My DD's partner is going on holiday without her?

[floralgrandma]

My adult DD has been with her partner for 18 months, for all intents and purposes they are a serious couple. They haven't moved in together yet but have had several conversations about moving in with one another very soon and the logistics of it. They spend a lot of time together, come round here regularly and see his family regularly too, spend time together with one another's friends etc. They are in what would be considered a serious relationship.

My DD earns less money and also has more expenses as she rents, whereas her partner lives with his parents and also has a much better paid job. He has a lot of savings where as my DD does not. A holiday is currently being organised involving my DD's partner and all of his friends and their girlfriends. My DD has told him she cannot afford to go, so he has told all his friends that she won't be going but he still will. So he will be going without my DD, but with all his friends and their girlfriends.

I am not sure if I am being extra sensitive as it's my DD, but to not even offer to help her when they are in a serious relationship? He does have more than enough money to help her somewhat, I understand that it's not his responsibility etc., but it just seems a tad strange? To be honest I have had my doubts about the seriousness from his end for a while, but I am not sure if I am being a bit harsh with my outlook.

AIBU to think this is a bit shit?

Run like the hills I meant like the wind or for the hills!

And as a childfree by choice woman i particularly "enjoyed" the comment on how she hasnt had kids for him or sacrificed her career for him intimating she is somehow a second class partner in a relationship because of this.

Again, you reading that as alluding to her being a second class citizen reveals a lot about you. I think most people would read that to mean he's not financially responsible for her in the way he would be had she damaged her own career by having kids/being the default parent/being the one to take days off work when the children are ill etc.

Bluntness what's with all the vitriol towards op? You talk about her like she's the worst kind of interfering and overbearing mother, when all she's done is voice concern for her daughter's feelings.It's not to a crime to care for your daughter you know,even if they are above the age of 18!

*not

Op you never know maybe your daughter's bf has knocked her off the fb chat because he is secretly plotting with the group how he is going to surprise your lovely daughter with the holiday as his treat.Fingers crossed.

DP and I are in our 30s, been together 10 years, mortgage etc and holiday separately every year.

However I think it's different in this case because it's a group holiday with friends and girlfriends so yes, I can see why she's hurt.

From what my DD said, he didn't even ask her if there was anyway he could help or anything he could do, just 'Ok you're not coming, I'll remove you from the Facebook group'

YANBU. I would expect any man I'd been dating for 18 months, with discussions about cohabiting soon, to at least behave as though he's disappointed. He has "a lot of savings" so he could have offered to lend her the money, or maybe not to go at all.

I was a similar age to your DD when I dumped my then BF for 2 similar issues. We used to go to a club together each week, but one week I couldn't afford to go. Instead of him offering to lend me the (small amount of) money or stay in with me, he went alone. Second time he was taking his boat out. It only had room for him, the instructor and 2 passengers, and he wanted his best mate to go with him. OK, which left 1 place. Do you think he asked me to go? No, his mate's GF went instead! Sod that, he was telling me loud and clear that he just wasn't into me and I certainly wasn't going to waste any more time with him. Hopefully your DD will take this opportunity to reflect upon the relationship.

This sounds totally mismatched. Do you honestly think this relationship is going anywhere?

I think there's two issues that you need to separate:

1. The holiday

From the information provided I don't think this is a "couples holiday". It's his friend group arranging a holiday around an activity they all want to do (I'm guessing skiing?). I think any weirdness you see in him wanting to go on this holiday without your daughter is misplaced - he wants to go on holiday with his friends to do their activity, he's not going to be hanging out as a third wheel. From his friend wanting to change it to "boys only" as his girlfriend can't go I think it's very clear that its the men that have the original connection/friendship and that they're used to group holidays together, girlfriends have been a recent addition.

You are saying that your daughter (and you) wouldn't expect him to offer to pay or lend money. Surely the alternative is then that he doesn't go without your DD? I don't think that after 18 months I'd expect my boyfriend to forego his regular holiday with friends because I couldn't make it (I'm similar ages to your DD). Is this the first time she's been invited to the holiday? He was maybe a bit quick to accept she wasn't coming but equally if this is the first time she was invited he may just not have realised that she really wants to go and that he could help her?

Removing from the Facebook group - a practicality surely? She doesn't need all the notifications discussing who owes who what. Maybe they're using it to finalise numbers?

I don't think this is a deal breaker in itself, it doesn't mean he'll cheat or that he doesn't like her as much as she likes him - he just wants a holiday with his mates and maybe takes things at face value. She said she can't afford it so that means she's not coming - done. If she's not actually said "I really want to go, can I borrow money" how is he supposed to know that's what she wants? Also you offering to give her money towards it - neither of them know this so how can it influence her staying in a Facebook group?

2. Finances

If he's not paying for any use of the car or any food then your daughter needs to call him out on it. Only she can do that. If it doesn't improve then she knows what she needs to do - get rid.

You do seem to know quite a lot about his financial situation and while you're saying you don't expect him to pay for your DD's holiday, the fact that you've concluded he's capable of this shows you have formed some expectation of what he could do with his money. You might be inadvertently giving your DD false hope that he's going to put his hand in his pocket to cover her, which is only going to cause more upset.

Actions speak louder than words
This guy is selfish and mean with money. May be he is a bit nice but still TAF!

Not only does he not look at ways of helping her out(given that she seems to help him out with use of car and free regular accommodation)!

He actually just removed her from a FB group as she was no longer going on the holiday. Yeah he knows exactly what he is doing and it's to show her that he really doesn't care that much about her.

He earns far more than she does, and has a lot less outgoings and yet he expects her to pay 50/50 when they go anywhere. He could have offered to lend her the money which would have been a very reasonable thing to do in the circumstances.

Your daughter deserves to be treated far better than this and she sounds like a lovely person.
There are far better men out there earning less money who would treat your DD with far more respect than this guy does.

In my humble opinion, id either take my gf with or stay behind as well. To my mind, it shows a lack of empathy/caring/consideration based solely on what's been stated here.
However, so much gets unanswered/explained. For example, does she like his friends/other women at all? Could she be avoiding it because for whatever reason she despises one or more of them? Or simply thinks that much time away with them is too much to cope with? Is she they type to say something like 'I can't afford it, but you go have a good time', possibly regretting it afterwards?
You mentioned 'other things' that make you feel he may not be as committed to the relationship, so is it possible he is having a 'bloke crisis' over being serious, settling down, etc? Us boys can be dumb silly idiots on rare occasions!!!

My mother would have told me to stop hankering after holidays I can’t afford and start saving for my own deposit. Her advice re the car, sell it then if you’re not using it

Tough upbringing 😜

He is so mean. I’d hell my DD to cut ties and find somebody kinder. Somebody who actually loves her, because obviously he doesn’t.

Not mean in the least,just because he’s her BF doesn’t mean he has to bankroll her
DD should live with her means and not expect he pays or subsidies her holiday

Perhaps he should live within his means and stop spounging off his parents and OPs DD while he's staying at her house, eating her food, using her car etc and not offering her a penny. He's in his 30's ffs, he's not 19.

Yes he should
Conversely women shouldnt equate relationship to shared Money and man pays
A joint account or a man paying for you isn’t the zenith of a relationship
A Man buying and paying It’s not the mark of a good or stable relationship

It sounds odd for sure.

After bad experience losing money to boyfriends no i would not pay or loan either. However, i wouldnt chose to go without my dp and i wouldn't be so blase about my dp not going.

I dont think that he's mean for not paying or lending. Perhaps he, like i was, has been stung by loser users before and is wary. It can take a lot longer than 18 months to get so trustful.

I think his blase attitude to her disappointment was unkind though and suspect he is not as commited. He should certainly pay for petrol.

A Man buying and paying It’s not the mark of a good or stable relationship

Sadly that's where it's at for some women though. There is still an element of the population. Who think men should pay for them because they are women, and if they don't they are "mean".

Makes your blood run cold doesn't it.

Yup,a man paying and buying stuff isn’t necessarily good or a bit of a catch
However for some there’s socialisation & expectation that men should pay.end of
We don’t have shared monies dp & I.its my money, and his is his. If I want something for myself i buy it.

I was told on mn that not sharing money makes a relationship unstable.like “flat mates”
Interesting angle on it as I never was intimate with my flatmates

It might be interesting to see the comments from DM online if or when this gets lifted. 🤔

There is also the socialisation and expectation from men that women should shave their legs.

Not as many men are objecting to this sexism though.

its not necessarily a good sign that a man is paying for stuff i agree

But its not neccesarily a good sign that he wants everything split 50/50 either He may well remain rigid in this even when a woman is on maternity leave.

He may well remain rigid in this even when a woman is on maternity leave

Helena, as a childfree by choice person, I'm surprised you automatically assume they both want children.

Just this. If he thought anything of her he wouldn't be going. It's not about him paying for her it's the way he is going about it. I would feel the same if it were my daughter.

Personally I think more men would shave their legs if they felt how smooth it feels AND it was socially acceptable for them to do so ;)!

He may well remain rigid in this even when a woman is on maternity leave

Huh? Last time I checked having a baby was a choice. As was who you had it with, oh yeah and maternity pay is a thing.

Let me know if that's changed, wontcha?