Abortions and men

[Lollypop27]

After watching tonight’s Call the midwife Dh and I had a discussion about terminations. We were talking about the how the state of New York passed a bill for abortions up to full term. It ended up quite heated.

I am of the mind that whatever I may or may not do in a situation has no bearing on what another woman would do and that it is not my right to decide for her. Any time any reason. Dh completely disagrees. Not on time limits or anything but he feels that the father of the child should have a decision and his thoughts should be taken in to consideration. I could kind of understand what he was saying but he couldn’t give me an answer when I said what if the woman didn’t want an abortion and the male did. Would he then have the right to force it upon her? He said it was a completely different thing. I disagree. If a male can can decide that the female keeps the child then surely he would be able to decide if she can’t?

This isn’t another thread about if you agree with terminations or not. Or the time limits but if you feel the male should have a decision.

Until men can get pregnant and carry a child, they can fuck off.

Thank you for your replies. I agree with a pp who thinks he may have a blinkered view of his fathers rights to his children and a fetus.

We must never, ever be in a position where men can legally dictate what women do with their bodies. It would all be well and good to force a woman to give birth to a child she doesn't want, in the mean time Superdad has 9 months to change his mind and bugger off, leaving women holding the baby they never wanted.

Also on a practical level it would never, ever work. If the process was to declare the name of the father, a woman desperately seeking an abortion would likely just say "no idea it was a one night stand". What happens then? Who decides? What if she is raped?

I got one really don't think men's opinions on abortions are ever valid. That same way my opinions on prostates aren't

No uterus, no say.

I personally don't agree with abortions past the first trimester for unless for extreme cases like the woman's life depending on it or the baby being very ill. But it's up to a woman to decide what she should do in that first trimester, no one else. Not the father, not her parents, not me, only her.

Nope, his rights end when his sperm enters the woman's body.

The child will then have rights if it is born.

While it is in her body, it is only her decision.

Is very simple.

It has to be the woman's choice.

Woman's choice.

I can sort of understand where men are coming from with this argument, as they do ultimately get no say in whether or not they become a father which is a huge, life changing thing and they don’t get to influence it at all.

But in allowing men to have a say, women will either be forced to have a baby they don’t want, or an abortion they don’t want.

Men cannot have say without stripping women of the rights to their own bodies, therefore men cannot have a say.

It absolutely has to remain the woman's choice. No way in the world can anybody but the woman have a say on whether or not she has a baby. There could potentially be some grey areas and for the avoidance of any abuse of these grey areas there needs to be a blanket 'her body, her choice' rule.
The only slightly comparable reverse scenario I can imagine is if a woman and a man are in a relationship/have a one night stand/have split up, whatever might involve sex, and that woman, backed by the law of the land, could insist that the man makes her pregnant, naturally or by providing her with sperm. The man has no say in it at all. Of course it is ridiculous to suggest this is ok.

I'm afraid probably something like 75% of abortions are indirectly a man's choice because they won't step up and take responsibility and women are the ones left to deal with the situation.

For instance I often think abut a woman whose husband had dumped her when she became pregnant with baby 2. Baby1 needed a series of surgeries for a congenital disorder over the next year. She felt unable to properly care for baby1 whilst going through pregnancy and birth of baby 2 without any support.
I told her she was making the right decision to prioritise baby 1.
I wish I had been able to point her to some practical and financial help because she would have had that abortion if her husband wasn't a dick. Was that a woman's free choice? Of course it wasn't.

I completely understand that a man has an emotional involvement in the decision about whether or not to abort and if the woman wishes to consult him about the decision then he can say what he thinks/feels. However, ultimately it is the woman’s decision because it is her body.

I faced the reality of this debate when my partner vehemently wanted me to have an abortion I didn’t want. He kept saying it was a decision we should make together as a couple. I ultimately told him it couldn’t be a ‘couples decision’ because there was no middle ground compromise and it was my body and I didn’t want an abortion, so my choice had to be the final decision and not his. I wished there was a solution that would have made us both happy, but ultimately there wasn’t and so my choice overrode his because I was the one who was pregnant and whose body was going to be medically/physically affected by whatever choice I made.

It's an appalling idea that anyone but the woman should make that decision.

How on earth would that work anyway? Someone would have to have the final say whether it's to abort of to continue with a pregnancy and as it's the woman's body that final decision should lie with her.

Is he envisioning it getting to a court case and some sort of court making the decision. So then a woman might to be forced to have an abortion or forced to continue with a pregnancy against her will depending on which way the father of the child wants it to go? Or does she get a say in this?

How can he possibly think that's acceptable?

It's actually made me feel quite uncomfortable imagining how a woman would feel being put in either of those situations.

Does it work the other way in his book? If a woman wanted her partner to have a vasectomy, would she able to go to court to make him and possibly have the final say over his body?

No, of course not.

When men get pregnant then they can bebthe one to decide what goes on in their bodies.

Ask him what kind of man would force a woman to keep a baby in her body and give birth completely against her will,

Sounds like something from the Handmaid’s Tale.

I would honestly go wild with my partner if he came out with stuff like this.

I get that it’s their DNA and they feel helpless but they need to think this through. And not be such knobs

a man can have his say but ultimately its the womens choice

As a man I don’t believe in full term abortion. If after a minute of a woman gives birth is it ok to club it over head and kill it? Rhetorical question as obviously everyone will say no. What about one minute before? Is it just a foetus and her body her choice? Most people will say no again but there are others who say it’s their right and I have to do disagree

My message above is nothing to do with men’s rights though. Just think its wrong

As a man
What’s that got to do with anything? Men don’t all have the same views on abortion.

No one should ever force a woman to have a child.

If a man doesn’t want a woman to abort “his baby” then he should do everything in his power to make sure she doesn’t get pregnant in the first place.

As soon as he has sex with her, he has to accept the chance that a pregnancy may be the outcome - sometimes contraception fails.

Her body, her choice.

@Caucho really? If you actually read up on it you’ll find only under certain circumstances eg. The fetus’s life isn’t viable or is a danger to the mothers life are terminations allowed up to full term. Otherwise it’s 6 months. It’s the exact same as the law here.
Ops question- short answer: No. long answer: yes, but limited ie, can tell her what he thinks, which will be part of her decision making process, but that’s it. It’s her body. Her decision.

Since when did we all use the American term fetus
And not foetus

Anyway aside from that. No one goes through a late term abortion for shits and giggles. EVER

And 3 doctors have it agree to it.

So anyone has a problem, I suggest they get a medical degree and specialise in this area and then make a fucking comment, then I might listen to their opinion

Woman's choice full stop.

No.

I think the man's opinion counts. I think the man should ideally be able to choose whether or not he becomes a father. But the baby is inside the woman. So the man cannot be able to choose.

In situations where the woman wants the baby and the man doesn't, I don't think it matters that much that the man has no say. He knowingly risked pregnancy and he doesn't have to do anything too hard to be a father so just has to suck it up.

In situations where the man wants the baby and the woman doesn't, I feel desperately sorry for the man. Losing your child and being able to do nothing to save them must be so, so hard. But it can't be helped. Because the only other way is even more intolerable. We can't have forced births and the complete dehumanising of pregnant women.

My view it's simple.

When a man can carry a child he can have an opinion on his own pregnancy but no one else's

My opinion doesn't change for a woman either.

My body my choice, her body hers even if I think the reasons are wrong.