Can we please discuss 'moving out of the way' for men?

[VladmirsPoutine]

I've frankly had it and have made it my mission to never move out of the way and just sort of pull my whole-self in a forward position so that it's either we're going to clash or he'll side-step out of my way.

Can I ask all you women to do the same?

I was always somehow subconsciously moving - but fuck it. The pavement is as much my right.

Gahh! Just walked back to work and a man whom I did not move out of the way for motioned me to the left but I walked straight through and thought fuck it. He then turned back to call me a bitch.

Hope everyone else is having a lovely Thursday morning!

I would rather address the problem of these idiots with hand luggage on wheels that they need to drag 2 meters behind them. Male and female are equally guilty too - even if I have seen more female doing their clothes shopping with them. Susanne, if you can't lift your shopping bags, you shouldn't be shopping in the first place.
Now that gives me the rage because you trip on these ridiculous things. Carry your bag or travel lighter when you are in a crowded place.

The problem is, all if you who say 'i only move for those weaker than me', or 'they can bloody well move', all that achieves is making you one of those irritating people who don't move. The very people you are talking about. Except that for some reason because you are a woman and 'standing up to the patriarchy', it's somehow ok to be rude.

I really don't see a difference in gender or age actually. I've done the dance with many a man and woman. I tend to adjust a bit regardless of who it is, and most of the time so do they. If they don't, I don't stew on it, life's too short. The only time I don't move is if I have to step into the road and they are coming two abreast. Then I would expect them to go one behind the other.

Or, how about you look where you are going and don't trip over my bag.

It's not survival of the fittest.

I use a wheely walker thingy (I’m disabled) and have only recently stopped feeling like I’m an inconvenience to everyone and going out of my way to be the one to move.

It’s ridiculous. I can’t move anywhere near as fast as others , or nip into a gap in a crowd etc so it makes sense for other people to move for me.

They don’t.

But I’ve started holding my course (which is chosen by the easiest/safest route for me) and so many people will practically fall on top of me over my walker (I’m under 5' so it really is almost on top).

Of course I move if it makes sense for me to do so, or I can do it easily.

So I’m playing chicken with EVERYONE.

Least likely to play against me are women 35+ and teenagers. They’re the demographic most likely to offer a hand too.

Or, how about you look where you are going and don't trip over my bag.

If I look at my feet, I can't see where I am going and end up bumping into people who are minding their own business.

I will kick your bag out of the way. Just carry the damn thing, or at least keep it close to you!

Also in London and feel men are terribly aggressive will push people out of the way to get on tube for example, never offer seat to those who need it more. Really pisses me off. Seems to be common for a me me me attitude these days.
Although i would say that if somethng happens eg someone falls - men and women of london do swoop into help. So perhaps it's more a just not noticing thing??

if you can't lift your shopping bags, you shouldn't be shopping in the first place.
Not sure how that is supposed to work?
Where I live many people have actual trailers they drag behind them to go shopping, little carts on wheels. They are great. I have one too. Really good if you do not own a car and want to buy a crate of beer .

I find men can't cope with me over taking them walking and have to overtake me back!

Some years ago I was at a school function which the local MP, Patrick Cormack, was attending. As we reached a doorway at the same time I had to step aside or he would have trampled all over me. He had no awareness of other people at all.

Please could someone (who takes the OP's view) explain what happens when two 'alpha men' (for want of a better expression) are striding towards each other, on a collision course?

I don't wish to deny others' experience but, in mine, almost everyone does the dance, all the time.

I have taken the tube when on crutches, pregnant, with small children (not at the same time)

It's always men who offered me their seats, even young looking teenagers. The only woman who ever offered me a seat was a lovely very old looking lady, and it felt pretty embarrassing. Other women tend to completely ignore you, and either don't care or assume that if there's a male in the carriage, it's up to him to give up his seat, even if he's at the other end!

lottie they get out of the way for each other.

it's women they expect to get out of the way.

I have noticed everyone gets out of my way at work (maybe my bulk or importance 😁) so I am trying to learn to cede to others more. (Am short large female).

Do they have to assess relative status in order to decide the dance moves?

So the claim is not that they are oblivious (as then men would crash into men) but that they are aware and making constant assessments, like the rest of us but with different conclusions - based on what they can get away with? Or on who they care about? Or who they might want to impress? Those are all different.

IMO you're not doing the cause any good posting stuff like this.

Then how do you suggest I do it @scoobyloobyloo?

Because the rush won't come from having 5 women on the board of the company if your company has 10 board-advisors

And I certainly don't believe men can ever become women no matter what they 'feel'.

Maybe I've just been lucky but I usually find that men move out of the way for me. Even teenage boys are generally pretty polite and gentlemanly I find. Where do you live op where the male species are so rude?

We need a secret hand signal. I don’t comport myself in an aggressive fashion, but will not be deferential to manspreaders, non-movers or just bad manners generally. Those fuckers who film everything instead of helping I have reserved a special corner of hell for them, right next to the aeroplane backpack bumpers.

It’s not just men, and obviously it’s not all men, but in my experience it’s mostly men. Especially on a wide pavement when they are walking three abreast in suits with lattes and laptops and don’t even notice I’m there. I do now hold my own and absolutely won’t step into the road for them.

Mind you it happens to me when I’m with DH too. We find ourselves walking in single file and on the edge of the path to accommodate oblivious idiots walking side by side if I’m not concentrating on my private game of Patriarchy Chicken. He’s an unobtrusive sort and tends to defer to everyone (physically, not intellectually, oh no no 😄) so he’s probably unusual.

The bloody nerve of him motioning you to move to the left!
I've not noticed this, perhaps because I'm overweight so perhaps it puts them off. Will look out for it though. I've experienced aggressive, shouty, twatty male drivers though

or just bad manners generally.

fair enough, but that has nothing to do with gender.
There's a video going round of a woman with a small child pushing another woman who narrowly avoided being run over by a bus.

not gender related! (bit extreme, but still).

Lived in London my whole life and have never experienced this entitled-men-pavement-war thing you describe.

Utterly bizzare. Will continue as I am, seems to be working out ok.

Male OF the species. (Sorry but really). We're one species. A species, in mammals at least, is defined by its ability to produce fertile offspring.

I agree about groups of surly teenagers, but they are of both sexes and are generally just going through a boundary testing obnoxious phase. But I must say, I've put this theory to the test many, many times with men and I just cannot draw the conclusion that it's really quite the thing women on MN want to make it out to be.

Some men will do it - and so will some women. At least I think some women will, but I am less reluctant to test them properly on it because I don't want to be the twat who assumes they will move for me.

However, I cannot say that I've noticed it's particularly a man thing. Just as many, if not more men will move to let me pass as will expect me to move for them.

Some people have fewer manners and are more confrontational with a general sense of entitlement and other people are either more polite as a result of cultural conditioning or more submissive by nature. I'm yet to be convinced that it's a gender/sex thing.

I get far more angry with people walking along while looking at their phones, oblivious to the fact that they annoying the fuck out of everybody by not looking where they are going. That bothers me much more than the odd man refusing to lay his cloak in the gutter for me. Which is what this amounts to, on some deeper level I suspect.

I did move last week for a chap who was properly steaming towards me. I felt I had no choice but then I saw him doing the same in another mire narrow aisle. I kept my course and he kept his, striding towards me never dreaming that I wouldn’t move. I just stopped like a big lump and he looked shocked, swerved around me and actually apologised.
I mostly move, give people the benefit of the doubt, but if there’s entitled high speed aggressive walking going on, I’ll put the brakes on and don’t shift. Thankfully it’s rare and I’m happy to look back at my time in Bradford as a student when the men of the Asian community thought nothing of stepping aside and would give you a friendly nod as they did it. It’s not all shit.