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Original poster

To refuse this sleepover - 13 year old

247 replies

secretsquirrelthethird · 20/02/2019 16:20

Namechanged for this, as don't want it linked to my posting history.

I have a 13 year old daughter (just turned 13). A year ago she moved schools, and has taken a while to settle in and establish a friendship group. So far so good, has been to some parties and has had sleepovers with a couple of her friends.

It's a bit of a minefield now she is older, but we insist on talking to parents first if she is having a sleepover and take her to the house so we can meet the parents (and establish that they are there!). This may seem a bit heavy handed, but I have a 22 year old, so have grown a bit wise and suspicious..... my daughter objects to this, as she feels it makes her "babyish", but at the same time she understands we are making sure she's safe.

She has a friend in her group who is a trans boy (FtM), who goes by a boy's name at school, and insists on pronouns him/his/he, let's call him James. James' friendship group is all girls.

My daughter has now asked to go to James' birthday party and join in with a sleepover at James' house, as two of her other friends are going. After asking, all of them are going to be sleeping in James' room on blow up beds. I have said no, as I would not let her sleep at a boy's house on a sleepover, and as James is identifying as a boy, I will treat him as such. My daughter said "oh but James isn't really a boy, he just thinks she is, so why can't I sleepover? You let me sleep over at girl friends, what if they were lesbians?" This is causing no end of arguments, and I do feel sorry for James if this is going to impact on the birthday celebrations, but to me if James is identifying as a boy, then I should be treating him as a boy in all aspects.

I have offered the compromise of attending the party until 10.30pm and then I will pick her up, but apparently the sleepover is the best bit, and I am just doing this to be mean.....

My older child was a boy, and whilst we had similar sleepover issues, we haven't any experience of transgender friends in this scenario.

Do you think I am being unreasonable?

OP posts:
Original poster
secretsquirrelthethird · 20/02/2019 16:46

GatherlyGal thank you - the body parts thing does make it easier to think through. I guess I want to treat James like a boy and respect their wishes, but in doing that I am being a bit rigid. In a way, as soon as she said “can I sleepover at James’ house” my knee jerk reaction was to say no, you can’t stay at a boys.

OP posts:
1CantPickAName · 20/02/2019 16:46

I would be inclined to let her go as long as the parents were there.

I have a 12 year old and dd who was trying to explain to me that kids in her school are pansexual! It blew my mind how mature the conversation was! Times have definitely changed since I was 12

anniehm · 20/02/2019 16:46

The trans thing is tricky for us adults but our kids are far more accepting. I let my dd have her ftm trans friend sleep over and vice versa, I've known him since he was a she!

Redglitter · 20/02/2019 16:46

But the fundamental difference is James isnt a boy in all aspects. The reason you wouldnt let her go to a mixed sleepover doesnt exist in this scenario. If everyone else is staying dont have your daughter be the one with the 'disapproving' mum. Which is probably how it'll be seen

Juells · 20/02/2019 16:47

TBH I would worry about ROGD

Juells · 20/02/2019 16:48

It blew my mind how mature the conversation was!

It would blow my mind that a 12-year-old was being exposed to such shit.

MyDcAreMarvel · 20/02/2019 16:49

By your logic you would be fine with your dd sleeping in a room with a child with a penis who claimed to be a claims to be girl.

LilQueenie · 20/02/2019 16:50

The question is why don't you want her to have a sleepover at a boys house and if it was a lesbian would the answer be the same.

tbh the only thing that springs to mind as a difference is sex and pregnancy. Clearly that is not an issue here.

Purplecatshopaholic · 20/02/2019 16:50

I wish James all the best, he must be going through a tough time. But if you wouldnt let your 13 year old sleep in a boys room (and I personally wouldnt), you need to stick to your guns on this (IMHO)

NunoGoncalves · 20/02/2019 16:50

Yeah, feels like you're doing it just to make a stupid point. You want your daughter to be safe. Fine. Normal. There is no great risk to her from sleeping over at an FtM trans boy's house with other friends. So you're not stopping her for her safety. You're doing it because of your own agenda. At least admit that.

MaiaRindell · 20/02/2019 16:51

I would let my DD go. She is 12. She has been to a sleepover at her male friend's house. He has always been a very feminine boy and dresses as a girl at home and out of school. He has confided in DD1 that he likes boys. I know both parents and there was a group of four girls going.

LaurieFairyCake · 20/02/2019 16:51

Unreasonable.

I wouldn't allow mixed sleepovers due to risk of pregnancy because of fucking.

Fucking other girls is fine to me 🤷‍♀️

RaffertyFair · 20/02/2019 16:51

Pronouns don't get you pregnant.

I can't see why you would object to the sleepover on the basis of language.

Biology is a different matter

SirVixofVixHall · 20/02/2019 16:52

Gender is nonsense. As a pp said, this is a confused, very young girl. We segregate older children by sex for a reason, gender feels are not a reason. As long as no males are sleeping over too then I don’t see the problem.

NunoGoncalves · 20/02/2019 16:54

Maybe just change your rule to "you're not allowed sleepovers with anyone who has a penis". Since gender is fluid and all that. Base the rule on sex instead.

Original poster
secretsquirrelthethird · 20/02/2019 16:55

Threeanklebiters This is not a trans bashing thread and I am glad I have posted as other posters experiences, particularly those with trans children, are really helpful. I haven’t had to deal with anything like this before with my older child. I realise that in my efforts to respect James’ choices and treat him as I would any other boy I am being too rigid.

OP posts:
areyoureallysaying · 20/02/2019 16:56

we've always had mixed sleepovers

BiggerBoat1 · 20/02/2019 16:57

I think you're being over protective. I have a 13 year old DD and I would certainly let her go in these circumstances.

Motherofcreek · 20/02/2019 16:59

You gave her a compromise.

If your not comfortable with it stick to the compromise or no party all.

It's ok for children to be told no sometimes.

Tbh I'm not a big fan of sleep overs anyway!

Original poster
secretsquirrelthethird · 20/02/2019 17:01

NunoGoncalves there is no “agenda”, and the “stupid point” I was making was to respect James’ decision to be treated as a boy.

OP posts:
ThreeAnkleBiters · 20/02/2019 17:01

Fair enough OP. I would say that a 14 year old should be able to identify as a man but they are still clearly not a trans man at this stage - they're too early in their development. They obviously are physically female, they pose no risk to your DD. I would respect their right to identify as male but your only concern surely is the safety of your DD - not the identity of her friends. Unless your DD's safety is compromised I can't see why you'd stop her seeing her friend at the sleepover.

Original poster
secretsquirrelthethird · 20/02/2019 17:02

Nunoclaves - Maybe just change your rule to "you're not allowed sleepovers with anyone who has a penis". Since gender is fluid and all that. Base the rule on sex instead.

This way of thinking actually makes things a lot clearer thanks.

OP posts:
blueskiesovertheforest · 20/02/2019 17:02

James can't impregnate anyone, is as unlikely to be physically stronger anas unlikely to pass on an std to your DD as any other 13 year old without a penis.

Natal sex is what matters for mixed sleepovers unless you are going to ask everyone about sexual orientation!

TheDizzyRascal · 20/02/2019 17:05

I don't have a 13 year old girl but I'm pretty sure this wouldn't bother me in the slightest, particularly as there will be a few of them there, not just the two of them. My niece is the same age and she has sleepovers with both boys and girls at her house and no-one bats an eyelid, they can be friends with both sexes! I would relax and let her go, I don't see the harm in it but hope you find a solution for both you and your daughter, I imagine teenage girls are tricky to handle lol xxx

Jaxhog · 20/02/2019 17:05

Hmm. Damned if you do, damned if you don't! I think I would allow it, simply on the basis that James cannot get her pregnant.