To think that the uk is a hostile environment for the natives aswell as for immigrants nowadays?

[malificent7]

Well the government have succeeded in one thing; making the uk a hostile place to live for most people what with cuts. Brexit etc. Is it just me or do things feel... tense?

I would agree with you Maryjoyce, but for two things:

1. I have a lot of Scottish friends, many of whom can't stand Nicola Sturgeon and are well aware what a fiscal disaster Scottish independence would be; and

2. Do we want an an impoverished country joined to us? I think not. Scotland as part of the union, even if it is costing us dear, is better than the alternative.

I'm sorry otherpeople's teens your post is the biggest load of guff ever.

"Unfortunately, for a substantial proportion of the population this had little connection with individuals' own productivity, but was the result of wealth redistribution. "

Not at all. All of the economic data shows that since 1980, that 90 returns for increased productivity ( economic growth) have gone in the vast majority to the top 10%, the owners of capital, rather than been shared as a reward for labour.

Nice little neo liberal trope, but its not true.

Nor is the deficit/debt myth that your propagate true, the debt to GDP ratio has been higher for most of the last 250 years than it is now. Discussing it in nominal terms is disingenuous.

"in the 80's a Ford Sierra was seen as a big expensive car and McDonalds was a treat for the kids. Now, a BMW 3-series and eating out at a decent restaurant once a week mark you down as distinctly average."

The cost of owning and operating cars has lowered dramatically since the 70s/80s, and whilst McDonald's may have been seen as a "treat" many, many people had a chippy tea once a week, went to the pub more etc, oh and housing took up a lot less of people's income.

Basically your post is a load of pseudo intellectual guff.

Oh and I see Elon is here ranting about Muslims again.

Great argument against mass immigration there Boris. I see you are on to tell everyone else they are wrong again and more immigration is what is needed and any problems mass immigration has brought about is our own fault for being intolerant racists.

I think it depends where you are, I work in London, it’s great. The shitty parts of the city are stil shit.

Your arguments against mass immigration are based on the actions of an infinitesimally small part of the immigrant/descended from immigrant population. You only identify what you want to, and you use all sorts of leaps of logic and fallacious arguments to do so.

The fact that you come to this thread repeating the same points you did somewhere else show your prejudices.

And that things were better in the 1970's apparently...

Your arguments against mass immigration are based on the actions of an infinitesimally small part of the immigrant/descended from immigrant population.

50% polled thinking homosexuality should be illegal is infinitesimal and of no concern to you because you have an agenda. For the sane amongst us, it is concerning that such a high percentage of our and Europes population will be Islamic. It is precisely this refusal to engage with the issues, pretending it's just one or two bad eggs and the problems are with racists already here, and oh Europe can take as many Muslims as want to come that has got us into this shit show in the first place.

I repeat the question though, would you want to live in somewhere like Savile, and would you have supported a policy which aimed to have at least 15 million Muslims in the UK from such a low base ?

"50% polled thinking homosexuality should be illegal is infinitesimal and of no concern to you because you have an agenda. "

Except of you polled practicing Christians you might similar statistics.

"For the sane amongst us, it is concerning that such a high percentage of our and Europes population will be Islamic"

You are extrpoloating data there, so its very unreliable, and have no way of proving whether these people will be practicing or non practicing muslims by 2050.

"would you want to live in somewhere like Savile, and would you have supported a policy which aimed to have at least 15 million Muslims in the UK from such a low base ?"

Begging the question fallacy. I do live somewhere which has high immigration levels and a significant muslim population. Its fine.

The fact that you come to this thread repeating the same points you did somewhere else show your prejudices.

Having an opinion about why the UK might be a hostile environment is the subject of the thread. It boggles my mind that anyone thought it would be Ok to accept millions of immigrants from a totally different and historically separate culture into Europe in a relatively short period of time..when has this ever gone well ?

But no, easier to point the finger at Nigel Farage and say it's all his fault.

BTW if your extrapolation is correct, 5% of the current population will have increased to 19% of the population in 32 years, an increase of 0.4% of the population per year.

Its not rapid nor is it "dangerous".

"It boggles my mind that anyone thought it would be Ok to accept millions of immigrants from a totally different and historically separate culture into Europe in a relatively short period of time..when has this ever gone well ?"

But it has gone well, your justification for saying it hasn't relies on making your case around exceptions rather than the vast majority of the population.

"You are propagating the myth that islam and different cultures geneally intermingle, they don't. "

They do and the evidence is all around you, like I said you rely on exceptions to make your case, it doesn' stand up.

The only thing that is hilarious is that your nasty little rantings mean fuck all, and that immigration isn't going to stop, in fact after Brexit Islamic immigrants are going to be more common.

exceptions rather than the vast majority of the population.

Do you honestly beleive the vast majority not Muslims agree with you or I about homosexuality or women's role in society ?

Vast majority of Muslims that should say.

" Or we just proceed on the basis there is a tiny chance they become atheists and give up wanting Sharia councils and islamic faith schools that teach the kids evolution is a load of nonsense ? "

Except you are fine when Christian schools do the same thing?

You are propagating the myth that islam and different cultures geneally intermingle, they don’t
That’s absolute nonsense and if you lived and worked in a multicultural area you’d know that people are basically the same and all get on which each other pretty well. Most Muslims you wouldn’t even know were Muslim unless they told you.

"Do you honestly beleive the vast majority not Muslims agree with you or I about homosexuality or women's role in society ?"

I think you'd find that most do.

All I’ve noticed is rubbish everywhere. That really upsets me and the rising crime rates

Burglary in my area south east and knife crime in London. That’s worrying.

Otherwise is a usual Tory govt tight arseing over nhs school etc.

This brexit is a bloody joke now. I have to agree with that.

in fact after Brexit Islamic immigrants are going to be more common.

You'll be happy then.

I think you'd find that most do.

There's almost no evidence to support your claim and plenty to contradict it.

But go on then, furnish us with the names of some prominent homosexual Muslims.

Except you are fine when Christian schools do the same thing?

No I'm not, bit Christianity is far more tolerant of things like homosexuality that Islam and is anyway on the decline in this country. You wouldn't, I assume, be happy to import millions of fundamentalist Christians with views like homosexuality is a sin, evolution is horse shit and girls should all be virgins until they marry etc would you ?

That leads me to conclude you must think Muslims that are coming here don't think these things ?

That’s absolute nonsense and if you lived and worked in a multicultural area you’d know that people are basically the same and all get on which each other pretty well.

This really is the meat of the issue,that anyone who objects to the Islamisation of entire towns is a racist.

Ahhh fallacies and poorly argued points.

Not worth bothering with, you are a minority anyway.