Can we please discuss 'moving out of the way' for men?

[VladmirsPoutine]

I've frankly had it and have made it my mission to never move out of the way and just sort of pull my whole-self in a forward position so that it's either we're going to clash or he'll side-step out of my way.

Can I ask all you women to do the same?

I was always somehow subconsciously moving - but fuck it. The pavement is as much my right.

Gahh! Just walked back to work and a man whom I did not move out of the way for motioned me to the left but I walked straight through and thought fuck it. He then turned back to call me a bitch.

Hope everyone else is having a lovely Thursday morning!

When I first read about this on MN, maybe a year ago, I was super sceptical and took the view that some people are just aresholes, regardless of gender. Especially in big cities. But then I started noticing it. Bigger and either "successful" or "macho" men have a air of entitlement about them, a sense of privilege. Not just towards women but towards those less able and, occasionally, towards BAME men too, who somehow seem to be more deferential in that split second. DH has also started noticing this, and me swerving out of the way. There is a point here - it's not about barging into everyone in the name of feminism, but it is about raising awareness of the fact that some traditionally male behaviours are toxic and need more awareness. It's better all round that way. It's about being more aware of others and of your relative size!

Funnily enough I've also noticed people behaving worse since I've been visibly pregnant. Probably because I've slowed down a little. It's disappointing.

What a load of old tosh. 50/50 split between ignorant men & women in my experience...

I walk fast and view other people as obstacles so walking along a busy pavement feels a bit like the game frogger! (Probably showing my age with that one) On the whole, I think since I am moving faster I should move, like cars overtaking.

What annoys me is people (it is mostly men) who won't walk directly behind someone even when they are going at the same speed. It means that to overtake I have to zig zag all over the place.

The worst was on a single-person-width pavement with a high kerb. The people in front of me stepped off the pavement to let a man coming the other way stay on but I had a buggy so I didn't and he just stopped in front of me as if he expected me to bump the buggy off the pavement then up again! I raised an eyebrow and said "seriously?!" at that one and got a mumbled apology.

I’m sorry but this entire thread is ridiculous.
I have never noticed any of this in my entire life.
No it’s not a “man thing” OP. It’s all in your head.

So based on your data sample one, you've decided this issue does not exist and the OP, together with others on this thread who can relate to this, must obviously be making it up because it doesn't happen to fit within your own frame of experience? OK, then...

'data sample of one', that should have said.

Rather than patriarchy chicken why aren't we playing society chicken? Why only reserve this treatment for ignorant men? Can we do it equally to women too?

Yes I started playing patriarchy chicken after hearing about it on the Guilty Feminist podcast. Do it - its a revelation!

This is not about polite people opening doors etc. Its about some men who just cannot understand that it is them that have to move, because they have never had to, and the look of non-comprehension on their faces is a revelation. Some men have just been able to walk - and everyone gets out of their way - and they never think about it.

Until recently I commuted through a busy mainline station every day. About three years ago I realised that I was getting out of the way of men on the station concourse all the time. So I stopped doing it.

My, some guys really object. One chap realised we were on a crash-course trajectory, glared at me and raced me to the spot where we'd collide. I didn't stop or swerve and he waited until the last possible moment before swerving to avoid me. Then walked away glaring over his shoulder at me.

I cycle to work - and they're the same on bikes.
One on his phone, on cycle path (wrong one) cycling at me. I didn't move, he swerved, nearly dropped his phone and headphones and shouted " couldn't you just move aside" to which i shouted "no" and cycled on.
His directional path was on the road, mine was that pavement. Dick.

But why can't we do it to the women too?

I tried this with a friend. Years ago.
He strided along a busy major street with no issues. I tried. Folk stood on me
Yes, male and female so it could have been that
I think it's more likely the 6"7 v 5"3 issue

I don't move for men who are txting... Or women who are doing either. Look where you're fucking going

But why can't we do it to the women too?

generally, because most women don't have the same stinking sense of entitlement to have a road cleared off for them. I did have to say politely to one lass spreading in the seat next to me, that she may not be aware but she squashes me, and she genuinely wasn't aware and apologised. Some posters here actually said men understand what they do and show outward hostility when challenged. Even more reason to do it.

I find it 50/50. And more girls/women walking and texting and not looking where they are going.

This is definitely a thing. I first noticed it after being in a queue in a waterpark on holiday. The queue wound round past the top of the steps. Every single little boy who came up the steps shoved through the queue to get to the end, every girl went round the long way. I was interested how young the entitlement started and wanted to see if it happened in 'real life' too. Once you start noticing it, it's hard not to see it.

Another thing I've noticed, particularly in busy places like stations or often the supermarket, is if you stand aside to let someone coming the other way through a small space, often a man behind will walk past you and go through the gap first. GRR. In fact, a male driver did this in the car the other day, when I'd pulled over to let someone through between parked cars and he sped past me and nearly collided head on with the car coming the other way.

I don't think this is a gender issue for me.

Lots of times there have been people (men + women) walking two or three abreast down the pavement who don't want to move over. I always carry on walking, I'm not going in the road so some CFs can take over the pavement.

Funnily enough, yesterday I was teaching DD aged 8 to 'take up and own her space' and not have to dodge out of people's way in the assumption they had the right to walk her line in the opposite direction (this was in a pedestrianised high street). She did brilliantly. After that, no one bounced their elbows off her head or walked straight at her. It's like, if you behave like you belong there then people move. I'm not saying this always works but it certainly did for DD and I am proud to help her sense of self along.

However, I have my fair share of being walked at myself. Used to get my fighting elbows out as a kid

My mum phoned me incensed this week that a new lady to their exercise class had pushed her way to the front of the class. Apparently she had started off in the middle and then got closer and closer to the lady in front until she moved out of the way and then repeated it until she was where she wanted to be.

I'm going to tell her to repel borders next week and refuse to make way for her.

I've lived and worked in London for far longer than I'm going to admit to and I don't think it is a gender issue - I think it is partly generational - I walked straight through the middle of a bunch of older teenagers today - standing 4 abreast across the pavement as they got off a coach in central London - their dim witted teacher didn't seem to realise that as there were railings on the other side of the pavement no one could get past them until I came along with my evil mother stare. Tell them to line up one after the other or in pairs FFS.

I also think it is a cultural thing - some groups from a range of different cultures near me seem to think it is the norm to stroll along all abreast of each other when there are three + of them whereas other cultures (the Japanese in particular - massive stereotype there no doubt) seem to pair off behind each other. As I child growing up I was always taught that you walked in twos and that one moved behind the other if someone was approaching from the front or behind and you would be in their way. I guess that it is a case of whether you have been brought up with narrow British pavements or wide pedestrian esplanades.