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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that trans people should use the disabled toilets ?

250 replies

PerverseConverse · 20/10/2018 10:31

Actually it's not me that thinks this but this is what is currently being argued on Facebook.

Disabled facilities were hard fought for and I don't think they should be used by anyone else. However I'm not sure what the solution is but it's definitely not to use the disable facilities.

These are examples of what has been said:

"Personally, I believe that if a transgender person passes as the gender they have transitioned too then I have no problem with sharing a toilet with them cuz I wouldn’t be able to know whether or not they were transgender but if the person looks like a man in a dress and heels, I’m sorry but they should use the disabled toilets. There is a reason for this, the women’s toilets is a safe space for biological females. That includes sexual assault victims who suffer with PTSD. It may not bother all victims but it may cause detrimental effects on others and we should take into consideration the mental health of those victims thus I say give transgenders access to the disabled toilets so that they don’t cause anxiety and distress for trauma victims. That is reasonable is it not?"

And:

"What is wrong with using the disabled toilets anyway? People often use them when the cue is too long for the regular toilets but now people have a problem? I believe it to be a very reasonable request and I have known transgenders male to female who have requested to use the disabled toilets for the very reason of they were thinking of those that had been traumatised by men. They did that of their own choice and were being considerate towards others and I applaud them for it. They have said that once they look more feminine, they will consider using the women’s toilets but only once they look like a woman.
The difference between those that look like a woman and those that don’t is that, unless you look at their medical records, you can’t tell that they were born a man and thus, it doesn’t cause anxiety as you pass them in the toilets but someone who is quite obviously was born a man could do that.
It is not an unreasonable request in order to ensure that everyone is comfortable in their environment and thus, no one has to suffer anymore than they already are psychologically. I believe there is nothing wrong with a transgender using the disabled toilets, we expect the disabled to go into a totally separate room instead of sharing with the rest of their gender so why is it now so unreasonable asking that transgenders do the same.
However I believe it to be unreasonable to ask a PTSD victim to be put into a situation that makes them feel uncomfortable. I also believe that it is unreasonable to request a transgender male to female to use the male toilets. Thus, do give me a solution that would not potentially cause someone to suffer psychologically that isn’t the use of disabled toilets"

I'm too tired to even begin to argue with this viewpoint right now.

It's from Posie Parker's Facebook review yesterday. Not sure the link will work but :

m.facebook.com/greenhousedeptford/

You'd have to scroll to her review.

OP posts:
Samcro · 20/10/2018 23:14

so if being trans is now a disability according to mn, does that mean that they can claim DLA/PIP.

zzzzz · 20/10/2018 23:14

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AvoidingDM · 20/10/2018 23:16

Of couse they do.
But the argument for not changing them to unisex is the urinals are open. Shock horror blokes don't want to pee in front of women in a unisex loo.

To change the mens to unisex really means enclosing the urinals somehow.

Hence back to the other argument changing the sign on the ladies is easy.

Samcro · 20/10/2018 23:16

duh the people who think they should use disabled facilities.
(not people like you and me zzzz who live in the real world)

zzzzz · 20/10/2018 23:19

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

paffuto · 20/10/2018 23:33

I think it makes it easier for transgender people. Can't they campaign for their own spaces, like women did and then disabled people? We didn't trample on the rights of others or put women and girls at risk.!! Why have transgender problems become our problem? Bugger off and sort yourselves out.

zzzzz · 20/10/2018 23:34

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

paffuto · 20/10/2018 23:38

And now we have this selfish pass the parcel scenario as Buggerbrexit said. We don't want them in the ladies so disabled people can have them in theirs!! NO, NO, NO. News for you all, we're not having it.! Disabled people are practised fighters, we have to be so you may as well all stop discussing it. Ain't gonna happen.!

zzzzz · 20/10/2018 23:43

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

VerbeenaBeeks · 20/10/2018 23:45

We don't want them in the ladies so disabled people can have them in theirs!

Speak for yourself there, not as a whole.

Buggerbrexit · 20/10/2018 23:46

No samcro, pip isn’t about having a disability, it’s about how it affects you. The indicators are really specific and probably only 2 or 3 could fit unless there were other issues.

Samcro · 20/10/2018 23:46

ffs please stop othering disabled people.
why should that be the fall guy for this shit, disabled toilets should be for..................disabled people.

zzzzz · 20/10/2018 23:47

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Buggerbrexit · 20/10/2018 23:48

In France there are plenty of odd unisex toilets where you literally walk past the urinal to get to the cubicle.

Shockers · 20/10/2018 23:48

Of course trans people should use the disabled toilets... if they have a disability.

Samcro · 20/10/2018 23:49

zzzzz Sat 20-Oct-18 23:47:57
I don’t think samcro was being serious about claiming benefits.

thanks I wasn't being serious.

Buggerbrexit · 20/10/2018 23:50

I know, I figured it was tongue in cheek, but it seems to be regarded as one more and more. This is the third thread about this I’ve seen and it’s referred to as a disability at least once on every thread.

Arguably it affects someone’s day to day life for a prolonged period of time...but then is it resolved after transition?

zzzzz · 20/10/2018 23:50

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Jellyjumpers · 20/10/2018 23:52

I feel gender nutral toilets is the answer. It is not possible for every toilet to meet everyone's needs. People with the most severe disabilities may need changing facilities which more places should acomodate it would not be possible for shops to have all changing places toilets with equipment for changing.

zzzzz · 20/10/2018 23:53

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Devillanelle · 20/10/2018 23:57

I think as well as a toilet for people with a physical disability there should also be an area including a toilet for people with mental illness, which can be a safe space for them and that obviously would include people with gender dysphoria.

Trans people who have surgically transitioned with a GRC are more than welcome in the toilet of their chosen sex by most people I imagine.

Buggerbrexit · 20/10/2018 23:58

To play devil advocate devil...how would you tell?

Vixxxy · 20/10/2018 23:59

If all loos were like the disabled ones, self contained rooms, then maybe. Tere would be a lot less areas though and larger queues.

Surely the best way to 'solve' this is to have male and female areas as we currently do. Have disabled areas. And where possible, put an additional mixed sex areas and designate it 'mixed sex' or 'gender neutral'. Our current setup is already gender neutral though. Segregated by sex. But people of all 'genders' (meaning people who follow all different stereotypes! Who knew that sex segregation was about sexed bodies ratherr than masculinity or femininity?!)

It would be work in progress. And transactivists would have to stop colonising female areas and start fighting for their own spaces though. Which is unlikely. I would support them in that fight, anyway. I just refuse to say that either women, or disabled people should have to move over just because entitled males have started yelling.

Devillanelle · 21/10/2018 00:10

@Buggerbrexit I suppose either a radar key would work, or you would just rely on general goodwill and hope too many people don't take the piss like the current system for disabled toilets.

Jellyjumpers · 21/10/2018 00:17

What would you include in a toilet for people with mental illness?

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