HELP sister had a breakdown. Niece moving in with us. I'm six months pregnant.

[newmummy0094]

I didn't know what to put for the topics so sorry if it is wrong.
I really need some advice.
My sister suffers from very bad PND and has done since my niece was tiny. My niece is four now and has just started school but when she was two my sister had a breakdown and I had to look after my niece for about a year.
Last night this happened again.

My nieces dad is away on business but is obviously flying back now this has happened.

Last night my sisters neighbour rang the police because my sister was lying in the garden naked at three in the morning. My niece was alone in the house so the police got social services involved. Because something similar happened before they released her into our care. As in me and my partner. They did however make it clear that if we didn't look after her she would be taken into care as my sister is an unfit mother.
My nieces dad just can't cope when my sister gets bad. So he really isn't fit to look after my niece and my sister.

My sister found out she was pregnant again which we think is what caused this.
I could see this coming and but I didn't know what to do. I can't believe I didn't do something.

Obviously my niece wasn't in school today but I don't know if I should send her in tomorrow and keep her routine or keep her off as she is really tired with the stress.

I'm going to be looking after her for months at least I think so I just need some general advice about looking after four year olds.

I'm also six months pregnant and I'm really worrying about juggling everything.
The only family me and my sister have is my dad but he lives in America.
Just to make it clear I am happy to look after my niece as I'm all she has.

God the poor child being in a police car with strangers in the middle of the night would have been very traumatic.

Ss will want someone to exercise pr for this child. They will either deem this a family arrangement in the short term or assess you as a 'connected carer' if they are going into proceedings for your niece and or the unborn. Really depends what level of intervention the family were having.

100% see a solicitor as this situation could be resolved long term with a private application for a child arrangements order if all the parties agree.

In the meantime is he inclined to keep her home a couple of days and do lots of reassuring. Things like 'aunty Jane is always here don't forget. That's why you have a bedroom - because you are special and important and loved...' you get the idea. Lots of cuddles as much as you can manage. My dd2 is 5 and is still very physical Conte t dependent.

I really truly wish you all the best x

Just back to echo what Tempster said about looking after yourself as well.

This is bound to be causing stress, and added to the fact you're pregnant yourself and your baby is likely to be born before your sister recovers, your own mental health needs to be a priority too.

I’d look up therapeutic parenting (fab support page on Facebook) as your niece has suffered trauma and will need some support to help her deal with this. Focus on building attachment and being her unassailable safe base. Let her know you are in charge and absolutely safe to be that person. She may try and be controlling - this is a fear based behaviour, and will need firmly and gently reminding that you are very good at being in charge and keeping her safe. She may regress and want you to baby her. This is ok too and she may need to re-enact times when your sister was not able to meet her needs when she was tiny. And don’t be afraid to ask for support from ss. If you do take your sisters second child, make sure that you have a support package in place so you can be there to help these two vulnerable children grow well. Good luck.

I'm so sorry you're all going through a difficult time at the moment OP. You're a good person for stepping up and taking care of your niece. Personally if she's tired I'd keep her off tomorrow and try to do some fun chilled things with her. Let her school know the reason why and let them know what's going on just in case there's a change in her behaviour or anything.
Is your sister being treated for her mental health? Sounds like she can do with some extra support.
I really hope things get sorted for all of you. I hope your sister can make a recovery. Your niece will be fine, kids are so resilient and alot stronger than we give them credit for.
You're doing a wonderful job OP.

You sound like a lovely person/aunt, OP.

Would you consider going down the route of having the parental rights terminated (if that's even possible) and/or adopting or being made legal guardian of the current niece and new baby?

I'd be concerned that the current set up would result in the child/ren being bounced back and forth between two households whenever the parents feel that they're up to looking after the children. This would be upsetting not just for your nieces, but for your own children who will effectively be growing up as siblings to their cousins.

I'm so glad for your niece that she has a lovely auntie like you in her life op .I would inform the school of what's going on(if they don't know already),so as they can keep a close on her but get the wee'un back to school asap to ensure there is some routine in her life.Good luck to you all x

OP remember your own pregnancy in all of this. It's wonderful that you are helping but you need to look after yourself and your bump also. Perhaps look into some self care & do something daily even while DN is in bed.

I don't have much advise my lo is only 2 and doesn't do school yet but just wanted to say that it's lovely what you doing and the little girl is lucky to have you..hope your sister will get better

If you haven't been along to the Adoption board yet then do so.

If this turns out to be a long term thing you can apply for a Special Guardianship Order which is less than Adoption but more than Fostering.

I had this years ago, sister sectioned, brother in law disappeared and my niece and nephew came and stayed with me and my new baby.

They are all grown up now but was a lovely experience like a sleepover for half a year with my favourite people, I didn't have enough space for them really so was very crammed in. It's great she's been coming to stay with you and is familiar with the place it's such an awful time with her starting school but if she's got you waiting for her at the end of the day she will be fine

Advice would be that when your sister is all better and wants her back ease her into home very slowly to now overwhelm your sister or niece

Loved the suggestion about the same washing detergent

The hardest thing is being in mum mode when you're used to be fun auntie with all the treats

I am not sure about services in your area, newmummy0094 , but there are often mother and baby units where they can stay together whilst the mum is being treated. Obviously this also depends on how ill the mum is and treatment plan etc, but they will keep them together where possible.

It would be good for you to build good communication now with mental health services and social services and get in as a point of contact and support. That will help all of you as well as the new baby.

@newmummy0094

There's already lots of good advice on here so I will try not to waffle. :)

I would imagine that things are a little overwhelming for all concerned at the moment so if possible I would take some time out of work and concentrate on getting some stability back. For dn but also you and your dp. It looks like you will be looking after dn for the forseeable future so don't worry if you haven't got everything in place by the end of today. :)

A friend of mine took in her nephew when he was a couple of months old and had a one month old. She has ended up with being his legal guardian and raised the 2 boys almost like twins as they are so close in age. There have definitely been a few bumps in the road but as he's been able to stay with family he's had a much more secure and stable time. So I can see that what you're offering to do is such a kind thing for the child.

As pp have said, routine is important as it gives chn a sense of stability. I would assume that as you have her so frequently anyway that you are already a really important part of her life so this will help her adjust.
It's important to speak to school as they'll be able to offer further support and also be understanding and careful when looking after dn.
Getting advice from solicitor is also a good idea as pp said as the legal status of dn is something which can affect the help you and she can get.
And speaking to ss as they can be of great help in your case and their involvement means you will be able to access other things like therapy, extra support from school.

You're doing great already but please also remember to take care of yourself, and that even those of us who have just their own children have stresses and strains, meltdowns to cope with etc etc. So don't panic if dn starts regressing or acting out.

I hope you're ok and have support in rl too.
And that your sister is able to get the help she needs. It sounds so awful for all involved. :(

Lots of good suggestions op and your niece is very lucky to have you. A few people have said 4 year olds like routine, especially when they are anxious. It’s easy to add lots of routine by littlethings you will say or do eg when I pick you up from school I will give you a very big cuddle and I will say you were a star today! And at home we have to change out of your uniform and then I will have an apple and a cookie waiting for my little star.
Mine is 3 but has settled at a new nursery this year and been very anxious. We have had to endlessly talk him through the collecting- ‘after lunch and play you will come back to the cafe, and mummy will be sitting there with a cup of tea waiting for you. I’ll say where’s my baby bear and you’ll say here I am! I’ll give you a big cuddle and a little squish.’ He’d repeat this a dozen times the night before ‘and mummy will be drinking her tea waiting for me. You will say wheres my baby bear and I’ll say here I am!’ Hed get a bit wobbly towards the end sometimes!

What does your partner think about all of this? You're talking about looking after another newborn baby when your own baby is only going to be 3 months old. Along with a 4 year old. That's a lot. If money is not an issue, perhaps there needs to be a nanny employed to look after these children in their own home with their own father. You can offer respite and support.

I know a couple of people who have had a breakdown personally and I’m a counsellor..... how long it takes to recover is a really tricky question but what I will say is once there’s been a diagnosis and proper medication / intervention has been administered you can see a turnaround pretty quickly actually. She might have turned it around by the time the baby is born, it’s not out of the question.

Plus I know people have mentioned nannies etc. But I didn’t read your post as wanting / needing that kind of support, I could be wrong? I’d say don’t get a nanny tbh. Keep her with the people and things that are familiar to her. Safety is is what I imagine she’s craving and love obvs. I think routine is great because it brings about a feeling of security and safety but she hasn’t been at school long enough to get that there, hopefully the school will come up with a plan to ease her in.

If you are struggling and have the money (I know you said money isn’t an issue) maybe put it into things like getting a cleaner so that eases your load. Ultimately though trust your gut, I bet you know what you’re doing more than you think. Your family are lucky to have you x

I think people are talking about a nanny to help the sister's husband with childcare, so he can actually step up and be a dad.

It is a wonderful thing that OP is doing, but the niece does have 2 parents. Yes her mum is poorly, but the dad really has no excuse.

I agree the dad needs to step up, but it's clear he's not going to, at least not yet. So better that DN is with OP right now.

You’re a old person op. I’m surprised they’re having another when they can’t cope with the one they have though. I would be concerned about this as unless there are plans in place you are likely to have 3 children to care for in the next year.

You’re a good not old person op. So sorry, bloody auto correct.

She said her sisters husband is also prone to depression couldn’t cope last time. She said ‘my niece needs to be with me’. She was asking for tips on looking after a 4 year old not opinions on why the husband isn’t better. Maybe she’s relieved he’s with her sister, I don’t know. But I’m reading her post as she wants her niece with her and is asking for tips on that. Maybe I’m wrong. I’m fine with that if I am.

The father sounds like a useless git to be honest. What does your partner say?

I hope the BIL will step up and offer OP significant financial support as well as a commitment to see his dd regularly and not leave it all to his heavily pregnant SIL.

I’ll admit OP, I’d be very angry at him in your position.

You clearly aren’t, or if you are you’re trying to put it to one side as your DN is the priority, which is very admirable.

This is so sad. The little girl will want security, routine and the familiar.

I woud get advice, perhaps on the adoption board. Many years ago, but a friends sister was in a bad way after the birth of her first child, a lot like your sister. The dad stepped up, and also remarried and would have been in a great position to provide a secure upbringing for the child. Unfortunately the mother then went through a relatively good patch and demanded custody, which she got. The good patch did not last and the poor child had to endure a pretty chaotic childhood involving drug taking, random men, frequent moves and more. Relatives have looked on and done what they can to help, but to a large extent they are not trusted. Indeed the GPs were subject to significant abuse. It has been very sad.

If you are willing to take the little girl in, do try to ensure that it will be difficult to reverse this against your wishes. And I hope you are rewarded with lots of love and happiness.

Have only skimmed the thread and read the OPs posts, but can't see where she says anythin about the father being useless.If he is flying back , it is surely to take care of his dd?? It would be more helpful if you could take care of your sister and allow her father to care for his chid.Or is there anywhere else your sister could stay whilst she gets treatment for her illness