Tell me - is this rascist?

[PooleySpooley]

Son is mixed race. I am white as are his siblings. He has rarely experienced any racism. He has a really good relationship with his father and his family who I am not with.

He has a PT job.

He told me today that while he is working the checkout he often gets asked “where he is from” and when he says “here” the questioner will probe “originally”.

This shocked me and pissed me off because in my head the questioner is probing more because his answer is unacceptable to them because DS doesn’t look like what the questioners idea of what a British person looks like.

A very good friend says he should be encouraged to be proud of his heritage (which he is but there are many strands to that as it’s a grandparent who is Asian and he has three other grandparents) and is it ok for him to be asked this continually?

I get asked this all the time. I find it racist especially when I say England and they ask where I'm from originally. 😡😡 Been English 100% of my life!!

The question annoys me anyway as the place that I was born is not the same as the place I live in now. I've lived in 3 other countries as an expat too and my parents are different nationalities.

I find it racist tinged rudeness. Not fully racist but indicative of a person’s views on belonging and otherness as well as their education levels and manners, and as having a cumulative racist effect.

I don't know if it's racist, I guess tone of voice matters? But t is ignorant. I'd tell him to cite the hospital of birth.
On the other hand I've learned over 3 years with a visibly disabled son that people do not get that personal questions they have no need of an answer for can feel rude and intrusive. People feel like they have a right to as much info as they want because they're just "showing an interest"

If he looks duel heritage perhaps he's just intriguing people as they can't place his cultural heritage but it's still rude

I'd say it possibly is racist, definitely 'othering'. Suggestion being that you're not quite like us.

I'd not ask someone but I'd usually wonder. I'm white but have ancestors from different countries and I do find it fascinating.

The difference for me compared to your son is that because I'm white with a mildly Northern accent so nobody has ever asked where I'm from. I'm accepted as being British straight away.

I'm mixed race and can't bring myself to get annoyed by it. By 'originally' people mean 'what is your heritage'. I can't really be arsed to be pedantic about the way they said it. It's ignorance at best.
It's a bit annoying but to call this racism is laughable.

'What's your ethnicity' would be fine, if possibly intrusive. 'Where are you from originally' is definitely rude here.

Funnily enough, when I grew up in Dubai we'd have ripped the piss royally out of anyone who said they were from Dubai (unless they were part of the 10% that were actually Emirati) because it was just accepted that you came from wherever your parents came from. I swiftly learned this is not how it works in the UK

I have my own get out of jail free card on this anyway; if I ask someone where their name's from and they get huffy, I then cheerily hold forth about my own weird name and mixed background. They sort of deflate then and we have a civil conversation. It's about establishing good intent, I suppose..... I couldn't be half as most if I wasn't mixed myself

It is racist because it’s basically saying “well you can’t be British because you’re not white”

There’s never any need to grill strangers on their ethnic background. And certainly never ever any need to challenge them when they answer that they’re from here!

Half as nosy, dammit!

It is racist - the question being asked is based on an innate belief that a brown person cannot be British by birth.

Asking someone their heritage out of genuine interest isn’t the same.

Nor is asking someone with a non local accent. I asked a similar age to me, black man where he was from, he responded “Britain”, when I responded “yeah obviously, I meant where in the South, I mix up proper London and estuary accents”, he visibly relaxed. That shocked me though and opened my eyes to what people of colour experience every day.

I think a lot of people who ask this are interested in the diversity of the origins of the people around them. It doesn't just happen to people of colour. I live in a majority white country where pretty much everyone is an immigrant, lots of people want to know where you are from. I immigrated here and so, although I look like the majority population (white), I get asked it more than usual once people have heard me speak and clocked my accent is foreign.

I know it pisses off some people who get asked it a lot and there is a disproportionate impact on people of colour, especially somewhere like the UK, so there is an element of racism in the impact, if not in the intent. Whether your son is pissed off by it or not is up to him, though.

It is racist - the question being asked is based on an innate belief that a brown person cannot be British by birth.

I completely disagree and think this is looking far too far in to the question. I've been asked this so many times. I'm half blank African half white British. I'd say almost 100% of the time people were just tactless and wanted to know my ethnic origin. I don't think any of them were under the impression I couldn't have been born in London.

Half black, not blank 🤦🏽‍♀️

Boom it’s not the same.

I’m British living in the USA. People ask about my accent every day. But I’m white. No one is implying I don’t belong.

And they are shocked if I describe myself as an “immigrant”.

Definitely not OK, he needs to emphasise "here" again and again.

There's quite a funny sketch on Come Fly With Me, a comedy David Williams and Matt Lucas did some years ago about airport staff, and the racist customs officer is asking one of the mixed race runway workers "So where are you from then?". "Bradford". "No I mean originally?" "Oh, sorry. Sheffield". "Well where were your parents from?". "Hull." he needs to be that guy!

dangerrabbit I thought of that video - it’s spot on!

Is there a polite way to ask about someone’s heritage? Genuine question, currently I don’t ask at all unless they volunteer. BUT I love to travel and find out about different cultures, so if there’s a universal way to ask without offence...

Locally we have a very regional accent, except I don’t, because I work with international teams over the phone. Had a huge argument with someone who insisted I couldn’t be local because of my accent :( nowhere near as bad as being judged on sight but gave me the rage.

As an aside I can't quite believe people are comparing what clearly is a racist situation to comments during pregnancy and comments about a different accent or saying it's just people being friendly . Who let's these people into MN?! Did someone leave the door open?

@Hanumantelpiece I want to be friends with your friend

Hanu me too!

I think it’s just a clumsy way of showing interest in someone else’s heritage. Our DC are Spanish / Iranian / Argentinian. Two are much more Asian in appearance with very black hair and dark eyes. One has green eyes and much lighter hair and one is fairly Euro- looking. People don’t really ask where they’re “from,” but I have been asked if they all have the same dad! DH is sometimes asked about his heritage, but he doesn’t care and neither do I. Why would I? It’s hardly anything to be ashamed of. On their schools (SW London) most people of of a mixed background and nobody bats and eyelid.

@GunpowderGelatine i am British but my parents are a mix, and a slightly unusual one.
I often get asked - and I know what people are curious about. They want to know what is my ethnic makeup. I don’t find it racist it all. I get asked if all the time. I have hardly ever felt that there was a negative feeling behind it. More just people being curious and unable to pinpoint me. Most people seem to get some kind of pleasure when they hear the mix and ask how my parents met etc. It generally is always a pleasant chat.
It’s not ‘clearly a racist situation’ at all.
It’s all subjective.

It's a very strange thing to ask somebody who's serving you in a shop. It's very nosey and, as a white person, I think it's passive racism.

If somebody works in a shop, they're almost certainly from the same town/area or a nearby one.

As PP have said, if you have a clearly foreign accent, it's obvious that you aren't originally from this country. If they were a regular customer and you struck up a rapport with them over time, it's the kind of question they might ask, along with do you have any kids? Did you see xxx on the telly last night? etc. As a general rule, if it's their first question and/or asked before they've actually greeted you or asked your name (if it isn't on a badge - and told you theirs), then it's racially motivated.

The main determiner would surely be what their response is to the information once you've answered their question. If it's to comment "I thought you might be Jamaican! We have friends out there we visit a lot; I wish we were there now!" then it's still very misguided, but probably intended to come from a good place.

if their response is to cast doubt on your answer or just reply with a dismissive "Oh", then it is racially motivated. It's in the same category of prejudice as asking a female plumber how long she's been in the job when the same person wouldn't dream of asking the same question of your male colleague (unless, say, she looks 15 and he's in his 40s).

It's shorthand for saying "I have misgivings about you because you look 'different' - you need to justify yourself and satisfy me of your abilities or intentions in order to gain my acceptance".

I would advise him to answer their question with a question and force them to confront their prejudice (or at least show themselves up - make them squirm):

"Where are you from?"
"I do work here, Sir/Madam - how can I help you?"
"Yes, but where are you from?"
"Why do you ask?"
"I just wondered."
"What made you wonder - does it matter?"
"Erm, well, you look, um, different."
"Do I? Have I changed since you were in here last?"
"No, I mean.... your skin is a different colour."
"No, it's always been this colour."
"Noooo - you're not white."
"Oooooh, I've noticed that as well!! Is that relevant? Did you want serving? Sorry, we're quite busy here."
"Yes, of course - I just didn't know if you'd be able to help me."
"Why? Because of my colour?"
"Errrrrmmmmmm........."

These people need calling out, even if only for their own good, as consciously or subconsciously, it's racism. Just because they aren't shouting it at you as abuse, it's still totally unacceptable.

I am mixed too. I get asked this all the time too. I try to read the context and askers intent and answer politely. I get a bit short when it's coming from a place of - you're not white so you don't belong. I also answered 'Here' when I lived in UK. And would keep answering 'Here' until someone asked me where my parents were from.

I've been asked this a lot. I don't find it offensive, personally, as it's due to curiosity rather than malice. It's also not only white people who ask.

If people really think this is so offensive, I don't think there's anything wrong with starting up an educational conversation about it. Being difficult when you know someone is just trying to ask a simple question is pointless. Unless they genuinely are being racist (at which point I would refuse to serve them), then it's a bit stupid to act like you don't know what they mean.

What's wrong with saying 'by the way, I know you're only curious about my heritage, but the way you're asking could offend some people - just a heads up' then explain how you'd prefer to be asked about your heritage. If you'd rather not be asked you can just tell them that.