to ask why are we not rioting?

[CanILeavenowplease]

our political system is in chaos....we have a PM who has lost vote after vote...a useless Opposition....no one seems to know what they're doing and if any thread on here is indicative of anything, there is considerable support for no-deal and considerable support for dropping the matter altogether...why are we not rioting? seriously? I don't understand why we are sitting passively by and watching this shower of shite happen/not happen?

@wigglybeezer have to agree with you. My in laws have had a lot of people saying how surprised they are that ‘some one from their background’ would vote leave. Clearly they can’t see how racist most European countries are, probably because they are guilty of the same kind of subtle racism. I think it’s naive to think that brexit will force Britain into the arms of the world beyond Europe or will make Britain less insorutionally racist but I can understand why some ethnic minorotiesmay dislike the EU and the exclusion and European smugness it represents.

If Brexit is truly screwed over we will see the worst riots our country has ever seen is the considered view of many politicians. The end of democracy could spark a chain reaction.

I think it's this - we're just not there yet (and hopefully won't get there) and I suspect it will be food prices that be the fuel as it were and then there will be some trigger event on top.

The whole bread and circus thing is surprisingly apt.

I think the march on Saturday is the closest we'll get to a riot.
Middle-class, middle-aged white people getting together to complain that things aren't fair.
We are British you know .

1tis whose to say those things won't happen in the future any way if we stayed in the eu ? noone has a crystal ball, maybe this is the catalyst of change that has been bought forward 10 years, who knows ?

The only people that riot, habitually, in the UK the feckless nair do wells. And we cant voice out loud who they are en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_England_riots but nearly all involved in Operation Trident.

So why dont we riot? Because we cant be arsed. Vigorously typing in caps lock, marginally illiterate, is so much more likely to bring a result.

Rioting for fun

Other academics have pointed to more prosaic causes of the 2011 riots, citing the carnivalesque atmospheres created through the usual uses of urban space. For example, researchers from the University of Birmingham noted that ‘another sound could be heard above the mêlée, that of laughter. Above the bark of police dogs, and behind the masked and hooded faces of the throng, were smiles, laughter, and shrieks of joy.’[294]

Gang culture

In a Newsnight discussion on 12 August, historian David Starkey blamed black gangster culture, saying that it had influenced youths of all races.[213] The BBC received nearly 700 complaints about his statement that the "whites have become black".[295] Cottrell-Boyce, writing in the Youth Justice journal, argued that gangs were constructed as a 'suitable enemy' by politicians and the media, obscuring the wider, structural and economic roots of youth violence.[296]

Criminal opportunism

During the riots, on 9 August 2011, UK Home Secretary Theresa May said: "I think this is about sheer criminality. That is what we have seen on the streets. The violence we've seen, the looting we've seen, the thuggery we've seen – this is sheer criminality, and let's make no bones about it."[297] Paul Hobbs, London correspondent for One News said that looters are not politically motivated and called the riots "recreational violence".[298] A Manchester rioter said to a BBC correspondent: "Every time I go into town I just think how the shops got smashed up in 2011 by all of us, I just laugh about it every time I go back in now."[299]

The BBC reported that the Chief Constable of West Midlands Police had stated that he thought that the motivation for rioters targeting the city centre was not anger, but greed.[300]

Most of us are intelligent enough to realise that rioting isn’t something to aspire to.

PlainSpeaking - interesting post

@1tislLeClerc most of the leavers I know are liberals and want migration, increased trade with developing nations, trimming down of the NHS etc. Would also suggest you broaden your view on the healthcare point. The American model is just as extreme as the British one. Many countries have far more sensible models that marry a means tested or need basedpuvlic healthcare system with a fairly well run private market with great results.

The only way to hurt this shower is via the ballot box. We need a new political movement.

Brexit hasn’t happened yet, if it is thwarted we won’t see the consequences of that until it happens. At the moment there is every chance it will go through. So no need to riot - but I am in no doubt the people will rise up if there are stripped of their democracy.

It will be about the abject loss of hope, of trust in our parliament and power structures.

17.4 million people are not going to shrug their shoulders and walk away from their hard fought battle, no chance.

Our country will never recover its democratic credentials, stability or recover the trust of the people.

Most of us are intelligent enough to realise that rioting isn’t something to aspire to.

I don' t think it's anything to aspire to either - but historically the British have rioted there’s nothing particular special about British population that mean they would never happen here – it’s just a matter of circumstances which hopefully will be avoided.

{1tis whose to say those things won't happen in the future any way if we stayed in the eu ? noone has a crystal ball, maybe this is the catalyst of change that has been bought forward 10 years, who knows ?}

The EU is very worried about the possibility of serious unrest, and is working very hard to fend it off. The distraction caused by the UK being indecisive is perhaps making the situation worse. What would be very unpleasant would be if the EU were to fall to right wing extremism, as whether the UK is in or out, it will get burned too as the principles behind it are common to the EU and the UK.
The UK is just a small island, whatever delusions it may have and to think it is somehow significantly different to many other places is wrong.
Venezuela, mentioned earlier, was ranking not far behind the UK, Spain etc not many years back but a corrupt government has trashed it. They have petrol, lots of it, it was very cheap, but due to mismanagement and corruption, now hardly any food.

There - they

Brexit is lost, it will be a bloodbath for many many years.
Everyone knows this here in the UK, except for those that live under the delusion that it will never happen to them or their lives.

Make no mistake the anger that most leavers feel once uncorked will deliver the greatest shock to those sitting back thinking they can overthrow democracy without a thought.

I wonder whether the die hard remainers are prepared for the next stage? All the stock piling in the world won’t help them in this scenario.

Phew @HowardSpring , I'm really sorry for casting aspersions.

I agree with your sentiment OP. I'm currently living overseas and am watching this unfold in horror. The Government are a shambles and there doesn't seem to be an effective opposition. The MPs lining up to oust TM seem more interested in their leadership ambitions than solving this crisis. What i dont get is whenever a second referendum is raised the response is that the people have voted - but since there were so many lies told by the leave campaign how can that vote be relied upon?

MPs are gutless selfish cowards who somehow believe that winning a popularity contest (usually due to the electorates inherent sexism, racism and greed) provides a moral mandate.

One side of the Brexit debate is threatening their lives. The other side has proved that they don't care enough about the issue to threaten their lives. Because they are snivelling, pusillanimous weaklings, it's inevitable they will listen to those who are actually threatening them.

I lived in Clapham when the riots happened a few years ago. It was terrifying.

What do you think rioting would achieve apart from getting thuggish people looking for an excuse to join in and cause acts of violence, theft and vandalism.

Protesting and rioting are not the same.

Protests I would happy do but do have young DC.

Rioting is just loutish. Mob mentality takes over and innocent people get hurt and businesses or properties get vandalised for nothing.

I'll leave that to those who encourage violence. I do not.

There won't be riots if we don't leave. There might be a few unpleasant demos, but no real rioting. Why would there be?
If however we crash out and there are shortages of food and medicine...well, yes, riots are likely.

If you look outside the anti Brexit bubble that is Mumsnet a very different picture emerges.

You will struggle to find a single person in favour of riots on here (myself included, I am completely anti violence of any description) but that does not mean it doesn't exist.

Just for the record I was part of a debate that included seventy year middle/upper class kindly old grannies determined to riot of democracy is overthrown, that’s when I realised we are on very very shaky ground.

It won’t be just a few violent thugs or far right zealots it will be hundreds of thousands if not millions and millions of very average but angry people.

The over zealous, over confidence of the remain media is hiding the real truth.

I lived in London when we had the riots, I can’t imagine what would happen if they spread, or if it was nationwide. It was terrifying and distressing and we all understood what happens when law and order totally breaks down, and where we lived it was contained mostly. Next time it may not be. We don’t have the resources to deal with anything bigger.

Let’s really hope it doesn’t come to that 🙏🏻

We're not at the end yet. Once the final outcome is known, then I think you will see unrest.

1tis the eu is changing so much anyway, not always in a good way either, every country will ultimately look after its own interests, they aren't going to think so and so is suffering so we'll aid them. it's human nature that the strongest survive and it's a fact of life whether we like it or not.
there may well be civil unrest and possibly worse due to the extremists but that could have happened even if brexit had never been thought of.
many germans were for merkels open door policy and now many resent it for various reasons. wars start over far less, this is all a potential powder keg waiting to blow.

I totally agree it will not (and has not) be just the UK when it happens, but all over Europe. You could say that France are the first to see this for the last few months.
Politics it seems are behind the movement/ shift on the ground. My understanding is that many countries are trying to respond in different ways. Netherlands for example have just seen their first far right party with a majority in government.

Things are changing quickly at the grassroots. You wouldn’t know it to watch the bbc studiously ignoring all forms of this kind of ‘news’, but it is happening all over Europe. It is unsettling to say the least.

Delores has it spot on. There's too big a gulf between remainers and leavers, they're too busy fighting each other to fight the useless politicians.

If everyone had accepted the vote decision and pulled together to make the best deal for the country we wouldn't be in this mess.