their own sodding wedding than their sister's rape? I'd go NC with my sister in the same situation.
OP, the only people showing your youngest DD that they love and believe her are you, her Dad and her BF. You have absolutely made the right decision. Your eldest DD has made here and she has to live with the consequences.

SchadenfreudePersonified I am speaking from personal experience, so please don't tell me what to say. I will say what I want to.

The reason I would encourage dd to report it to the police, although I understand why she wouldn't want to. The over riding feeling is to get over it, and past it. I did not report it, and then a year later I found out he had done it again to a much younger girl. Dd does not want to report it due to the small town mentality, however a rapist will thrive in a culture of silence. There is no other way to protect the other women and girls in the area.

Yes it will be difficult and it will reopen old wounds, but whatever happens she knows she did her best to protect others, she exposed him for what he is and she will not have to leave in a shroud of secrecy any longer.

Obviously if she is absolutely dead against it, you can't insist, and can only support her decision. But I can't see anything wrong with offering to support her if she does find the courage.

leave - live

I'm no expert on the law but surely the Daughter could go to the Police regarding the photoshopped pics.
If he has shown them to all and sundry then isn't that against the law?
I really feel for you and your Daughter.
What a bastard he is!

It really doesn't matter who takes sides in a wider sense, the eldest here could easily say she believes her sister about the pictures and has to put her first. Given the fiance & in laws know the details they could easily manage the reaction as being reasonable given the relationship with the injured party.

I agree that doing anything other than asking the OP and youngest to stand in a room and celebrate with the rapist may provoke a reaction but frankly view that risk as lesser than the impact of forcing either of them through that or pushing the youngest to disclose what she has went through.

And since the pictures and rumours fall under either revenge porn or harassment laws Id be appalled if someone thought this wasn't reason enough to expect this man to sit the wedding out

but I cannot believe your elder dd wouldn't back her sister if it was rape?

How many mothers disbelieve their own children when they accuse their stepfathers of CSA? Lots. And that is mothers, whose job it is to protect their children. So I’m not in the least surprised that a sister is refusing to back a victim.

Unfortunately lots of women believe rape myths, that it’s six of one and half a dozen of another, or you must have done something to provoke it, or you’ve just regretted it the next morning. You haven’t been around rape victims much if you haven’t come across this.

I don't know how this is even a quandary. Your eldest daughter is fucking appalling for inviting this man and you would be worse to go and play happy families with them.