To allow dd12 to attend my smear test?

[Toomanychefs]

I have my smear test tomorrow. Mentioned it to dd and she asked if she could come with me. I said yes, of course, but dp thinks I'm totally out of order.
So not to drip feed, my dm is a cervical cancer survivor, my smears are always clear, dd has just had her hpv jab at school.
Dps ex wife has never had a smear test as she's 'too private and doesn't want to be violated'
My thoughts are, 'get her to realise its not a big deal so she has no problem going for hers'
Dp says I'm going to scar her for life.
She's not going to be standing at the end of the bed watching the intricate detail (although I'd happily allow her to if it meant she'd realise the importance)
Aibu?

Goodness me, DD saw nothing. She wasn't in your room without a curtain, she can't have learnt anything. She's either in there to see what goes on or isn't! What a wasted trip for her after asking to see what went on.

I'd be thinking it's more a case of which teens actually want to be present to see their DMS vulva, providing DM OK with that.

Nobody should be slated for wanting to reveal or not.

Actually the OP herself said her DD was the other side of the curtain so she wouldn't have seen her mother having a smear test.

No I didn't say that anyone said all women should do this.

Some poster on here have called women who didn't think it necessary for a child of 12 to see her mother having a smear test weird, prudes, victorian and so on.

I assume they meant anyone who didn't want to take their children to see them having a smear test not just some people who didn't want to take their children to see them having a smear test.

Due to the fact it would highlight cervical cancer in some women younger and maybe save one life

It would also mean many younger women would have unnecessary treatment which apart from all the stress and worry could have long term effects. This happened a lot in the 80s when they did test women as young as 16. There are pros and cons but ultimately this has been weighed up by the experts e.g. the UK national screening committee and the World Health Organisation (who say 30 years btw) and who will know a lot more than you about it.

I never professed to be an expert in this field nor have I read a study from 30yrs ago. I do however have an opinion, there will obviously be women who will get the all clear and may seem to be "wasted" resource for the NHS and put other women through "undue stress" but in my option it is worth it if it saves a life.

...but if women don't think it should be a spectator sport they reveal what awful prudes they are.

I am going to invite my whole family to my next one just to prove how unprudish I am.

Tigger001- it's no just "undue stress". Treatment can cause long term effects so they only want to do it if necessary.

@Dungeondragon15 I have never been made aware of that. Apologies then, but what long term effects does the test produce ?

There is a chance of infection which can obviously cause problems for the future. There is also a slightly increased risk of premature birth in future pregnancies.

I thought the risk of premature births was only if you had part of your cervix removed in a colposcopy not just by having the screening test. It doesn't mention that on the NHS cervical screening section which is not acceptable if it's a risk and they are not disclosing it.
I suppose there is a risk of infection In any procedure, I can't find any stats or information on it specifically from smears to see how sever an issue it is

I thought the risk of premature births was only if you had part of your cervix removed in a colposcopy not just by having the screening test.

I didn't say that it was cause by the screening test! My point was that false positives and unnecessary treatment such as colposcopy were common in women under 25 and it doesn't cause undue stress. It can also have long term effect such as premature birth.

Sorry it's was because they were examples given in response to my question of "what long term effects does the test produce " we must have had crossed wires. So the test itself. Causes no risk it's if there is unnecessary treatment,t this causes risk

I have seen stats showing that there is actually a higher percentage of women having an unnecessary colposcopy in the age range of 30 to 39 (71.4%) than in 20 to 29 year olds (69.1%). I couldn't find any other showing it higher in testing younger, do you remember where your stats were from as I am genuinely interested in finding out

Tigger if you are talking recent England stats then as testing doesn't start till age 25 comparing 20-29 to 30-39 makes no sense?

I also think there is a difference between unnecessary colposcopy which requires no treatment and colposcopy which indicates treatment which may or may not be necessary?

I couldn't find any other showing it higher in testing younger, do you remember where your stats were from as I am genuinely interested in finding out

There won't be any recent stats because they stopped testing in under 25s. Anyway, it is explained here:

publichealthmatters.blog.gov.uk/2014/04/28/what-is-the-right-age-for-cervical-screening/

I wonder if we will still be offering routine cevical screening when the OP's daughter is 25.

Given the success of the HPV vaccine in cutting this disease ( and will be rolled out to boys too from 2020) having the DD attend the visit may well be a wasted exercise.

@howabout the stats I referred to were for colposcopy carried out that were unnecessary as the abnormal cells would never have gone on to develop into cancer.

I was not referring to any timescales of statistics, just any that relate back to and back up why the uk national screening committee advise this, I can't find any so was just wondering if you guys knew of any to give me a more informed decision rather than just just because thats what they saydeveloped into c

That last bit in bold is posted in error

I was not referring to any timescales of statistics, just any that relate back to and back up why the uk national screening committee advise this, I can't find any so was just wondering if you guys knew of any to give me a more informed decision rather than just just because thats what they saydeveloped into c*

What informed decision? You don't need to decide whether women under 25 year old should have a smear. The UK National Screening committee, The International Agency for Research on Cancer and the WHO have made than decision. If you want to see the evidence they looked at you would need to ask them.

Sorry my mistake, I meant an informed opinion !!! I am aware I have no decision in this process lol I have always believed that the age should be reduced and I have never seen anything to prove a reason against that, I completely understand what you are saying that I should follow the opinion of the bodies who makes these rules, as they have experts and that's what they are telling us, but I don't always just believe what I'm told, I like to try and know why, (can be annoying, I know)

Yes I most definitely will be looking into it further, just for my own knowledge. I asked @Dungeondragon15 as I thought you may have had some more in depth knowledge on it when you challenged my opinion, sorry I didn't expect you to go off looking if that's how it came across

I completely understand what you are saying that I should follow the opinion of the bodies who makes these rules, as they have experts and that's what they are telling us, but I don't always just believe what I'm told, I like to try and know why, (can be annoying, I know)

What rules are they making that you have to follow? They aren't advising or telling you to do anything let alone making rules for you to follow. They have advised the NHS not to offer screening to women under 25 and the NHS chooses to follow the advice.

I don't have an in depth knowledge on this particular subject but I do have knowledge of what is involved in producing guidelines/advice for the NHS and other bodies and it involves more than a quick google search. They will have spent months or perhaps years searching and reading all the relevant research and other evidence and it will have been evaluated by experts in the field e.g. gynaecologists.

I didn't say I have to follow rules I said I don't just follow the opinions of the bodies involved , I also never said they googled things to come up with the guidelines, come now that would just be silly.

I wouldn't start jumping on people for having a different opinion and telling them their opinions are incorrect if I didn't have anything additional to back it up. I simply have a different opinion as I haven't seen anything to prove otherwise and may be a tad cynical but I don't always believe that what happens within the NHS is always to the benefit of the public ( but that's a totally different thread that I don't want to get into )

I didn't say I have to follow rules I said I don't just follow the opinions of the bodies involved , I also never said they googled things to come up with the guidelines, come now that would just be silly.

Firstly, as I said the The UK National Screening committee, and The International Agency for Research on Cancer do not make rules. They provide independent advice to the NHS and other bodies based on the best evidence at the time and the NHS can choose whether or not to follow. They don't provide advice to you and they certainly aren't making any rules.

Secondly, I know you don’t think that they did a quick google search but you seem to think that is all you have to do before deciding that they are wrong. At the very least you should look at the evidence they have looked at. Having a different opinion based on nothing but a quick google search doesn’t make you clever.

I wouldn't start jumping on people for having a different opinion and telling them their opinions are incorrect if I didn't have anything additional to back it up.

Ironic that you are criticising me for that when it is exactly what you are doing! So what information do you have to back up the fact that The UK National Screening committee, and The International Agency for Research on Cancer are wrong to advice that cervical smears shouldn't be offered to women under 25. The link I have states:

“Cervical cancer is extremely rare in under-25s. At this age women often undergo natural and harmless changes in the cervix that screening would identify as cervical abnormalities. The problem with screening is it involves putting these women through further tests and investigations they wouldn’t otherwise have gone through when, in most cases, these abnormalities would have sorted themselves out without any need for treatment. If it was just this worry and no other risks were involved, that would be bad enough, but research has shown if women undergo unnecessary treatment this can have an adverse effect on later pregnancies, with babies possibly being born prematurely.”

Obviously you can choose to believe that they are lying even though they have no reason to lie or that they are incorrect even though you clearly haven’t looked at the evidence they have looked at but that would make you more of a conspiracy theorist or a “what do the experts know” kind of person rather than an intelligent person.

I simply have a different opinion as I haven't seen anything to prove otherwise and may be a tad cynical but I don't always believe that what happens within the NHS is always to the benefit of the public ( but that's a totally different thread that I don't want to get into )

As I said, it’s not the NHS that has provided this opinion. They have used the advice from committees which are not funded by the NHS and don’t have any reason to lie. They will have a lot of knowledge and experience and will have looked at all the research and evidence before providing that opinion. Having a different opinion is fine if you have also looked at the evidence they looked at and have the knowledge and experience to have a different opinion but it seems that you have just had a quick look online and haven’t found anything to prove your opinion is wrong which is not the same thing!

Again, I didn't say they provide advice to me, I said I don't follow the opinions of the bodies involved, meaning the bodies that advise the NHS. I have been brought up to believe that you can indeed and should question anything you are unsure about and not always just take it as gospel that because it comes from experts, its the correct information.

For The record I was not originally asking for you the explain anything, I gave my opinion, that you then questioned, I asked you then as I thought you may have some research or facts that you knew and I was quite interested to learn from, turns out you know just the same as myself in relation to the facts.

Secondly, I know you don’t think that they did a quick google search but you seem to think that is all you have to do before deciding that they are wrong. At the very least you should look at the evidence they have looked at. Having a different opinion based on nothing but a quick google search doesn’t make you clever

If you actually read my posts that is exactly what I was trying to do, I was searching for studies, papers or stats in what has set the age rather than just the government website. I was well aware of the website and what that stated but it didn't give me the background detail I was interested in.

Ironic that you are criticising me for that when it is exactly what you are doing!

I have not criticised you at all. My original post was my opinion directed at the OP, you then proceeded to direct a post at me informing me the experts know a lot more then myself !! I then asked about the information you presented, and you gave the information on the website. Again I was looking for more facts and figures rather than that.

you clearly haven’t looked at the evidence they have looked at but that would make you more of a conspiracy theorist or a “what do the experts know” kind of person rather than an intelligent person.

Can you not see that was exactly was I was trying to obtain? That was exactly my point, I was looking for the facts and background information which has formed the starting age.
It's not unreasonable to think that experts get it wrong -that has been proven time and time again in all kinds of situation e.g where experts have advised governments and it's been based on incorrect information. If everyone had just sat around saying well it must be true the experts said it was, these would never have come to light.

I am glad that from all your knowledge you have about myself and due to the fact I form my own opinion on facts and I question information --- you have determined I am not intelligent. (Personal insult ...nice)

Having a different opinion based on nothing but a quick google search doesn’t make you clever.

Again I never based my opinion on a Google search, I had already formed that opinion and then proceeded to try and find the facts to see if my opinion was incorrect, I was quite happy to alter my opinion that's why I was asking for further information.

Again thank you for determining I am not clever - I must be such a dunce for wanting more information. I should just sit happy in the knowledge that what I am being told is always correct and never challenge or search for the facts.

Having a different opinion is fine if you have also looked at the evidence they looked at and have the knowledge and experience to have a different opinion but it seems that you have just had a quick look online and haven’t found anything to prove your opinion is wrong which is not the same thing!

That's is exactly what I was trying to do !!!!

Anyhow, now you have reduced yourself to name calling. I will remove myself from the thread as I don't wish to continue with such people.