AIBU to remind everyone that the MMR vaccine does NOT cause autism?

[TheHodgeoftheHedge]

Seeing as this worry comes up so many times on MN and in wider life, I feel obliged to post this and remind everyone that MMR has not link to autism whatsoever, as yet another HUGE study has found.

www.independent.co.uk/news/health/mmr-vaccine-autism-antivax-measles-study-andrew-wakefield-a8808086.html

Thanks.

‘Common causes of a false positive ELISA include: administration of flu vaccine, presence of HLA-DR antibodies in multigravada women, presence of rheumatoid factor, positive RPR test, hypergammaglobulinemia (e.g. multiple myeloma) and autoimmune hepatitis’ nccc.ucsf.edu/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/General-HIV-Testing-FAQ-NCCC_revised-060614.pdf
‘False reactivity on the EIA or Western Blot assays can be due to HLA antibody, autoimmune diseases (such as lupus), cross reactivity to yeast, or to other contaminating antigens used to prepare the HIV antigens’

Your point being Cath?? As already said, besides the fact that no test is 100%, any test done is followed up by a confirmatory test, and if that one is also reactive, then further bloods are taken to measure the amount of actual virus in the body.

Because you replied ‘I very much doubt that’ to my comment that the flu vaccine and repeated pregnancy can lead to a false positive.

I also said no test is 100% accurate, but the modern tests come pretty close.

Ok, I’ll explain why...the HIV test, especially the latest 4th generation one if you look at your link above. (Not the crap discredited Duesberg one btw). And your test link wasn’t bad (2014) but there are more recent articles on HIV testing and the earlier generation tests are no longer used so irrelevant.

Where was I? Ok so, the latest test is by necessity highly sensitive and will sometimes throw up false positives (very few but it does happen). Now this is a good thing really rather than it throwing up false negatives and the implications there. ie better to get a false positive and go for a retest rather than a false negative...and not.

As I said, really this is all irrelevant as there are always more tests taken

Still trying to throw red herrings, Cath.

ELISA isn't the only test done. Just because it "can" have a false positive, it doesn't mean it's common at all.
Everyone in the scientific health community is aware of the limitations of immunological tests and cross reactivity of antibodies.

You can't use the small number of eventual ELISA false positives to say that any even remotely meaningful number of people diagnosed with HIV don't have it. It's simply NOT TRUE.

Actually my friend who came with me to the clinic questioned this and wondered if a mistake had been made. Lab errors do occur as we know. I was suitably reassured about the process they go through to check results. Plus, if I wanted, I could go to Superdrug and buy as many HIV tests kits as I want (c£39.99 a pop) for further proof. Then I could take one a month (just to rule out the flu/multiple pregnancy false positives that might get thrown up). For me the result will never change.

Cath I don’t really see the point of this discussion???

Perhaps go back to my previous post before the rd herring sidetracked...

“Btw a lot of people I chat to had late stage HIV, as proven by their very low CD4 count and a multitude of little illnesses attributable to their impacted immune system.

Now oddly shortly after starting ART their immune system started to improve, and continued to do so and eventually they were back to full fitness. Now some might have lead a risky lifestyle beforehand, and continued to lead one afterwards. Others might have done the opposite. The one thing they all shared was that despite any difference in lifestyle before and after, all of them were on ART and for all their health improved.

Then there’s the odd one who for whatever reason and even though healthy on ART, decided to stop taking his meds. I haven’t heard from him in a while...”

Some of us have real life stories that prove the facts. These along with reading from/listening to reliable up to date sources help shape our thinking...not relying on old articles written by extremely questionable sources.

I have 4 dc who have all had the MMR. My last child has autism. Would I give the MMR vaccine to another child (not planning any more) absolutely YES!!

Reading all Cath's posts, I think there's a lot of cognitive dissonance going on.

As in bacteria can't cause disease, except when they manage to overcome our defenses. But they still don't cause disease.

Or is that akin to victim blaming? Men don't rape some women, only when they're vulnerable, so it's women's fault really.

Lweji you clearly don’t understand the point that Béchamp was making.

Bechamp: "Disease is caused by the nature of the soil (the cellular environment of the individual human carrier), the microbes are always there." (E.g. The presence of diseases related to microbes is reliant on the underlying health of the human.)

Consequence: 'Address the soil' - Look at the nutrition, water, physical living conditions, physical stress/relaxation and toxins/sanitation affecting the person to eliminate microbe related disease.

I agree on the cognitive dissonance Lweji (having googled what it means . There is a lot of confused writing and inconsistencies between what she thinks and the thoughts of the people she relies on for information. What she doesn’t know she guesses (to my mind the most telling thing of all). When pushed for information she will either answer and then backtrack or swerve it.

Re the comparison with victim blaming...I do think she would love to say it’s my “fast lifestyle” that caused my diagnosis - which really is kinda funny 😂 😂😂. But then she can’t explain it otherwise (other than implying my result might have been a false positive).

@nancyclancy123 thanks for your post. Sorry to hear about your D.C. autism diagnosis but you are also obviously reliably informed on the subject.

I do think she would love to say it’s my “fast lifestyle” that caused my diagnosis - which really is kinda funny 😂 😂😂. But then she can’t explain it otherwise (other than implying my result might have been a false positive)
I don’t believe the HIV causes AIDS hypothesis. I think the presence of supposed HIV is fairly meaningless. I don’t believe you had a fast lane lifestyle or did anything much to compromise your immune system which is why you don’t have actual ‘AIDS’. I doubt there’s anything wrong with you at all except for the fact you’re taking toxic drugs.

Cath I didn’t mention AIDs. I stopped doing that a while back. I refer to late stage HIV that kills someone. This is to make things simpler for you.

Tbh in the U.K. the word AIDS is not used so much now. Late stage, or end stage HIV is used instead as people (like you) don’t really understand the difference between the 2

So, again, Forget... The... Word... AIDS.

“I doubt there’s anything wrong with you except the fact you’re taking toxic drugs”.

Wow I wonder what that really horrible illness was that I got a few weeks after having unprotected sex that ensured I couldn’t eat or drink for more than 10 days without vomiting, and then a month later half my hair fell out .

And then when I was told I tested positive (twice, note) for HIV...you know that virus you call harmless... that there was absolutely no coincidence?

And then you think I should believe you??? (Of course you will say I don’t have to believe you, but then, why are you posting, hey?)

Really you do spout the most ludicrous unintelligent amount of mislead bullshit EVER 😂

I doubt there’s anything wrong with you at all except for the fact you’re taking toxic drugs.
WTAF?

HIVpos if you don’t want to know what someone thinks then stop asking them or stop misquoting them ...it’s quite simple. Like I’ve said before, there are many many researchers and scientists and doctors that don’t believe the hypothesis either.

Now, the problem with you Cath...is that I know you are talking bullshit, all the other posters in this thread will know you are talking bullshit (especially the more professional ones on here who are qualified experts on this sorts of thing)...however...at some point someone might read this, having just been diagnosed with late stage HIV following a host of unexplained illnesses, and doesn’t fit the criteria for being “that sort” of person to contract HIV. So having read the totally incorrect drivel you have posted, and being absolutely shit scared for their life (as a lot of us are at the time)....

So they decide to believe what you are writing, refuse to take the (according to you toxic) drugs that they are offered, and simply go into denial. Some people will believe anything rather than face up to the truth.

Do you actually know what happens to them? I do as I’ve seen evidence of it..

This will be down to you. Actually I even wonder at the legalities of this, given the implications?

Told you: Cath went full crank a bit further up the thread.

Thing about cranks, certainly the ones with absurd theories about health, is that they are also really horrible people: much of their worldview is that people deserve their illnesses.

That’s why in the end, ‘alternative’ health practice is just a form of debased and perverted religion.

Cath the many researchers etc you have mentioned are from mistrusted, out-of-date crap you keep churning out. They have already been shown as such

Now the reason I have questioned you and engaged with you (despite my much earlier post saying there was no point) was to draw you out, and show your beliefs for what they are. This is to show you up to everyone who reads these posts and explains just how far in your utterly mistaken and misguided disbelief in modern science.

And it worked 😉

@Gilead ... WTAF. I know!

So in future we will know not to trust anything you write on this subject, and can warn others

But then, you have said it’s up to us what we do. You do what you want and we do the same. So if you don’t care, then why post?

Cath can I ask where the HIV / Aids type reactions to fast lifestyles were in the 60's and 70's? A lot of people lead very wild lives then but hmmm no HIV. If not a virus what do you think happened that meant suddenly the wild set were getting ill or dying when they hadn't been 10 years earlier?

Leaving - if that is possible - science to the side for a moment, I do think it is interesting how we assess risk, particularly when the majority of the time the person assessing the risk is not a paid / trained expert in that field.

Someone said above, 1 in a million chance of vaccine damage or 3(?) in 1000 chance of death should you get measles. I guess Cath et al would say that the 3 in 1000 is only once you catch the measles and the chance of catching measles is much lower (no idea what).

Does Cath drive / use a car? Or live in a place with poor air quality. Surely those have a higher chance of causing problems down the line than vaccination?

(I find the risk stats interesting as despite knowing my chance of being in a car accident is much higher than that of air travel, I still “feel safer” driving rather than flying - maybe there is something in what “feels safer” as ? If you don’t vaccinate you can’t be the 1 in the million and you might never get measles either, much like with flying if you do crash you will almost certainly die whereas it is not the same certain outcome with driving)

Or am I nuts? I’m def not a scientist or scientifically minded.

HIVpos, I'm sorry you've been placed in the position of educator. It is extraordinarily rude and cruel of Cath to do that to you, as well as to deride the both the medics and your efforts in research and keeping yourself well and healthy. It's an abominable way to treat someone and quite frankly I feel her views should not be allowed 'airtime', when going this bloody far.