To think a second Brexit referendum will not happen

[abacucat]

I am a remainer, but people campaigning for a second Referendum are wasting their time. It is not going to happen.

5year I didn't mention Tony Blair in my little basket of people to run the country as he is so controversial but yes he has articulated very well on the subject as has John Major. I'll pop Nick Clegg in there for good measure too.

What!?? No way war crimes Tony, he should be in the Haig not lecturing us about the EU, did you forget/forgive his lies last time round. Oh and Nick Clegg, your taking the pee now. Tony is who got you in this mess in the first place they had the opportunity to cap numbers coming from Poland in 2003, they decided against it. Instead we were just fed stories about hardworking Poles doing jobs British don't do.

Now liebour are giving us a second referendum. Splitting the vote three ways. Leave, soft and hard! How could anyone trust labour?

I have to admit that watching Labour tie itself in knots over Brexit at their conference is almost amusing. Has anyone heard any politician actually say that they think 26.5% of the population are wrong ? That remaining is actually the best option ? Why are they so terrified of a quarter of the population ?

Labour are giving nothing, its not in their power to gift this.

I doubt they'll be a 2nd referendum, so sleep easy! the ERG/DUP will in no way agree to a 3 way question that splits the leave vote and rightly so.
It would need to be a remain in Eu or accept whatever May brings back inc if that is no-deal.

I wasn't madly keen on the bloke on R4 going on about Labour leaving behind its working class roots ( in a roundabout way, not those actual words) What is it with this country and class ?

Again with remainer logic. Since the referendum not a single remainer has explained WHO is going to build this hard border? The EU has said they wont. The UK has said they wont, and Ireland has said they won't.

It's not a question of 'building' anything, but implementing border checks.

If this is not done, I presume the WTO imposes sanctions on the countries involved (UK/Ireland) imposing punative and non sustainable rates on imports/exports.

We can't just bin off international trade law because we don't like it you know.

Now liebour are giving us a second referendum. Splitting the vote three ways. Leave, soft and hard! How could anyone trust labour?

That's a very attractive package for remainders. I wonder if long standing Tory remainders would vote labour for this?

Justine Greening suggested this AV option.

Voters would rank two of the three options in first and second place.

If one option received a simple majority it would win.

If there was no simple majority.

The option with the fewest first place preferences would be eliminated.

If not the second preferences of the third ranked option would be reallocated to the top two.

The option with the most votes after the reallocation would win.

Totally fair. No split vote.

Splitting the vote three ways. Leave, soft and hard!

So basically 2 options for remain and one for leave. That's not bias at all. And who is going to define what each option means, or do we wing it and hold a finger up to the wind?

A fairer choice would be Norway deal, Theresa May deal, Canada ++, and WTO deal. But of course it couldn't be legally binding, and we would have to allow for a third referendum if the result wasn't liked.

However it would still leave the problem of not knowing what each option means. So perhaps we should negotiate all four options during the implementation period and have the referendum in 2020 when we know exactly what they all mean.

Walkingdeadfangirl did you read my post?

Using an AV system would be much fairer.

It is NOT splitting the vote because of the preferential voting system. If you choose Brexit 1 and 2 you your vote will count towards supporting the most popular Brexit option.

Moussemoose
The way you frame the question can bias the answer. So to include a question which seems to favour staying in the EU you are going to bias the votes people make. The four options I mentioned as to how we leave the EU seem much more unbiased and include all the options.

The question is irrelevant to the voting system. Your point was the vote would be split - using an AV system the vote would not be split.

Your suggestion of a 4 way Brexit choice is totally and utterly unfair as a remain option is practical but you want it withdrawn.

If we make a decision ie Brexit and then vote on the nuances - 4 way Brexit choice - that absolutely undermines the role of parliament.

I dislike referenda but I think politically we need another one to confirm or challenge the last one. We absolutely don't need one for which Brexit option we select.

Moussemoose We already had a vote and we voted to leave, so it is not necessary to have a remain option on another referendum. Also this country does not use AV for referendum, we have had a referendum on AV and it was roundly rejected, the people do not want it.

As the LibDems keep saying, "People voted to leave, they didn't vote for a destination". So the only vote that would be relevant would be on the destination after we leave the EU.

You just want to manipulate the voting system to get the result you want and to keep having new votes until you get the result you want.
NOT going to happen.

What if the destination the public now wants is a return ticket?

Its the biggest decision this country has under taken since WW2, its not reversible after next March 29th, unlike a remain decision, where a vote could be called in another Parliament.

We need to get it right, whatever way we ultimately go, the UK turning its back on Europe has never ended well and whatever you may say, thats exactly what we are doing!
The call from Leave has always been "we can have a FTA with our greatest ally, the USA" well, the USA has changed and Trump will prove to be no friend to the UK.

@Walkingdeadfangirl but it is necessary. In the previous referendum, Leave campaign lied! The vote should be done again, now that the truth about them is known.

Some people will still vote to leave, if it is really in their hearts. People will vote to remain if that's what they want.

Plus... remain, soft Brexit, hard Brexit = two votes for leave, one for remain. Not the other way around.

I'm a die hard remainder, yet I think it wouldn't be sensible to put a remain option on the ballot. It won't help clarify the situation and there will be endless moaning from leave voters.

What I'd do is have a simple binary choice between a soft and hard brexit and in this situation, soft brexit is bound to win as all the remainers will vote for this.

That way there's clarity from the electorate and we avoid the carnage of hard brexit.

People voted to leave having been lied to. The truth is out there now, can you please all stop lying to yourselves and trying to justify your enormous stupidity

What if the destination the public now wants is a return ticket?
Then 'the public' will need to elect a party to government that promises to take the UK to back into the EU. Its called democracy.

Its the biggest decision this country has under taken since WW2
I think there is a much bigger decision to make for this country. ie do we want to elect a party that plans to destroy capitalism. Venezuela style.

Leave campaign lied! You mean everyone 'spun the truth', just like everyone does when it comes to elections, that's called democracy. There wont be anymore 'truths' available at another referendum or election, nothing has changed. I think you would be wise to listen to the recent High Court decision ruling that the electoral commission have misinterpreted the law.

Whichever viewpoint we may have, millions of voters are going to be disappointed. Changing the result will not change that fact.

I want Brexit.

The question was asked and the majority said let's leave so let's leave.

It's not a democratic vote otherwise.

Plus, who on earth wants to be part of a group who want a) all your money and then b) take away all your rights ????

I think a vote for hard or soft Brexit is fair. If it comes back hard Brexit, what then? Seems like the people in power do not want the will of the people. Brexit will be impossible to get through parliament due to remainders like Anna Soubry. Who does one vote for now if you want Brexit implemented?

Please tell me goldiehawn1 how will your life be better if we leave the EU?
Genuine question

goldie? Coff coff, you there? Any answers? No?
No big surprise there then

goldiehawn1 interesting view of the EU, which of course the UK has been a member of for over 40 years and has been instrumental in devising EU policy and law during that time.

In what way has the EU removed UK citizens rights ?