... to think my boyfriend should pay rent?

[Passive1]

I haven’t been here for a long time, but I’m back because I need some honest advice.

I have been a single mother to my 5 year old son since I was pregnant. We live in a 2 bed flat in London and my rent/bills total approx £2,000 per month.

I am now in my first serious relationship since having my son. My boyfriend is a wonderful man but I’m getting resentful over money.

For the last 2 months he has stayed with us almost every night, spending around 2 nights a month at his home (if I have been away). He left the military recently so is back at his family home, paying his mum a little rent but working for a full salary- he has no debts or large direct debits, just a phone bill.

While he’s here I cook for him, wash his clothes, he borrows my car etc. and I continue to pay for everything and do everything around the house (which is fine because I’m very particular about food and my flat.)

However, the money is a problem. It is becoming such an issue for me that I’m losing sleep. I’ve raised it 3 times this week; most recently tonight, I said earlier today “we need to have a serious conversation about whether you’ve moved in, and if you have we need to do things more fairly because I’m paying for the car, the fuel, the rent and everything in the flat and that’s not fair if you’re using it as much as I am”. He said “I agree”.
I just brought it up again and all he said was “I said I agree”.

AIBU here? Am I a cow for thinking he should have offered already, and since I’ve been so up front, should he not have come up with some suggestions/ figures?

To rebalance this, he is a really good man, he’s started helping more around the flat and he came food shopping today (I paid) but this will end the relationship if it’s not resolved. He isn’t tight with his money in other ways, he takes us out for dinners, buys treats on the way home etc. but this is pretty fundamental.

Please (gently) tell me if I’m being unfair - after all, I’ve been paying it all for the last 5 years. If you do think he should contribute, how much? Just the “extra” he costs, which is maybe £200 a month, or a proportion of the rent/utilities too?

Kateandme - I’ll do that. I’m a coward and feel very uncomfortable talking about money so I’ll raise it over text when we’re at work, then I’ll have to raise it again in the evening but it appears as though he’s never going to be proactive in this conversation. I need to see it through.

Thank you Thigh I think it will make for a very good relationship if we manage to resolve this, but that’s a huge if. He isn’t at all able to see it from my point of view - yesterday he wanted to watch the boxing and said “I’ll pay the £20 when your bill comes”, which just summed up the fact that he only sees his responsibility as any extra costs which benefit him solely. That doesn’t include food, water, gas, toiletries etc, which he sees as just a bit extra

Try stepping back at the till and firmly keep your hand in your pocket, just for a couple of weeks. Also ask for cash and say you will give it to him later and don't. Not to be PA just to test the water and see what is going on. If he can do it to you then he must feel very comfortable using your money and resources and you should feel just as comfortable not paying him back.

He is seriously taking the piss. At his age, I fail to see how this is anything but deliberate. He may have never lived on his own, but he isn't stupid, surely.

Anyway - off to bed. You'll be fine and keep your hand in your pocket for a couple of weeks.

Interesting isn’t it. I’d never do that, my money mindset is entirely different. I hate owing money and am far too proud to behave in that way (clearly my downfall!)

Me too. Night and thank you x

Aquamarine1029

Definitely not stupid. I can’t work it out either. At first I was hoping he’d be mortified as soon as I mentioned it and immediately offer ... but he didn’t, and he still hasn’t, and it’s becoming more and more of an elephant

At least you are thinking about it, there are many couples who never talk about their attitude to money before they move in.

You say he is a good man and tbh he has never had to consider bills before and I doubt he has learned to handle or take responsibility for money. He has always handed over a portion of his earnings and his roof, food, heating etc is included, the rest is spending money.

He probably has no idea how much it costs to run a home, doesn’t make him tight or useless, it’s just something he’s not experienced. Just be careful you don’t become a substitute parent finance wise taking all the responsibility.

Before you sit down and talk I would do a budget, the food alone has increased by almost £200 a month so your first estimate was way too low. If you can have an idea of costs in your head then you are less likely to chicken out.

Good luck.

thighofrelief,
Lol,yes I’ve been there with a guy taking 2 steps back from the till also and it was so embarrassing.He actually said he needed the toilet .😬

Just remembered my brother lived with a girl in 1988 who charged him £350 month for rent, food etc, he was on £18k a year at the time and thought it was a great deal.

Look at the royal navy.mod.uk pay and benefits section. He is used to having subsidised food, travel and lodging. You need to persevere with the fact that you have substantial costs of living. Did he return the car with the diesel topped up ? What was his reaction to your friend saying that ?

Does he think that because he stays at his mums twice a month that he doesn't live with you, therefore doesn't owe you anything?

Stop cooking for him, stop washing his clothes, and don't loan him your car.
Tomorrow morning, tell him that you've decided he needs to pay xxxxx today as his share of the bills, and give him your bank details. Given just how easy it is to make bank transfers, he should pay there and then.

If he doesn't it's because he's got it nice and cushy, and you've got your answer, so take your keys back - if he has any!

I say this being married to someone in the forces...they are so used to having rent etc come straight out of their wages and accommodation sorted for them wherever they go that they lose the concept of ‘living in the real world’; especially if he has been back at his mums and not paying much rent. Just be open and say i think £600 is fair as x, y and z needs to be paid (again, the cost of utilities is probably not something he has worried about before!), and if you feel he could do more around the house then broach that too. He will either agree (which he probably will if he knows exactly what you expect), or he won’t and you can decide what is fair re: living arrangements:

I would openly tell him what you were paying and have a discussion about what he thinks is fair and what you think is fair then compromise. I don't think it should be split equally as the relationship is still fairly new and IMO your child is still your financial responsibility and not his but that's up to the two of you to decide, you know better than us where your relationship is at.

It is also very likely that he has no idea if the real cost of living therefore no appreciation of what he is costing you. My PIL do this stuff all the time, they have always had a home that is virtually rent free or completely rent free, not paid rates/insurances/water bills/mortgage etc as they always lived on either My FIL's parents farm or on a neighbouring property paying literally $20 annually to live there and as they know we would love to move out of town they will suggest properties that are so far out of our price range as they literally have no idea what it costs to pay mortgages, both hubby and I bought our own houses with no help from our parents and have a lot of respect for the cost of living.....I wish they would get it too but if you have never had to do it, it is reasonable that you would not understand it.

Put it in black and white then see what you come up with, I know how hard it is to ask someone else for money but don't forget that he is not hesitating in the slightest to take from you and your child.

I know you will have to bring it up again.so how about doing what I mentioned and have your bills out.maybe do a pretend script run with yourself.so go trhough them.see what extra your spending on groceries as you mentioned.add it to part of the bill rises fuel etc.
so then you will know exactly what to say.and the bills will be there no dodging or fear needed.they are out and ready.
after what everyone has said from ex army and ex mum does it all boys then you can see how this might have happened.even though to most it might seem daft.so just talk.be kind.no judging.and if hes the guy that deserves you it will all be fine.xx

I find it hard to believe that a grown man who is on 35k a year earning over 2k a month in hand doesn’t realise that he has to pay bills and pay for food if he lives with someone , he sounds like he’s got his feet right under the table and if you can’t discuss this with him it shows up numerous red flags for your relationship , I’m assuming he has massive savings if he pays for pretty much nothing ? Anyone decent wouldn’t take advantage of you , my husband is the reason our food bill is massive he’s 6 feet 2 and needs a lot of food no way I’d be buying and cooking it all for him to pay rent to his mum .

Stop cooking him dinner too as a default . I also think you don’t seem to have an opinion on whether you actually want this man to love in and seem to be letting him come and go as you please which isn’t good if you have a child there .

Move in not love in .

I would say to him ‘I’ve mentioned a few times now that if you are living here you need to pay a share of the food and bills. You’ve agreed but not yet done anything about it. I want to agree on amount today and get it set up straight away please. ....... ‘

I would scale this right back. You've only known him a year and he doesn't get to move into your home by stealth without any conversation!! No fucking way.

You should not have allowed him to just turn up every day without discussion. Can you see how wrong that is? He clearly feels entitled to your time as well as your domestic service.

I think he needs to be responsible for certain bills. Or all of them. So rent is x, bills are y. I'll pay the rent, you can pay the bills and car stuff and 60% of shopping. Then he's responsible for actual things. He can start by writing the letters to get his name added to bills.

A decent thoughtful man would not only have offered, he'd have worked out roughly what extra it's costing you to have him there and just given you the money! I know men who have done this.

As he hasn't, and seems to be trying to avoid the issue while knowing he's taking the piss, I'd suggest starting by working out how much it's actually costing you for him to live with you:

Food
Other groceries (cleaning materials, toiletries etc)
Gas & electric
Car costs (mot, tax & ins, wear & tear)

And frankly he should contribute at least a 1/3 of rent too.

Also you need to be very careful because I suspect you're still claiming your single person council tax discount? You could get in a lot of trouble for not declaring he's now living with you - how long has this been going on? If you end up in the jail where will that leave your DC? Is any of his post coming to your address? Particularly anything that might come from inland revenue or other govt depts?

Ditto any benefits you're getting due to being a single mum.

Ditto again if you rent, really you should be telling your landlord?

Bet that all adds up to a damn site more than £200!

Then tell him "if you're going to be here all the time you need to give me £X to cover the additional costs that's causing for me. I can't afford to support you"

If he does ANYTHING other than agree, agree to negotiate possibly (without taking piss) or stops staying at yours all the time you need to seriously consider ending the relationship.

Generally no not that thick BUT yes that cheeky! If they can get away with it they will.

I'm also sending possible red flags.

I'm from a military family and ex is also ex military. I'm also wondering if he's gone straight to army from mum and has never actually been responsible for himself. Personally I think the way they deal with single serving infantilises them. All rent, mess food expenses are taken out before they get their pay, then all they have to buy is extra food (snacks & drinks), toiletries, clothes - personal items. So they genuinely aren't used to dealing with bills. Many get themselves in debt due to not getting best deals on things like phone contracts or car deals.

Does he tidy up after himself? Pull his weight with chores? I suspect not.

"but he has loads more disposable income" that would be because you and his mum/parents are heavily subsidising his arse!

What rank was he when he left marines? Bet he's getting a decent pension. A quick look based on certain assumed info suggests that this would be a minimum of £6kpa That will be on top of his £35k too.

Sorry but I also think 1 year possibly less is far too soon to be moving in together when there's DC involved too. He needs to back off.

If it helps - remind yourself money you're spending subsidising him is money you can't then spend on DC or you.

"What he actually needs to do is get his own place like a grown-arse man." Completely agree.

Wow! The boxing I'd have said no, pay the £20 first then I'll book it. Frankly if anything like this comes up again soon react just like that and HIS reaction will tell you all you need to know. With banking apps, phone & online banking plus cash points everywhere absolutely no reason why he can't do this very quickly & easily.

I think MrsTerryPracthett and I may have been separated at birth and echo everything she's said.

OP, you're amazing and I can understand that you're now ready for a partner. Sadly, this tosser doesn't sound a viable candidate

What is it with these manchildren we've been raising? Even without the army in the frame, we seem to be institutionalising our own boys - how else to explain the multitude of posts on MN about self entitled tossers?!

Don't forget that he needs to pay for the increase in council tax.

MrsCatE - it's something myself and other posters have been wondering.

It seems to be younger men (younger than my parents generation anyway - boomers) who are cocklodging lazy arses!

And while I accept its not just down to women, women are at least partly responsible for raising these douchebags and then for letting them away with it when we end up in relationships with them. Time we said enough's enough!