Tonight's headline news - Asian gangs, So what next for these young girls? (Triggering)
DeadLioness · 19/10/2018 19:24
Apologies, posting here for traffic. Don't think we need a link, it's right across the news tonight. What I'm wondering is what next for these poor girls? The judge said 'It is likely that many, if not all, of these girls will never recover from the abuse they suffered'. But the psychological damage is colossal. There should be compensation and a massive care package. How will they get past this? A prison sentence does nothing to stop flashbacks. I speak as someone similarly affected. I am waiting for my perpetrator's trial to start. I also don't believe I'll get over it. The very best psych help the Nhs has to offer is not enough. I guess I want to hear that they'll be ok, so I know I'll be ok. But I know that isn't the case. Those men should have had life without parole, all of them.
DeadLioness · 19/10/2018 22:15
I started this thread & I was intending that the focus be the girls. Because I am one. I went through this... and I still am (mentally) today. I suffer horrendously and have suicidal thoughts. Someone upthread said 'IME money's all too often prioritised for what might be called "fashionable" causes, and given some of the perceptions around such cases I somehow doubt the victims will be at the top of anyone's list' This is so true. I'm having to fund my own therapy - 10/20 sessions of CBT isn't going to cut it remotely. & what of compensation to help us rebuild our lives? I'm unable to work due to the severity of my mental health issues. I see no support. The best I can get on the nhs is to chug some meds to dope me into submission. & I don't want the side effects. I honestly don't know what to do next.
staydazzling · 19/10/2018 22:22
Sorry Deadlioness i totally agree these discussions too often get derailed about race, when the sole focus needs to be the girls and im as guilty this time. FWIS im from Rotherham, and yes between the bloody riots and protests the girls were just totally forgotten.
derxa · 19/10/2018 22:23
Firefliess · 19/10/2018 22:26
I think if you are part of an ethnic group where there are in members and "others" then it's easier to see the others as not really human. The men involved here did not prey on Asian girls because they see them as human and know it would be wrong to abuse them. Religions contribute to this view of an in group and others by preaching exactly that - there is plenty in the Koran (and the Bible) about the superiority of god's chosen people/believers/Muslims.
You can't say race is irrelevant in situations where all the perpetrators are from one background and all the victims from another. It's as stupid as claiming race to be a red herring when talking about the rape and abuse of black slaves by white male colonialists.
derxa · 19/10/2018 22:37
You can't say race is irrelevant in situations where all the perpetrators are from one background and all the victims from another. It's as stupid as claiming race to be a red herring when talking about the rape and abuse of black slaves by white male colonialists. Well put. Do you know I feel sick when I think of this abuse. I don't see many of the
metoo crowd talking about this. The abused girls are beneath them I feel.
Justwanttoweeinpeace · 19/10/2018 23:02
But surely if these girls had been able to go to the authorities and been believed, and had their statements acted upon, the background of the men wouldn't have mattered?
I think Asian men probably did have more leeway. The authorities were clearly afraid of accusations of racism if they cracked down on this shocking behaviour. No one wanted a re run of the Bradford / Oldham Riots.
I suspect plenty of white men would have done similar if they'd had the authorities turn a blind eye in the same way. For all we know they do.
Eastie77 · 19/10/2018 23:03
I still don't understand why the ethnic background of these vile men is so important.
In his summing up the judge stated "These were planned offences by a large group of Asian men". Why does the fact that they are Asian need to be mentioned in this context? Replacing the word 'Asian' with wicked or depraved makes sense but focusing on their ethnicity really doesn't.
It's almost as if their ethnicity is some kind of aggravating factor that the judge had to call out. I would hope that they would have received the same sentences if they were White so why does their background even merit a mention?
Puzzledandpissedoff · 19/10/2018 23:06
For those who asked about white paedophile gangs, there are a couple of cases here, and no doubt there have been others too
However according to the Quilliam report below, "white offenders often acted alone, while child abusers from Asian backgrounds were more likely to work in so-called grooming gangs"
So if this is true, and while nobody denies abusers come from every community, there appears to be a particular pattern of offending in which Asians are over-represented
Puzzledandpissedoff · 19/10/2018 23:17
Exactly, Walkingdeadfangirl As a PP pointed out, it's interesting that the asian gangs abused almost exclusively white victims, suggesting that they were somehow seen as "lesser"
Which is perhaps why the ethnicity/culture of the offenders is relevant after all, no matter how much some might wish it wasn't
Eastie77 · 19/10/2018 23:38
But why is there an assumption that because some Asian men are in grooming gangs, Asian or Islamic culture as a whole considers girls, or specifically White girls, as less than human? The actions of some groups of men are representative of an entire community and religion?
I have been racially abused by white English men. Ditto for many of my friends. It's happened on several occasions. I do not think that those men are representative of white men or English men in general. I think they are ignorant human beings. I'm fairly sure if I began making blanket statements about the white, male community at large on the basis of my experience with some men from that background I'd be met with eye rolls and accusations of "reverse racism".
havingabadhairday · 19/10/2018 23:39
Some of the girls were seen as 'lesser' by white British culture as well - they'd anyway had that label put on them.
When I was in my early teens girls my age had boyfriends in their late teens/early twenties. Why would a 22 yet old want a 13 year old girlfriend? Yet it didn't seem strange at the time because it wasn't uncommon. I grew up in a poor area with a teen pregnancy problem. Pretty sure a lot of the girls were just seen as 'up for it' and never going to achieve anything, so a baby at 16 was the best they could hope for.
HelenaDove · 19/10/2018 23:52
"Interestingly I heard an interview with the social worker in Rotherham who exposed what was happening there and she said the lack of police action wasn’t due to the ethnic background of the men, it was more about the background of the girls"
Exactly Its a class thing. We have a massive problem with class in this country People from housing estates including young girls/women are seen as lesser.
And it has been reflected on these very boards many a time.
MarcieBluebell · 20/10/2018 00:16
Interestingly I heard an interview with the social worker in Rotherham who exposed what was happening there and she said the lack of police action wasn’t due to the ethnic background of the men, it was more about the background of the girls
It may be services failed due the girls' background.
It is a different issue of why the abusers used white girls and their attitudes. Yes it's heinousness but I think a cultural issue too for such a network to work.
If it was white men networking to abuse only Asian girls would you say the same.
Arghhhhhhhffs · 20/10/2018 00:40
I didn't go through it. I saw others going through it whereas my abuser was white.
We have child sexual abusers in all colours. And paedophile networks in all colours identifying as all different religious views or none.
What we have is a model that Asian men are more likely to use... grooming vulnerable girls, pretending to be their boyfriends and then sex trafficking to other cities and getting their mates involved because white girls are "asking for innit" by not being home playing with dolls at 13
And a model that is more likely used by white men... tapping away on keyboards, arranging to meet and grooming pretending to be boyfriends... but more likely to keep for themselves or go undercover to pass around their paedo mates
Of course there's others too. But I think white males more likely do it because they know they are nonces
And Asian males more likely do it because they think white girls are easier than them actually being aware they are nonces
As for the girls... years of therapy and struggles I imagine. But they might be the next Sammy Woodhouse (who obviously it's awful she exists in the public eye because of what she's been through... but is a strong amazing woman who is working hard for other survivors) the girls CAN have a life and Sammy and others prove this.
TheBlueDot · 20/10/2018 01:07
I agree that the common factor is that they are male. However the culture these men were brought up in has shaped their views of girls. I have friends who were not allowed out (apart from school) - they had to be modest and covered up at all times whilst their brothers were treated like kings and allowed to do whatever they wanted. It’s sexism amplified - women exist to serve men. Eg at my friends house, the girls did all the housework, cooked and served food to their brothers. It’s sexism amplified and this is in recent times, not the 50s.
These men grow up conditioned to think modest women like their sisters = good, immodest woman = not worthy of respect. The reason it’s focused on white girls ist so much the fact that they are white but that they would find it harder to get access to Asian girls, who tend to be brought up in stricter households (where girls are subservient). I’m pretty sure if they could have access to an ‘immodest’ Asian girl that they would have treated her in exactly the same way.
OP I wish I could help you. It’s such a shame that there aren’t many resources to help people that have been through this trauma. I hope you find some peace.
Antigon · 20/10/2018 01:24
This is my home town
I think there is a lot of confusion about religion vs culture
Nothing in The Koran encourages or allows this treatment of women and girls BUT there are a lot of attitudes withinPakistani/Bangladeshi and Indian cultures that lead to this sort of thing.*
Islam is no more to blame for this than it is for suicide bombings, it is men who are to blame NOT religion
Interestingly I heard an interview with the social worker in Rotherham who exposed what was happening there and she said the lack of police action wasn’t due to the ethnic background of the men, it was more about the background of the girls. They were seen as complicit in their own abuse.
It's about class. Do you really think would have been allowed to happen in a leafy middle class suburb?
I was watching a Ted talk today about police in the US ignoring a serial rapist until he struck a middle class area. When he attacked a middle class girl, he was captured that day.
The racists will try and pretend that the gangs were allowed to operate out of a fear of being called racist, but that's bullshit. Statistics show police don't shy away from arresting black and Asian men.
And the racists blaming this on Islam are laughable in their eagerness to point fingers and their glee.
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