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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To exclude one child (out of 21)? Christmas cards at nursery

360 replies

QwertyLou · 13/12/2018 11:11

To be clear, I don’t want to leave this little lad out (nor does DS - they’re good mates) but we have to, due to his parents’ request.

So it’s more of a “how do I handle this?”

I wasn’t going to worry about Christmas cards this year (we did them last year - one for each child in his room).

But today I ended up cutting up cardboard, setting up paints, stamps etc and helped him make cards... He’s been home sick - quite lethargic, but well enough to need occupying.

We now have 21 Christmas cards, lovingly handcrafted and ready to go!

Only now do I remember about this little lad. And wish I thought of something else to keep DS occupied!

Last year, DS loved handing out the cards and the kids were excited to get them. After they all ran off, one of the Mums said “Sorry - we don’t celebrate Christmas” and handed her son’s card back to me (very politely and privately).

I think I said “Oh sorry!” or something inane, and tucked the card into my handbag. It was slightly awkward but all very polite, I soon forgot all about it.

Anyway - a year later, I’ve used it as a teaching moment and explained to my son about different religions and customs.

(my Mum did the same for me, I’d chosen the “Hail Mary” and she said matter-of-factly “oh some of the girls are Protestant and they don’t pray to Mary, choose another prayer!”

My son is fine with the religion discussion but says “Billy” “will be sad if I give a card to everyone but not to him!”

If Billy was a confident, bolshie little boy it would be easier. But he seems a very sensitive little soul. He was overjoyed to be invited to my son’s birthday party because he doesn’t tend to get invited to things often.

I once watched a little girl handing out invites and Billy was beaming, waiting for his. And when he didn’t get one his face... just crumpled and his eyes filled with tears. I just wanted to pick him up and give him the biggest cuddle!

TL;DR - how should my son hand out 20 cards without being mean to the one child he can not give one to?

Are there any non-Christmas celebrators who would be comfortable saying what you would want done?

PS. If I’d remembered earlier, I would have got him to make cards for people outside nursery.

PPS. They don’t have book bags.

OP posts:
AdamNichol · 13/12/2018 14:38

Plymouth Brethren

Oooh, the PB. Now there's a fun bunch, who in no way face accusations of abuse from those who escape

squirrelnutkins1 · 13/12/2018 14:43

JWs do accept and give cards and gifts, just not for Xmas or birthdays. Entitled to their own beliefs.
A different type of card is a lovely thought.

myhamsteratefreddiestarr · 13/12/2018 14:48

I totally agree that he can make Billy a card saying Thanks for being my Friend. It just mustn't reference Christmas or the season in any way whatsoever.

So a card with a rainbow on, or an animal, or anything as long as not Christmas related at all and agree with PP that no envelope would be best, so she can see what it is.

I really don't see how the mum could refuse that, it would be really petty if she did.

KOKOagainandagain · 13/12/2018 14:59

Myhamster - if only the Devil had told Jesus he was being 'really petty' Grin

SushiMonster · 13/12/2018 15:00

Happy New Year
Happy Holidays
Seasons Greetings

HeadsDownThumbsUpEveryone · 13/12/2018 15:05

Sushi - None of those phrases on a card would be accepted by a JW (assuming that's what this parent is). They all refer to the festive period. I really do think a picture drawn on A4 would be the OP's best option at including him.

KOKOagainandagain · 13/12/2018 15:09

I think you need to start with an understanding of why JWs don't celebrate Christmas or birthdays.

Bracketing Christmas (which is more complex) why do you think JWs don't celebrate birthdays?

Queenofthedrivensnow · 13/12/2018 15:24

Little letter with an invitation to come over and play!!

anniehm · 13/12/2018 15:24

I had a jw friend and a Christian brethren friend growing up and neither could accept cards nor gifts for any reason. I'm surprised he came to a birthday party even as it's normal to told that they don't socialise outside of the family/religious organisation. Interestingly both have left their respected orgs because they didn't want to bring their kids up in such a restrictive way (they attend mainstream Christian churches, one is a lay reader)

ScrantonTheElectricCity · 13/12/2018 15:39

Raised as JW (family disfellowshipped when heavy metal loving brother refused to have his hair cut as 'a representative of Jehovah to those in the World' by arguing to Elders that 'Jesus had long hair').

Are you saying the WHOLE family was disfellowshipped because one person wouldn't cut his hair?? Yeah, sure I believe you...

AdamNichol · 13/12/2018 15:47

Are you saying the WHOLE family was disfellowshipped because one person wouldn't cut his hair?? Yeah, sure I believe you...

Depending on whether the family was deemed complicit or not willing to shun a relative, it's not so unrealistic

HeadsDownThumbsUpEveryone · 13/12/2018 15:47

Are you saying the WHOLE family was disfellowshipped because one person wouldn't cut his hair?? Yeah, sure I believe you...

I took it to mean her family decided to support her brother and as a consequence they were all cast out. As a JW it would have been the choice between never having contact and talking to him again or the whole family leaving.

glamorousgrandmother · 13/12/2018 16:10

My understanding of the birthdays thing, from a leaflet a JW parent gave me, is that they don't like any event that raises one person above another. To me, birthdays don't do this as everyone gets their turn once a year but that's what the booklet said.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 13/12/2018 16:31

I thought the birthday issue was because of the associations with astrology? Also, wasn't it at Herod's birthday party that John the Baptist was supposed to have been beheaded?

I could be talking rubbish, of course - I'm not very good with these things

As for a choice of shunning a family member or a whole family leaving the JW over hair cutting ... is this really supposed to be a Christian religion? Because I'm sorry, but it really doesn't sound very Christian to me Hmm

KOKOagainandagain · 13/12/2018 16:47

Scranton - my parents had a meeting with the Elders where they were given the choice that either their 15 year old son would be disfellowshipped, literally cast out of the home and shunned, or the whole family would be disfellowshipped. This was a big deal as my dad had been the first Witness to refuse a blood transfusion in a life threatening situation in the UK back in the 1940s and had been celebrated at regional and National Assemblies. They chose their son at great personal cost. They lost their friends and social network overnight.

30 years later they came back to visit my dad in hospital on his deathbed to give him the 'strength' to again refuse a blood transfusion. An Elder even 'did' his funeral. Lots of criticism for how he had been tested and turned away from the faith but had returned to the flock for the sake of promised resurrection.

So much unnecessary suffering and pain. I am not surprised you find it unbelievable.

CaveMum · 13/12/2018 16:49

My mum’s explanation to me about the birthday’s was that birthday’s only get mentioned once in the Bible and that, as Puzzled says, is when John the Baptist gets beheaded as a birthday present for Herod. Therefore birthday’s are a bad thing as if they were supposed to be celebrated they’d be mentioned all the time and in a positive light.

On the Christmas front, it’s not just the pagan festival aspect it’s also the (actually valid point) that they believe Jesus was born in October. It’s highly unlikely that any shepherd’s would have been out at night in mid-December in that part of the world.

CaveMum · 13/12/2018 16:55

Keepon, my mum’s best JW friend (the one who converted her effectively) became dissolussioned with the JWs about 10 years ago and left, being disfellowshipped as she went.

Then about 4 years ago her son died in a tragic accident in Thailand (a fundraising campaign was in the local papers to try and raise money to repatriate his body) and my mum refused to go and see her former friend to console her over the loss of her son. I babysat him on a few occasions and he played with my brother a lot growing up. I lost a lot of respect for my mum after that.

HeadsDownThumbsUpEveryone · 13/12/2018 17:01

Cave - I'm not surprised you lost respect for your mum in those circumstances Shock surely God would want her to comfort her friend. Sadly brainwashing will do all kinds of unimaginable things to someone, even someone you think you know well. Sad

golddustwomen · 13/12/2018 17:11

Definitely don't do a happy new year card though, my oh is ex JW and he says they don't celebrate NYE either

KOKOagainandagain · 13/12/2018 17:16

JWs do not celebrate entry into a temporary world that is merely a staging point where you are tested to prove your right to claim everlasting life. Real life is elsewhere. Any adoption of this world, any attachment to this world, is a barrier to gaining entry to the Kingdom of Heaven. You have to be prepared to give up your life in this world to prove your faith.

JWs don't celebrate an alternative birth of Jesus. It doesn't matter when he was born or when anyone else was born into this world. Nothing is this world matters but other people without Faith think it does. This is the bottom line.

KOKOagainandagain · 13/12/2018 17:40

QWERTY - there are lots of ways of being kind and being inclusive that won't have a kick-back. This might be novel to you but no doubt this situation arises every year for thousands of JW DC and the organisation will be on it and will have pat responses that will neutralise and subvert any attempt at inclusion into mainstream belief or culture.

The build up to Christmas was never really an issue for me despite not being allowed to join in organised activities but I really hated the return to school when other DC would relentlessly quiz me to watch me squirm. I could have done with a friend then. Maybe that's when a drawing or card saying thank you for being my friend would be most appreciated.

ChocolateChipMuffin2016 · 13/12/2018 18:01

My DS Childminder is a JW, last year we gave her a Christmas card and a gift which she accepted and thanked us for, though we didn’t know she was a JW last year (I had guessed but she confirmed it this year). I was going to do the same this year but this thread has made me think it’s a bad idea and she’ll be offended! Arghhhhh!

Feta0 · 13/12/2018 18:08

I suppose if his parents insist on no festivities at all, they are the ones excluding their child. They should be preparing him for what is almost the trauma that will follow year after year in his childhood, if they live somewhere Christmas is generally celebrated and he will not be a part of it.
How absolutely awful for him.

Drawing him a picture/special friend card is a nice idea.
But his parents are the ones who need to equip him with the resilience to deal with this as not everyone will be as thoughtful as you.

Loftyswops988 · 13/12/2018 18:19

Could you perhaps ask the mum what is okay instead of a christmas card? maybe explain that your son wants her son to be included and suggest a 'have fun in the school holidays' type card, and see her reaction?

Molakai · 13/12/2018 18:29

I would not give any card right now. You have no way of knowing how strictly the family adhere to their principles. The reality is that you are giving the child a card because it's Christmas and this is presumably the very fact that the parents object to. So, it quite possibly doesn't matter at all what is on the card. If you are thinking about the child, then you have to take into account the parents at this age.

I would suggest making a friendship card to give next term. DS can make it now and it can keep it be a special surprise for his friend.

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