To have told DH to stop talking?

[seasidewitchtits]

He's been out all day having a 'much needed creative day' - visiting museums and meeting a friend for lunch.

I've been at home with 4 month old and autistic 4yo (and PND) all day, where the only break I got was 20 seconds to urinate before the 4mo kicked off and the 4yo started crying for me. I ate my lunch whilst constantly agitating a bouncer with my foot. It took four separate attempts to hang out one load of washing.

DH has just said 'Ooh I am tired tonight, today's been sooo busy' and, while I have often thought about telling him to shut up in similar situations, tonight I actually did!

He's huffed off to bed now and I'm downstairs waiting to dreamfeed the 4mo. I feel like I've done something wrong, but I don't feel a bit guilty or like apologising. AIBU to feel this way?

OP, I’m 15 years ahead of you (except with 3 DC) and would like to give you a few words of warning, if you don’t mind.

My husband is not the “creative” type, but the “high-finance / time is money / don’t disturb my headspace” type, which essentially translates into the same thing - lack of meaningful parenting.

The only difference in our case is that he very much sees all the money he earns as family money, rather than “his”, so he never asks me to account for spending in myself or the kids. Just as well, as I’ve been a SAHM since my eldest was born (15 years ago) - how much through personal choice, how much through his choice / behaviour, I couldn’t tell you.

When the DC we’re little, I was like you. I felt as if I couldn’t ask him to watch the kids for more than 5 minutes because I was worrried it was too much for him. I felt guilty. Yes, sad, but true, I’m afraid.

What this amount to is that in 15 years I have had ONE night away by myself. Even now, I feel guilty leaving him with the kids. He is also the type who expects all meals made for him and will do the whole “woe is me act” if he had to think about feeding the kids or himself. We have a cleaner twice a week, so apparently this exempts him from doing any housework at any time. I’m in therapy in my 40s and only now starting to see the reality of the situation and how insidious these things are.

The good news for you is that your kids are still young and you see it for what is is now. Don’t end up like me. It’s very difficult to extricate yourself from the kids, I know, but force yourself to do it little by little. It’s a mindset thing and if you don’t challenge it, it will become much more difficult in the future. Good luck!

Unfortunately, a selfish, abusive man will simply make the child's distress worse, deliberately, in order both to punish the mother and to ensure that she doesn't leave the child with him again. Neither the children nor the mother are people in the eyes of men like this, so their feelings don't matter.

My son gets heavily distressed when apart from me and it would just make him worse spending time with his dad.

Sure, children with ASCs vary and what works for one doesn't for all. The OP's child is happy at nursery away from his mother, and his father hasn't really tried yet. So it's about looking at how nursery works for DS and DH replicating some of that - routine, fun, structure, change of location etc.

I've been thinking about this thread a lot and this morning I asked DH to leave. He refused so I said I would take the kids to my Nan's (empty) house about 20 miles away. Now DH wants to talk.

I just don't know where to start tbh.

Coo! That's action. There are a lot of things wrong so a lot of possible places to start. You may not be able to tackle it all at once.

I think top of the tree comes your need for respite - some time to yourself, to do what you want to do or to do nothing at all and rest if you prefer. Close second comes the need for your DS to engage with his own children. Luckily these two things mesh Maybe DH really can care for the baby for an hour or so while you have a coffee after dropping DS1 off at nursery - perhaps he could feed and bath the baby and dress him while you are out. Or whatever else works for your family.

But this is a complex situation and no easy answers. You might ask to get the thread moved to Relationships. You'll get some solid support there.

(Sorry - DH to engage, not DS)

Good on you! He wants to talk? Fine. First thing's first. Get him to read this thread as a starting point, then he can respond to you about it.

He will twist it into him being the victim. He ALWAYS does. He's already told me that I never give him a 'fair hearing'

I think I'm just going to tell him it'd be easier to be on my own. Because I do so much for the kids with no break that there's nothing left for him anyway.

Tell him you need to be able to walk out the door, for once, without guilt or stress or feeling like you are on a piece of elastic. Tell him you have lost your sense of self because you never have any space. It’s not about him having a “fair hearing.” You are at your maximum capacity and that’s the end if it. Is there anywhere you could go for a few nights - alone or with friends / family? He has no concept of how you’re feeling because he’s never been alone with the kids or had to put his own needs to one side. Some men have no concept of this whatsoever, yet they think this is just something women are born to “just do”, as if it’s nothing. Maybe he can learn, maybe not, but you have to show him you mean business.

Also, I may have put up with a lot over the years as I outlined above, but I do know this much - I would categorically not be with and/or supporting a man who saw the money he earned as “his”. Not once you both have children - hell no! That would be an absolute dealbreaker for me, I’m afraid. How can you respect a man like that? Your DH’s mentality has to change there because he can’t have his cake and eat it.

Sending very best wishes. Very difficult situation. Wish I could advise or help beyond that.

As Ahyeahokthen posted

-Doesn't spend time with his kid's more than once a week.

• Doesn't pay for vital items needed for his children.

• Can't be fucked to form a real relationship with his kid's.

• I'm guessing doesn't help around the house either.

Remember all of the above if you talk to him!

He will twist it into him being the victim. He ALWAYS does. He's already told me that I never give him a 'fair hearing'

And you fall for that OK, let him twist it. Let him have his hearing and be the victim and have his say til he runs down. Don't argue or justify or deny. Instead encourage him to keep talking til he stops. "Keep going... what else.... is that everything?" Then go back to what you need, which is respite - think what that means for you and what you need/expect him to do, so you can tell him what that is. And back to what his children need, which is an engaged father who does this for the baby and that with DS. Then let him go away and think about it and make you a proposal.

I think I'm just going to tell him it'd be easier to be on my own.

Don't solve it for him - not yet anyway. Tell him to engage his own brain and see if he can come up with a better solution. With being on your own as the alternative if he can't.

Good luck!

And yes, good thoughts from mandarine

You sound like you’ve had enough. You don’t have to talk to him. Maybe have a week with your phone off just being a mum.

This isn’t about a fair hearing for him though is it... this is you asking him for a fair hearing... he needs to truely listen to you and then think about it, and then come back and tell you how he’s going to try and fix it!

For starters I’d be saying

You need restbite, proper, none guilty restbite, at least weekly (but that should come with my below point)

50/50 partnership for childcare and housework when he’s not at work.

Family money! All money in one pot, after bills (and that includes prams, school uniforms, food etc) it’s split 50/50

He needs to form a proper relationship with his dc

If say if he can’t provide you that, then I’d seriously consider leaving, get decent maintenance and access and you’d be better off than you are niw

So sorry - having a DC with ASD and a baby must be so hard - even with a supportive partner. From what you have said, your DH sounds totally self absorbed. I have a family member who will see every negative situation, which he creates, as him being hard done by. It’s pathological. Your DH may not be as bad. If he is though, it’s a personality defect and the chances of change are small. If it’s that he’s just used to getting his own way, and people thinking he’s great because he’s so ‘creative’ (women can be truly dreadful at that), a wake up call may work.
If it were me, I’d go to the empty house (if it is manageable), and TELL him that you’re not ready to talk right now because you need to think. Whatever he says, don’t engage. Act like you are NOT INTERESTED IN HIM AT ALL. Repeat that you don’t want to talk as you need to think. THATS THAT. Let him stew a while. You need space to see him for what he is, and to sort out what you want him to do,
When YOU are ready, tell him, you can talk now. YOU decide where. Then if he tries to go on and on, let him. Don’t engage. When he’s finished (when he starts repeating himself, just say “OK, is that all, have you finished?”. Then tell him what you need him to do in order for you to stay. Have it written down so you don’t forget anything. If he disputes anything, just repeat that these are the things you need him to commit to to stay with him. Is he saying he won’t? Then you can’t stay.
The only way to change him is to leave him no choice.

You need to tell him fully and break it down bit by bit what you are doing and how bloody hard it is. I snapped at my oh a few months back when I was on the verge of a bloody mental breakdown as the mental load of what I do on a daily basis was just getting so heavily on top of me. Make him see he needs to pull his frigging finger out . Point out how difficult kids alone are let alone one on the spectrum. That the house isnt cleaned by fairies and meals don't magically cook themselves. That yes he may earn money but without you the house would sink. Make him see your worth. As you my dear are superwoman and he needs to see this!

His own guilt at his lack of parenting will cause him to lash out and accuse you of bullying him. You need to beat him round the head with the facts until he sees what you need

Take the kids to the other place first, as PP have said. Tell him you need time to think, away from him.
If he pesters, whines, bombards you with phone calls/texts ie keeps up the pattern of behaviour which demonstrates that only his wishes and feelings matter then you have your answer - the marriage is not salvageable at all, and you will need to get support from eg your own parents, legal advice and possibly WA as well.
Your H will probably whine and cry and threaten suicide - then alternate the pity party with aggression, which will include threats of taking the DC away from you because you are 'mad' (disobedient and disrespectful to your male owner) accusations that you are selfish and a bad mother, and possibly physical aggression. If it does progress to anything physical, report it to the police straight away.

The very best of luck to you in getting this man out of your hair and rebuilding your life. MN will have your back all the way through.

Wow. That’s big. 💐 A couple of thoughts. Do you think talking in the emotional space you’re in at the moment would help/be possible?

What do you think, feel and want to say to him? Could you write it down or dictate it into your phone first?

If you don’t want to talk yet, could you ask for a break - or go to your nan’s place - and prioritise sleep (not housework, not cooking for him etc, just focus on you and kids and what you need to get time to think?) or would the move to your nan’s place be stressful and therefore not conducive to thinking?

If you do want to talk could you ask him to work with you to get most out of a discussion? I did this with my husband once - you need to agree with each other that you will each take turns to speak while the other holds eye contact (the speaker doesn’t have to look at the listener but the listener should be actively listening and watching the persons face) and - key thing - the listener cannot interrupt. In return the speaker is as brief as they can be. Allow loads of time for silence. (I admit this will be hard if angry / defensive) then switch turns then switch back, but the trick is to be actively listening - he can’t just be waiting for his turn to speak so you need to spell that out.

I had to enforce it first few times but when he experienced how it feels to just be listened to, he understood why the not interrupting was important. You need to lose the fear of being interrupted before you can feel free to speak.

You must be feeling so tired and I’m sorry you’re going through this but massive well done for taking a stand. 💐

@seasidewitchtits There are a lot of opinions and pieces of advise being shared on here. I suggest thinking carefully about what you want the outcome to be (separation or staying together with scheduled time out for yourself/your DH to help and bond with his children) before you speak to him. Knowing what you want here is key. Only then can you make the changes for that to happen. Thinking of you and stay strong! 💪🏼

If you leave him you’ll get time off from the kids regularly when he looks after them at least a couple of days a week. Some of the happiest mums I know are in this situation.

Know it’s far easier said than done, but with a partner this monumentally unhelpful I’d be at least looking into it as a possibility, even if it’s a long time before you get to act on it.

Sorry just read your last few updates - ignore me. You sound strong OP 💐

Your husband is only a victim of his own selfish ways.

Things might actually be slightly easier for you since you'll have one less person to look after.

Best of luck to you and your kids.