To seethe at articles like this - 'I didn't know who my friends were until I was a mother'

[Likethewind321]

This one specifically:

www.mother.ly/love/motherhood-helped-me-understand-what-real-friendship-is?fbclid=IwAR1DgYhJay05k6JEZ7s4i6blGZ3wwycCsbJhZFWB8rMf3KSq8aXR_ROXSYI

I wonder what happens to all those 'silly frivolous friends who only cared about going out and having fun' Those friends who were shallow, who never really 'got it' ?

I'll tell you! One of two things. 95% of them will all have kids too, just maybe a few months or years later. And when they do, they will then also transform into wonderful human beings who 'get it'. They may not hang out with their old friends but they will become the newfound besties of whichever mums they meet in clinic or playgroup.

And the other 5%? They won't have children, and will silently watch as their friends all turn away and step into the social world of toddler groups, playdates, birthday parties, mummy chat groups, mummy coffee dates and mummy nights out. Watch as they make new friends, friends who 'get it'. This 5% will be dismissed as having never been a 'real friend' in the first place.

And can they complain about it? No. Because if they do they will be thought of as bitter or envious. A bit lonely and sad. They will probably be pitied.

Well guess what. I think it's being childless in a world where motherhood is worshiped, to find out who your friends REALLY are.

"This new page just proves on both sides how easy it is to take offence at something when it involves your own personal struggles and a perceived slight against them"

Because you quite clearly took offence to the post because you read it differently than others have and you then mentioned it was horrible to read because you have postnatal anxiety.

And then when posters like SerenDippitty read it another way, they are jumped on for reading too much into things. I'm just saying, people read and take things differently because of their own situations which is exactly what has been going on on this thread.

I couldn't understand why anyone would write that. I didn't even have that mentality when I was starting to feel anxious. That has never been a thought if I don't do xyz.

@Cside I wasn't "jumping on" SerenDippitty. In fact I'd say the jumping on has been in very much the other direction! I was commenting, I thought quite gently, on a pattern that I felt I could see in her reactions to the posts on this thread.

@Likethewind321

I totally agree with you!

3 of my close friends had children. I don’t (yet). Two seemed to ostracise me once they had kids, no matter how hard I tried to interact and spend time with them. I offered babysitting so they could have couple time, suggested days out/places to go with the children we could do (and I’d drive) if they wanted to meet up and get out. I got nowhere. I was looked down upon and my opinion no longer mattered because I didn’t have a child so couldnt possibly understand anything about anything. When my nephew was born, I tried to use my then newly found Aunty skills and knowledge to contribute to conversations around children, but my opinion wasn’t deemed good enough because I wasn’t a mom myself. My little nephew who I adored as if he was my own (my first nephew!) - I was super excited to be an auntie and was happy I finally had funny kiddy stories I could join in conversations with. But no, because he wasn’t MY child it wasn’t the same and my attempt at conversation was poo-poo’d. I drifted apart from these friends - their own doing, not mine. I tried my best to be a good friend and fit in around their new life, but to no avail.

My other best friend however has a gorgeous 2 year old and we haven’t had any issues. I go round to her house to see her and her little girl and spend time playing with her. We try and go for a meal every few months when possible but I am always happy to go to her house because I fully understand and appreciate that it’s not as easy for her to get out and about as she’d like to. She has a child that has a routine and has to be bathed and go to bed and unless her partner is off work, she can’t just go out for meals willy nilly. And she’s my friend, I want to spend time with her and I want to spend time with her daughter. I don’t care what format that takes. I’ll make whatever effort I need to, to ensure that we get to see each other and I get to see her little one. And she is always conscious not to make me feel bad in anyway that I haven’t had children yet. She knows I want them and is always super supportive. I can ask her questions about what it’s like to be a mom and she will always ask me about my nephew and loves hearing about him. It’s so balanced, it’s a great friendship. Our friendship hasn’t changed at all. Because we both appreciate each other. (Plus she’s blazed the trail for me babywise so I need the inside intel!!)

It pisses me off when I see articles like this. Mainly because I have bent over backwards to ensure my friendships are still going strong. Having a child doesn’t and hasn’t changed my attitude towards my friends. I am happy for them and I want to support them. I understand fully their life and priorities have changed. If I have a child mine will too. And I always ensure that they know I am there if they need me and I will help them any way I can. I love their children like they were my own family and treat them as nieces and nephews.
I get super annoyed when childless people get tarred with the same brush. We don’t all expect our friends to be ready to come places we want to go. We don’t all expect our friends to be at our beck and call. We don’t all expect nothing to change. Some of us realise how hard it is being a mom at times and try and support our friends and make sure they know that friendship is as valued as ever.

I think people should just accept that not all friendships are for life. Lots drift apart as circumstances change and that really doesn’t matter that much. Mums relate better to other mums and childless people with other childless ones.

I was once told ‘old friends need to drift away to make room for new friends ‘.

Mums relate better to other mums and childless people with other childless ones

Horrible, horrible comment.

Browneyes that was lovely!!! And extremely considerate. You remind me of a couple of my friends. Who always offer to come over and double ask if I refuse an say we can meet sonewhere outside lol these are the friends that offer to go to shop, take time appointments etc I always refuse as our friendships are based on give and take.

I feel terrible when I'm running late When baby is needing fed/changed as I'm trying to get out the door but I always let them know I am so they're not waiting around as their time is important too. I feel the exact same way about my friends who don't have children yet for certain reasons and even to the ones that don't want them. When you care about someone you make the effort.

Some of your plans change as in how you used to do things but as long as both parties are happy to spend time together on compromised ground. Ie dinner or lunch or coffee instead of nights out etc just for a small time. Then that's what we do.

You sound like a great friend and i hope you have the same support when you do have them.

I agree with @PurpleDaisies that's not a very nice (or accurate) thing to say @jeanne16

@Samind ah thank you!

Just because one of you has a child, doesn’t mean that your friendship means less or isn’t the same. True friends are true friends. My friendship with my mate hasn’t changed at all. Ok so we have to arrange things a bit differently but it’s not like either of us are into the clubbing scene anymore, so it’s not as if we’re missing out on stuff like that! We both have priorities in our lives. We just work around them.

My friend and I are on the same wavelength. We both always said that we’d never treat the other one differently if we had a child and if we did we were to be honest and talk about it. We’ve never had to because our friendship is strong and has evolved with the changes. We have a genuine interest in each others lives. I think that’s the point of difference.

I think it’s wrong to assume that just because a friend doesn’t have a child and you do that your friendship will fail eventually. If you have a strong enough friendship in the first place then it shouldn’t be a problem. My friend having a child has barely affected our friendship. We’re still the same people we have always been. She just has some additional commitments and priorities that she has to work around and I understand that.

You’re absolutely right that you have to be understanding of each other. It’s not a one way street with one person making all the compromises. You work together as friends and listen and talk to each other. She listens to my problems and I listen to hers. We pay a genuine interest in each other and each other’s lives. It’s really that simple.

Mums relate better to other mums and childless people with other childless ones.

Completely 100% untrue.

I find this super offensive.

My best friend has a child and I don’t (yet). She still relates better to me than anyone else in her life. Because I’m the only one who understands how she thinks. I’m the only one she can talk to and who won’t judge her and will totally get where she’s coming from. That has zero to do with having a child. It’s just who we are as people.

And I might add, the same goes for me with her. She gets me, she gets how I think, feel etc.

HEAR HEAR OP!!! 47 Childless & currently single (double social pariah) with about 1 friend...it sucks, it really sucks!!

As someone who is childfree I will say that I only have one friend with kids and it's someone I rarely hear from and that's a non issue to me. I for the most part could not be close friends with anyone with kids, I don't understand their world and never will(don't want kids myself) and they wouldn't understand mine. That's not to say I go partying, quite the opposite but the common ground would be very little if anything at all.
I did have a friend from school once who had two kids but she lives in my old hometown and we're not friends anymore more due to the fact she's changed into everything I dislike in a person. Whether having kids has done that to her i dont know but we were not close friends anyway due to being 120 miles apart.
It's difficult in my opinion to be friends with someone with kids if you're childfree as the gulf between you will always be huge due to it.
'Transform into wonderful human beings' ...that kind of sentiment makes me eyeroll and those of us without kids would eyeroll at that as it shows the different mindset people with kids have compared to those who haven't which is another reason why friendships between the two are so difficult.

The one friend with kids is 120 miles away also I thought I should add btw.

I remember reading this article at the time & I have taken it completely different to you.

I can relate to this article as some of my friends aren’t the friends they used to be since I am the first and only one thus far to become a mother. I can’t do things like I used to & they don’t get it!!! They may do one day but currently they don’t.

I also had a very traumatic birth and I had nobody close to speak to about this until I met other mums at classes and stuff who could relate to what I went through.

Friends do change and people come and go and I get that now.

So much nonsense on this thread. Of course your baby will not die or suffer if you are not 'totally consumed' by him or her Millions of adults in this country survived a childhood peppered with a healthy dose of inattentive parenting and lived to tell the tale.

Yes, a newborn is dependent on its parents or 'caregiver' in order to survive. And yes, in the early days, weeks and months your primary focus will be on that baby which is completely normal. However to be completely and utterly obsessed is not and it generally gives way to extreme anxiety and irrational fears about the baby's health so really not a desirable state of affairs.

A balanced approach involves sharing the load with a spouse/partner/family member. Allowing a baby to monopolise your every waking moment without taking a break will send you crazy with exhaustion.

I don't keep talking about my baby! But half my mind is on her

I'd be surprised if any adult managed to have a conversation where half their mind wasn't in other things! Don't worry about it

Eastie77 your last paragraph was what happened me leading to anxiety. Turned into a big gatekeeper. All good now though. (Well getting there) 😂😂😂

The not sharing the workload bit*

listen to their work problems.

Not the first time even on this thread that assumptions have been made that childless women can only talk about work problems, work gossip or relationship problems.

Yet when we say that mothers only talk about their children there is an uproar ams snide comments about how this is a parenting website (it really isn't anymore).

If some of you could only talk about work and relationships before you had children then you are incredibly boring people. Most people I know, regardless of their parenting status, have other topics of conversation.

Mums relate better to other mums and childless people with other childless ones

Sorry I know we've sort of moved past this comment but... My God what a load of absolute nonsense.

Most people I know, regardless of their parenting status, have other topics of conversation.

Very much so.

My friend loves gossip. We will chat and put the world to rights, gossip about people we know (usually people we don’t like), rant about people who have pissed us off that week, talk about our partners and what they’ve done to piss us off that week , talk about new foods we’ve tried, tv shows we watch and just what’s happening in both of our lives in general.

In fact the reason we both get on so well is because the pair of us can never stop talking We’ve had the piss taken out of us for years for being chatterboxes! We go off on that many tangents when we talk, it’s a miracle we ever remember what the hell we were talking about in the first place . We’ve been like this for 10 years. Her having a baby hasn’t changed the themes of our conversations at all. We still chat shite

I for the most part could not be close friends with anyone with kids, I don't understand their world and never will(don't want kids myself) and they wouldn't understand mine

That's more about you as you though, not the fact you don't have kids. One of my dearest friends is childless, not by choice. We get on great still, she's just a lovely person who's very deep, who loves to talk to and be around her friends, kids or no. She's not shallow at all that way.