Question about dying re: peacefulness *trigger warning*

[Eliza9917]

I keep seeing people say 'passed away peacefully' etc, but aibu to wonder what a non peaceful passing is?

This is in relation to people that pass at home or in hospital, from old age or illness.

I've been there when a relative passed in a hospice and they developed a rattle the day before which got worse as time went on but what else could mean their passing isn't peaceful?

Apologies if this is a stupid or insensitive question.

‘Peacefully’ in my experience means medicated to the point where they lose consciousness and don’t wake up again to make sure they’re ‘comfortabble’ And not in pain. Once someone has gone on a syringe driver they have a few days at most usually, and it’s a heartbreaking decision to make if your the career/relative as you know it will ‘kill’ them - albeit it just a little earlier than nature might have.

The day before my mum died she was agitated and scared (and couldn’t speak 😥). The next morning she was unconscious. I stroked her head, kissed her and said she could go now to be with dad. 10 minutes later she died.

With hindsight I should have asked more questions when my friend died of cancer . The problem was she didn’t want to die and didn’t want to entertain the topic . And as friend but not family I felt like I had no right to ask . So when another close family
Member died I did research a bit but again there was no real opening to discuss ‘what’s going to happen’ so whilst I knew it was happening I never asked what will make it finally occur . I wonder why I didn’t ?

Often there is a ‘project manager’ who is the closest family member and sometimes we don’t want to tread on their toes ?

I find it strange we cant discuss it , can’t ask about it . I know for months after I was shaken by it .

I think people are so scared and so sensitive to the patient they often forget to ask this critical question

Knowing what I know now means I will push
Push hard for the optimal sedation

I have also researched Switzerland 🇨🇭 and realised you have to join - that’s
My 50th birthday present to myself !

It’s such a universal experience and it not morbid to want to understand how such a major event will play out

Caxx May your beautiful son rest in peace .

My mum died peacefully, to the strains of Let it Be. She's suffered horrendously in the years months and weeks leading up to the day she didn't wake up. She carried on like that for a couple of days-her breathing just got shallower and had bigger gaps between breaths until her last breath. She wasn't in any pain. Me and my brother were holiding her hands. It's was quiet (apart from the low music).

I think that was peaceful.

I don't think it's an awful question-I didn't know what to expect Op either. I hope to dear god that I and my loved ones die peacefully.

I don’t think the op is asking a terrible question, we need to be more open about death, and discuss it. No one has the right to berate someone for asking a general question, we’ve all lost someone, let’s take the mystery out of the process of death. Asking a question about it isn’t insensitive.

trigger warning

My DM died peacefully, only due to the sheer amount of morphine she had been given.

Without the morphine she was trying to get up and out of bed to leave the hospice and go home. She had a crazed look in her eyes that wouldn't focus and she had to be held/restrained by a nurse for her own safety until they could give her additional sedation.
That moment was the most horrendous of my life, I had never seen her like it.

Once sedated, she eventually began with the rattled breathing and I was sitting with her all night, she was still fully sedated. The moment before she took her last breath, she opened her eyes, straight at me, and then died. That was extremely peaceful compared to her earlier agitation

This all occurred within a 12 hour period. And, if I am honest, if she hadn't been sedated, I'm not sure I could have stayed to be with her in such a distressed state

She was only 59 and I was in no way ready for it

I have witnessed three deaths. My GM and both parents. Despite being completely different to each other, they were all totally horrific. The last death was just over two years ago, and I would say that I am now quite traumatized by the whole concept, and have little belief in death as a peaceful end. This post is a healthy dialogue. It looks at both sides, and allows people to discuss their feelings. I don’t think OP is morbidly questioning people for details they are not prepared to divulge.

OP, I don't think there is anything wrong with asking a question like this. It's life, why pretend it doesn't happen.
You put a trigger warning in the title of your thread and yet some posters that get upset with this subject come on a complain anyway!

I don't see the problem with asking the question. All of us will die one day and most of us will lose people close to us. In the UK, generally speaking, most people are unprepared for the reality of death, they prefer to avoid thinking or talking about it, until it's too late. Even more so as people are living longer than in previous generations.

It affects everyone, not just those who have already had a bereavement.

This is why we are are so bad at death in this country. When someone actually wants to hear about the mechanics of the dying process we shut them down and shame them - I find this so unbelievably unhelpful. Op, I don't know if it has been mentioned but Kathryn Mannix has written alot about the dying process. We are all going to die and putting our fingers in our ears about it isn't going to stop that. There are ways to approach it so that we can have the best possible death and that can't be done without hearing about what it can really be like.

I think that birth and death should be spoken about more to alleviate fear and help people cope with it. I watched my grandmother die when I was 19, and no one had told me about the death rattle, so it left me rather distressed. I had to leave the room and I still berate myself for abandoning her in those final minutes.

I don't think the OP is insensitive to ask this. We all need to be prepared for the less peaceful types of death, so we're better able to support each other when we're party to it.

There are many people mentioning that the first time they knew about the death rattle was when they were with a tying relative. To not have known about the death rattle before has made that death more distressing, surely to have knowledge about death and know what may happen less distressing for all concerned including the dying.

Not talking about death in some detail and telling people to use their imagination is not helpful, the unknown is not helpful & the imagination for some is very powerful.

If the op is trying to reassure an elderly person who is frightened of dying, then having knowledge of what’s happening so that she/he can cope will be helpful. At least with knowledge any person is going to be in a better situation to reassure themselves and then be settled to sit with a dying relative.

I would consider slipping away in your sleep being a peaceful death. A death being contorted, groaning, rattling - not peaceful at all.My nan died in the latter manner, her contorted, twisted body will always be in my mind. My dad was ill, but died when he got out of bed, dropped to the floor and that was it. In my mind, that for him, would have been peaceful.

Having read every post on the thread, I definitely agree with what lots of you are saying - how we don’t talk about the realities of death because it’s uncomfortable for most people. I get that, I really do.
I admit, my personal experiences of witnessing death have been mostly violent, scary, unexpected ones (mostly due to my career choice) so the wording of the questions in the OP did rile me - kind of like OP asking out of morbid curiosity, like a kid melting ants with a magnifying glass. But I’ve probably got the wrong end of the stick, and the OP may well be asking as they are supporting someone through the death of a loved one, or expecting the death of a loved one in the near future.
So again, I apologise for my aggression OP - other posters are 100% right, I’ve not dealt with my bereavement because it’s just too hard to deal with, and I choose to block out the emotions of it and am quite blasé and matter-of-fact about the circumstances because that’s easier for me. Which I suppose is a really selfish way to “deal”.

I don't know if it was quite the same as a death rattle but according to my DM my Nonna made whale noises in her last few days.
After that I think she had a last burst of consciousness and started doing the rosary in her sleep so DM prayed with her.
DM and my uncle had been alternating spending the nights with her but she died in her sleep on a night they were both home - I like to think she waited so her DC didn't see.

@mybreadiseggy - I think it’s ok to be ‘selfish’ about how you deal with your own grief. Everyone processes it in their own way. Sorry for your losses.

I also think OP had every right to ask this question. The majority of people will die of an illness, when they are older, and it's useful to have some idea of what might happen to your older family members and how to make it as pain-free and gentle as possible for all concerned.
(Death due to violence or an accident is a different matter: first we want to avoid that entirely, second, all we can hope for is that it happened pretty quickly.)

Earringsand Lipstick. Well, with respect, if the subject matter is so traumatising for you then you shouldn’t have opened the thread. The title was quite clear with a trigger warning. As a PP said, we all have out triggers. The sensible thing is not to deliberately expose ourselves to them.

Canshop dealing with it is the issue though - I haven’t and I really need to.
First step is the hardest right?

When people say 'passed away peacefully' I think it's more about the situation than their experience. It implies an element of preparation. The person was ill, was suitably treated, was very old...

People can die instantaneously in accidents, feeling no pain, but that still wouldn't be described as peaceful.

Tommy Cooper died on stage during a live TV performance. That was dramatic.

There are stock phrases: peacefully, unexpectedly, after a long battle, etc. People choose a stock phrase which reflects the person's situation rather than their actual experience, I think.

Well, I have no personal experience of death. I now have some knowledge of how a non-peaceful death may unfold, albeit that all deaths are different. I’m grateful for that knowledge because I have a better level of preparation than I did before I read these posts. Thank you, OP.

Wanted to offer my heartfelt sympathies to Caxx, and to everyone else who has suffered such devastating losses. It can be good to talk about it

The question the OP has asked on this thread haunted me all the way through a loved one's illness. She had MND and had lost the ability to eat or speak. Eventually I know she would lose the ability to breathe, and by the end of her illness she had endured so much suffering that she was desperate to die.

The illness was worse than her eventual death, which came as a blessed release. I used to lie awake at night going over images in my head where she choked to death, frothed, or fought for breath and was terrified and in horrible discomfort as she struggled to breathe. In the end, she just quietly slipped away.

I am so grateful providence ensured I was there in the room with her. If I hadn't been, I'd always have wondered if her end had been as terrible as it had in my imagination, and I'd not have found any peace.
Notwithstanding, it was still a terrible death as MND is such a cruel disease. And my heart goes out to everyone who describe very different experiences. I think it's completely natural to worry and wonder about these things.

I remember speaking to a nurse once who said that they often don’t want family there when someone dies in hospital. There is a reason why many people die in the night, as the hospital want to it to happen when family aren’t there to spare the family. They just up the morphine slightly.

Most of the ‘bad’ deaths I’ve witnessed/heard about have been because basically no one medical wanted to tell the person or their family they were going to die imminently. My Mum’s best friends death from bone cancer recently was particularly horrific, Mum was there for the whole thing and to be honest I think has some PTSD as a result.

The peaceful deaths have been those that are planned and aware of what will happen. The hospice has been involved, either they are at one or have support at home.

I watched my dog being put down recently, it was painless and peaceful. Frankly I’d much rather go out like that.

I always understood that the term “peacefully” meant that the death was expected. Suddenly means that it came out the blue.