To think mumsnet is full of hate crime?

[Whyisthisacceptable]

The whole active thread list is always taken up by tons of trans bashing threads. How is it acceptable? Anything relating to anyone transgender is bashed. If this was against another minority of people, race, sexuality, religion it would be taken down and reported as hate crime. I don’t understand how the feminism board makes it acceptable?

Tbh the fact that people who disagree with this are being no platformed and silenced just speaks volumes and was actually one of the things that opened my eyes. Why aren't we allowed to discuss this? Can you think of any other proposed law changes that people weren't allowed to discuss and only one side of the argument was allowed to be presented? Because I can't.

I'm with you, I even said "thanks MN" a while back when there was a post saying "thanks for letting us have this debate when nowhere else will."
Both sides should be shown, it shouldn't be no debate. That was before I had my eyes opened to transphobia on here though.
Although I still think there should be a discussion around self ID. Not OK with the problem with all transwomen side which there definitely is on here though.

India Willoughby is a she

When did I say they weren't?

It is also irrelevant to what I said. Even women can be misogynistic and from what I've seen of India, they are clearly a misogynistic twat.

Unsure why you think I’m talking to you?

PerverseConverse

wrexhamtrans you can't hide the differences in pelvis, jaw, and shoulders. Or hands. Hands are usually a giveaway. Did you see Posie and India on This Morning and how India put his hands on the table but his them again once Posie put hers on as the difference was so obvious. Ears are often much bigger too I've noticed.

She or no she, India Willoughby is definitely a misogynist.

Why is it acceptable to call someone who has had full surgery and hormones and has lived as a woman for a long time a man. It’s just not.

It's not allowed according to MN rules, so it shouldn't be done on this board. However, if you don't believe that a man can ever become a woman, because they are biological categories, then it's perfectly acceptable. If you do believe that a man can become a woman, then you believe that India Willoughby is a woman. Fine. But not everyone shares that belief.

It's kind not to refer to someone with gender dysphoria by a term that might be hurtful to them. Sometimes, that's what matters. At other times, facts matter more. And that's without considering the non-dysphorics, 'femme non-binaries', part-time 'women' and so on, who are completely different to transsexuals with gender dysphoria.

Some people will not call any transwoman, no matter how far they have gone, 'she'. I would say that is their right as it is the truth and they feel strongly that reality should be upheld as they believe that not doing so will further allow womanhood to be eroded. Most people let the truth sit to one side for the sake of not hurting feelings, and that is fine too.

Why is it acceptable to call someone who has had full surgery and hormones and has lived as a woman for a long time a man.

Probably because she still acts like a man and an entitled sexist man at that.

I have to admit that despite looking like a woman on TV and in photos*, I too have a hard time seeing India as a woman because they simply don't act like someone who is socialised as a woman does. Everything about their behaviour screams "I was born a male and was socialised as a man so now I am going to continue acting like that even though I want to be a woman."

*I say on TV and in photos because I've actually seen IW in person a couple of times and she doesn't pass as well in real life as she does on television and in pictures. I suspect the same is true for a lot of women in the public eye.

Note that even transsexual people who disagree are getting silenced !

I will NEVER accept self identity nor sexual motivation for transgender. Also, as much as I would like to use female spaces it certainly isn't a right.

Transition should always be medically supported and managed in those who have been fully assessed by multiple specialists in Gender Dysphoria.

A few pages back, someone called India willoughby a man and ‘he’ in the middle of a debate of GC posters saying they will use they and initials as not to be offensive, yet didn’t question this

India Willoughby has some extremely unpleasant views on gender non conforming people and has asserted on many occasions that if you haven’t had surgery you aren’t trans.

Which in many people’s eyes would be extreme transphobia. Far more so than using incorrect pronouns.

I don’t care about pronouns. I do struggle with the idea that India is a woman. I think India is a transwoman, and I don’t think there is nothing wrong with that.
I also think India is a twat.

"because she still acts like a man and an entitled sexist man at that."

In some cases absolutely.

But what about people who have known since they were young children they were trans and never acted like a man to begin with!

Personally I have never identified as male, nor have I felt any male entitlement.

ndia Willoughby has some extremely unpleasant views

Right so that’s how this works? If you don’t like someone you can say what you want about them with no regard for anything else?

When did I say they weren't?

are you saying that in all seriousness?
As you did it again even after it's been pointed out, in the same comment saying you weren't.
Can't you see what you're doing?
It is also irrelevant to what I said. Even women can be misogynistic and from what I've seen of India, they are clearly a misogynistic twat

I used to roll eyes at pronouns. It's clear why they're needed though, this shit must be relentless.

But I’ve very rarely seen transphobia questioned on here by GC people

I’m as Gender Critical as a Women’s Movement pub crawl, but I certainly questioned the poster who, on another thread, was advocating against ever using language that may offend, yet at the same time was in possession of a username that was almost guaranteed to cause offence to transpeople. I felt there was a huge element of cognitive dissonance at work.

I got more or less shrieked down.

But what about people who have known since they were young children they were trans and never acted like a man to begin with!

Because to the outside world they were male and as a result will have been socialised as such. How they felt inside in irrelevant because people would have still seen them as male and treated them accordingly.

EarlyWalker, do you deliberately choose to misrepresent what people say?

@VerbeenaBeeks

Again, when did I claim India wasn't a she?

Are you bored?

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Apologies - I don't know what happened there. Thought I was c&p'ing a few lines from a poster to respond to!

Not sure what that is Aridane, did your keyboard have a fart or is it a link fail?

Cross post lol

No, you cannot use ‘they say bad things too’ as an excuse for being offensive about someone.

I don’t like India, but she is a fully transitioned trans woman and to call her a man just shows the lack of respect, understanding and quite frankly - give a damn attitude that some people on here have to transgender people.

If you’re a fat woman, who is also an asshole, should I refer to you as ‘fat girl’ everytime I speak to you? Just to use your insecurities to slap you in the face?

But I think other posters should actually make a point and tell these people they disagree with them and their posts are not welcome, as well as reporting them

Nope wont be doing that,

I report, i sometimes say if im reporting, i pay attention to context and sometimes i miss the odd post

If posters on here have decided thats makes me transphobic racist sexist, agist and disableist

Well, there is not an awful lot i can do about that

Again, when did I claim India wasn't a she? Are you bored?

As suspected, you don't know you're doing it. As you were then. READ what you wrote. Properly.

aridane

Makes more sense than some posts ive seen on mumsnet

As suspected, you don't know you're doing it. As you were then. READ what you wrote. Properly.

I'll take that to mean you are bored.