Social worker says my niece should sleep in bed with me if my partner is in the bed

[newmummy0094]

I've posted questions on here quite a lot recently about my niece. For those who haven't seen them last week my sister had a breakdown and me and my partner have taken her in. This isn't the first time this has happened but it now seems more permanent. My sister suffers from PND which is where this came from. My niece also lived with us for nearly a year when she was two. She is four now.

So me and my partner had a meeting with our new social worker today. Everything went great apart from one thing. She was asking how my niece is coping. So I said she is doing well apart from at night. At night she gets very bad separation anxiety. I think this is because my sister had her breakdown at night. My niece was in her bedroom terrified. Then a stranger took her away to the police station. She then sat there for hours alone with strangers.
Anyway I said to the social worker that she was sleeping in bed with us (me and my partner.) the social work seemed to sit up and listen at this point. She then asked if I was always in bed when my niece and partner in bed together. I said usually but obviously not always. She seemed to go really funny then.
At one point my partner went out of the room to make us another cup of tea. When he did the social work whispered to me 'you really shouldn't allow your niece and partner in bed together'
I was a bit shocked as I've never seen anything wrong with it.
We may be adopting my niece and if we were her actual parents there wouldn't be a problem.
Am I really being unreasonable to have her in bed with us?
What would you do?

You could ask your partner to switch to your niece’s bed when she comes into yours. We do this when DD2 turns up in our bed as she is like a fidgety octopus in bed.

Hi OP. I am a CP social worker. I have been for far too many years and I am also a parent so I can see both sides. I assume that you and your partner are being assessed together and have already been assessed as suitable in the short term.

Social workers are often expected to be risk adverse to a certain extent. What we generally do is manage risk without the aide of a crystal ball. We deal with very vulnerable children whose life experiences (even newborns who have suffered in-utero) mean that they often do not develop emotionally in the same way as other children. We therefore factor this in when assessing carers and need to see that they understand the concerns and can manage this.

I do not know you however the fact you responded to your niece's needs is exactly what I would be looking at. Unfortunately, whilst it is normal for a child to share a bed in such a situation with both parents; when it is a non-birth father people become uneasy. Without knowing you or your niece's circumstances I am not sure how concerned I would be (if she was terrified of men for example, as sometimes happens where there has been domestic voilence) then I would advise against it. On the information you give it does seem reactionary and slightly unfair however society says non-birth father is bad and social workers are also part of society. Rightly or wrongly their is an element of 'cover our backs'. A lot will also depend on the culture of the team and local authority. Some are more forward thinking than others.

Are you and your partner committed to each other and raising your niece together? At this stage you may be assessed as the main carer and in this case it is probably not a good idea. If your partner is likely to move on this would be of concern, not because of anything your partner might do but it is just not appropriate for him to share the bed. This would stand for any parent!

As social workers if things are in the court arena we are very much scrutinised. Whilst this is the right thing it often feels that more weight is given to people who have little knowledge of the children or carers and we have to jump through their hoops. A less experienced social worker can be intimidated by this. Ask your social worker why she reacted this way. As a kinship carer you are entitled to know the reasons behind this reaction . Good luck to you and I hope all ends well.

Think about it. If it becomes normal for the niece to be in bed with the partner (even if OP is there most of the time) then it may not ring alarm bells with her if he later gets into her bed in her bedroom.

It was normal for our children to be in bed with us after a bad dream, illness or even just as a special thing on a weekend morning, sometimes with both of us sometimes just one of us ...what is the difference here?

Why are there "alarm" bells .....because he is not blood related (adopting parents beware) or is it just because he is male??

I don't think there's anything wrong with sharing a bed but I'd be keeping it quiet

Please don't do this!!!!! Encouraging this 4 yr old to potentially lie is a dreadful idea and will make you look awful if it comes to light. I agree with other PPs that unfortunately you have to just 'play the game' sometimes x

It's almost as if non-related men pose the biggest risk of sexually abusing children isn't it I wonder where the silly social worker might have got that idea.

All these comments about encouraging people to 'play the game' with Social services is really alarming.
'Playing the game' is in effect lying to and manipulating ss.
What if you did this, and then found you had genuine concerns about a partner sexually abusing in this sort of scenario? How could you report it after you'd lied?

In a more general sense, how can ss make meaningful decisions and plans about what is in a child's best long term interests regarding something as fundemental as adoption, if the very people that are putting themselves forward as responsible long term carers to a young vulnerable child are lying?

It's almost as if the society has branded all men a risk as opposed to actually taking case by case. I have witnessed DSS being sidelined in his sons life for the first 2 years because of the "just in case" brigade and now he is desperately trying to bond with his son. One size does NOT fit all. I also have a teenage DS ...I really truely worry for him and the way society has already judged him

Given how much SA happens and usually by someone known to a child, I'm very surprised at the amount of people saying that this is stupid. It isn't stupid. It's sensible. You are not her parents so making that comparision is pointless.

Another social worker here. Are you being assessed as carers for your niece? Do you have temporary approval as foster carers as part of her being with you? If you do, then legally you have to abide by fostering regs which include 'safe care ' guidance and that does mean being more cautious. Don't be offended if this is the case, it's as much to protect you and your partner as it is the child. If you don't follow regulations (along with other advice given eg current advice on parenting) then you might not be approved as longer term carers and the SW might be warning you against this. Its awful when people don't get approval because they have different ideas about parenting but sometimes this happens.
Even if this isn't the case for you, your niece has been through a very strange and confusing time. If a child has been brought up sharing a bed since a baby then it's completely normal to them. If they haven't, then it's not - and there's all sorts of potential for confused boundaries. And whilst you want to raise your niece as you would your own child, and I absolutely commend you for that, she is your niece. Sharing a bed with an uncle is not typical and its opening you all up to risk (eg re false allegations or misunderstandings) when it's not necessary and there will be other things you can do to reduce her anxiety.

Wow are people that naive. Again I will say SS treats EVERYONE the same way ....they have their tick sheets almost. God forbid if you should even deviate for their plan. Hence the reason DSS and his other half have been harassed by SS and still are being told where and when to send DSN to nursery etc. She is 21 and DSS is 24 now they are not kids and they are not thugs but SS is too involved. I wonder when they will actually allow them to be parents 25?...30???

I think they are quite right to take this stance. I wouldn't have the two of them in bed together at all, even if you are there. Let him sleep in another room in the short term. It's not a big sacrifice if you are thinking of her best interests long term. Best to keep things completely above board.

It’s just not an appropriate situation for your niece to be in a bed with a Male. It doesn’t promote good things and could be well turned around if she gets angry as a teen and literally ruin his life.

Please just don’t.

The job of your nieces social worker is to safeguard her from harm and assess risk.

Being in bed with your partner poses a risk of sexual abuse - and I mean that it the most non offensive way possible and not as a slight to your partners character.

From my work related experience I'd say that the principle that a child should not be sharing a bed with a non related adult, not a related adult past a certain age is fairly standard.

If the social worker didn't say anything she wouldn't have been doing her job.

I am surprised at your surprise, tbh.

What you are doing is very odd and I hope you haven't jeopardised the placement.

It would be far better for you to set up a camp bed in the niece's room and sleep with her there if her anxiety is getting the better of her.

Please follow all directions of SS to the letter if you want to be sure your niece doesn't end up in foster care with strangers.

That sounds ridiculous, I know they have to protect her, but I'd feel offended for my partner if someone thought that about him.

Yes, well thankfully these days the safeguarding of children is seen as more important than the feelings of adults.

We know what happens when the above isnt applied.

I'm not surprised by this comment either.

For context, foster carers are advised not to ever even sit on the bed of one of their foster children to help avoid the potential for false allegations against them (it's surprisingly common for vulnerable children do this ). They are advised to have a chair in the room to sit on to do things like read a bedtime story

Get her a wee blow up kiddy camp bed and pop it beside your side. If she gets scared she can climb in and hold you hand but not be in your bed. Everyone happy? Shame but unfortunately gotta see ss point of view

As a social worker my first concern wouldn’t necessarily be about potential sexual abuse - if I thought for a second that was an issue either your partner or your niece would be staying somewhere else. I’d be concerned about the level of confusion for a small child who has had a lot of disruption, will be struggling without her attachment figure (her mum) and who needs supportive boundaries.

You’re not her mum and your partner isn’t her dad - you want to adopt her but there’s a long road ahead, not least the process of freeing her for adoption which is not a given by any means. Sleeping with her might confuse her, leave her with the idea that all grown ups can act as a carer for her etc. You’re effectively fostering her at the moment, albeit you’re a kinship carer, you don’t have parental rights and as hard as it is, sw would be very wrong to support you encouraging her to sleep in your bed. It’s very early days yet to know what the plan will be in the long term, I’d be looking for other way to help her settle.

My children are adopted, their foster carer slept with my then 4 year old DS to settle him at night - there was absolutely nothing sinister in it but the level of distress and confusion this has caused him is indescribable.

@Threadastaire
We have already been approved as we looked her for extended periods of time before.

@Allthewaves
Yes that's a good idea

@abbsisspartacus
I think I might have to I just don't want to kick my partner out of his bed.

@marvellousnightforamooncup
There is room for a camp bed so I think that is what we will do. I really don't want to kick my partner out.