I fired my housekeeper/nanny

[QueenofWhisperz]

I have a child with SEN who is 10 and another child who is 5. My husband and I work ridiculously long hours and I entertain work clients on Friday nights.

We have had this housekeeper for the last 8 years, (ever since it was apparent that I would need help).

I love her deeply, she is like family. However, she did things that really upset me.

1. Took time off without notice, causing me to lose work.
2. Never completed her tasks, ever.
3. Tried to ingratiate her religious beliefs into my children.
4. Made me feel like no one else would work for me, or care for my children better than she would.

Today, I came home from a rough day at work, and I was doing homework with the kids before I took some clients outand this upcoming deal is quite important because it will cover some additional therapy my older child needs-and she informed me that she wasn't working her normal hours this evening.

We had agreed a work schedule in her contract; she always avoids working on a Friday night if she can help it. Anyway, as I was getting upset, I stopped myself and told her that today was her last day. (She was on warning for doing this before).

My husband has come in to tell me that I am awful. That after 10 years, I should have let her come back another day and had a nice farewell.

Professionally, cancelling this evening is devastating to me; not to mention the therapy I was going to be able to access for my son...which I will not. My boss and co-workers are having a field day with my failure for this evening and I feel like I have potentially lost everything. I am quite nervous about Monday, going back to work--but worse yet, laundry and lunches.

I didn't raise my voice, I just said that I needed her to work the schedule she agreed to, and that I will find someone else for Monday. I didn't want a heated conversation, I don't do the 'raised' voice thing.

Am I awful? Have I been terrible? I don't know how to do laundry, but I can learn. I might get fired for cancelling my evening dinner meeting.

I really can’t see what her contracted number of hours has to do with it. She’s been employed with the OP for 8 years so one would assume is happy with the contracted number of hours. Unless it’s recently changed. Yes she may cover breakfast, make lunches etc and cover a Friday evening but so what? It doesn’t indicate she’s a slave being made to work 80hrs a week

I hope you have a good solicitor

Can't believe what a hard time the OP is getting on this thread. It's a disgrace frankly. People saying she shouldn't have had children because she has dared to get full time childcare - WTF? People assuming that the nanny must be illegally here, or mistreated, or underpaid -- on the basis of nothing at all. People saying she 'wasted time' helping her kids with their homework (?). People totally unable to imagine that it might be part of someone's job to host a work even on a Friday night. People for some reason pretending that childcare is SUPER easy to organise and NEVER fails and backup childcare is REALLY SIMPLE to sort out and anyone who doesn't is a callous muppet. People not understanding that a nanny/housekeeper is a thing, a very normal thing in some circles, and not the OP's weird invention where she gets someone to do 2 jobs at once without paying them. People willfully misreading a statement that someone took a day off in a week as meaning that person normally works 7 days per week (that's not what 'a day off' means! why would you think that unless you'd already made up your mind to hate the OP?) LOTS of people who think they understand employment law and don't.

The only explanation for the amount of vitriol on this thread is a toxic combination of misogyny and jealousy. Mothers can have careers, mothers can employ nannies, it does not make you a bad mother if you are not the person who does the laundry, FGS.

People are reacting like this cause it's a nanny, of I did that at work just refusing to work for no given reason ie sickness I would be sacked as well.

No, people have asked reasonable questions that op hasn't answered so, often based on personal experience, are wondering whether there is another side to the story.

She has also said a couple of things that don't quite add up.

If you have ever worked as a nanny, or know someone well who works in this role, then you are going to wonder what the nanny's story might be.

If it is exactly as op has said - a much loved employee with a decade-long unblemished record who has relatively recently begun skiving off at short notice then yes, she deserved to be fired.

Yes it's clearly gross misconduct

The OP has been asked about 100 questions, many of which are quite intrusive or irrelevant. I don't blame her at all for not answering them. She wouldn't have expected to be so attacked.

To think part of the problem is people imagine the nanny doing the same long hours as the OP plus the OPs commuting time so imagine the nanny does super long hours for s smaller salary. If the Op clarified that the nanny’s hours are reasonable and pay is reasonable then I’m sure more would take the OPs side.

Sorry to say this but it seems like you love your job more than your children!

Interesting post there about loving job more than children. What makes you say that?

All that I've heard is me me me, my opinion. I'm allowed one

Didn’t say you weren’t allowed an opinion. Don’t read that anywhere. I simply asked what made you reach that opinion. Thank you for explaining.

Mumsnet isn't the place to look for support if you're high earners who have help. I don't know any high dual income families that don't have significant amounts of domestic help. If you were shift workers using a child minder you'd have had entirely different responses.

I think you should have waited to fire her until you had a backup already hired and ready to go. I'd also try to keep more professional distance. And definitely get other baby sitters lined up that you can call on if your regular nanny can't work.

Go back and explain that the relationship isn't working anymore and the reasons why. Thank her for the years of service she has given you and try to part ways as best you can.

hmmwhattodo, do you make a habit of criticising all mothers you know for their childcare choices or just this one? And presumably all the fathers you know who work long hours, too?

sheesh

@TooSassy sorry that wasn't meant to come across as being arsey with you. The other reason that I've said this is because she wasn't thinking of the bond her children probably have with this person and as a parent of a child with SEN a sudden change like this without prior preparation would cause all sorts of problems and meltdowns with him. My son needs to be told about these sort of changes beforehand then he can understand what's going on. I hope that made sense. Sorry again about coming across as being arsey.

Several people seem to be of the opinion that a mother should not work long hours.

I am interested to know whether they also think that about fathers. If not why not?

I think this Housekeeper/Nanny must have some very long hours. She seems to be there before the children go off to school so that she can make their lunches and she is expected to work all evening until OP gets back from a night out. I think the Housekeeper/Nanny has been running the whole domestic requirements of the house with little or no time off.
That cant be safe or decent

I cannot see how housekeeping for a family and nannying two SEN children, including working evenings, can all be done in anything approaching normal hours.

Had the nanny/housekeeper signed away her rights under the working hours directive, OP, or is there some exemption for domestic staff?

And this has been taking a day off every week for the last few weeks too.: is this in addition to weekends, and was it from her annual leave entitlement? We all have domestic or health issues that require us to take a day off from time to time, often at short notice. When you only have one member of staff, and are so reliant on them, you really need to have contingencies in place for such events.

DP used to work for a company that specialised in payroll for domestic staff. Clients would often have 2 nannies working shorter than FT hours, so that one could cover if the other had to have time off at short notice. And housekeeping was usually a separate job.

People are reacting like this cause it's a nanny, of I did that at work just refusing to work for no given reason ie sickness I would be sacked as well.

There was a thread last month by a small business owner whose employees were contracted to work on Christmas and Boxing Day, and about two weeks before the holidays were giving reasons why actually they couldn't work those days after all. MN was so supportive of the OP saying how terrible her staff were for letting her down, etc.

Completely agree that if she'd said she runs a pub and was meant to go meet with a supplier and her shift manager gave her 2 hours notice that he wasn't going to work that evening - the responses would be completely different.

You’ve not made it clear if she’s not working for a reason such as illness, childcare issues of her own, family emergency etc. Those things are inconvenient for you as for any employer but are facts of life that must be accepted.

If it really is just that she turns around and says she doesn’t want to work when she feels like it, and never does her tasks, and indoctrinates your children then I’m struggling to see why you’ve allowed this to go on for 8 years!

Hiring a nanny is not an issue. Knowingly hiring a substandard nanny to do ridiculous hours of childcare is poor parenting!

Surely if the children are 5 and 10 then, unless they are home educated, tutored etc, then they will be at school during the day.

If this is the case then I'd expect any help brought in to care for them would be regular mornings and after school/evenings, therefore the 'nanny' wouldn't be working e.g. 7 in the morning til 9 at night, they'd be working 7 - 9am then 3 - 9pm. Therefore maybe 8 hour days, not excessive hours.

If the 'nanny' isn't being exploited and the problems are occurring as you say OP, then you are NBU, I wouldn't be happy with someone doing this to me.

I think you might have reached the end of your tether and possibly reacted out of anger, it might be you could have handled it a bit better, maybe given her a bit of notice then you could get your dc's prepared for her leaving, give her a chance to say goodbye, let you look for someone else etc.

Sorry if this has been answered but what are the contracted hours for the nanny? Is it all ad hoc or are things actually in writing?

Sorry if this has been answered but what are the contracted hours for the nanny?

It's been asked countless times, but for some reason the OP avoids answering it. I can't think why!

OP avoiding any questions which actually help us deduce whether she is being unreasonable or not!

I bet there's more to it than what you've posted.

Regardless, you need to give notice. Or pay in lieu.