To think women’s rights are actually bad for women

[crazydoglady6867]

I am sure I will get shot down for this but here goes:

I really think that women wanting and largely getting EQUALITY is the best thing that is happening in modern times. What I have an issue with is women wanting to be better than men, wanting more rights and with girls/women only groups sports events etc we are actually just segregating ourselves and making men feel ostracised in some situations which is making them feel they need to gain back this “power” they feel they should have over women.
I am in a bike group who have a ladies section and they are just recently going a bit OTT over the women riders and making them more inclusive than the men really, they have special ride outs for them but men are not allowed to have a male only one. Etc etc...

You can see where I am going with this, and I am happy to change my mind in how I feel if posters come up with a reasonable debate into why I am wrong here.

I want to be thought of as equal to my male counterparts I don’t feel I need to have special running races they can’t run in or special groups my son can’t join or special days to celebrate my gender.

I remember a sketch in the 70’s on the Two Ronnies with Diana Dors in it called “the worm has turned” and thinking yeah as if that will ever happen, well people I can honestly say I am getting a bit worried for our men.

I know MN has a good proportion of man haters but you can’t all be like that, am I really the only one who feels like this.

If you acknowledge that male privilege exists then surely you accept that white privilege exists?

Therefore all white people are as responsible to non white people as men are to women?

I've actually been lucky in that I've been made to feel welcome in most circles I've ever been a part of and not experienced much racism. But I am quite well educated so privileged in that regard and I'm a big guy so not an easy target.

I agree that us men don't face as much sexual harassment but we have our own challenges.

The other night we thought somebody was trying to get through the side gate (it was an animal of some sort) and it was I that had to trundle down in my dressing gown. I couldn't see into the end of the alley (didn't take a torch) and the sound stopped as soon as I approached. In the few seconds before the animal scurried away I assumed I was facing down another man stood there in the shadows and my first thought was "I hope he hasn't got a knife because I'm unarmed."

I can't see many instances where the man would stay in bed and the woman would be expected to confront the would be knife wielding burglar. This is just one of the expectations of the man and men have always protected their land/families/property/community against other men.

There will always be bad men and it will always be the 'good' men who have to confront them - and the people who sit on the sidelines will say "well, it was your job as a man to deal with male violence".

Churchill said, "the average person sleeps soundly because of the rough men standing by ready to commit violence on their behalf."

Any right thinking women does not hold all men responsible for the crimes of the few.

As society we all have the responsibility for highlighting bad behaviour when we see it and if we feel safe to do so.

To suggest that men are the only ones responsible is just ridiculous.

I'm glad that somebody shares my sentiment.

I despise violence and have no idea why some men are so aggressive, and I certainly don't know how to stop it - my wife teases me for being a big wimp! Although I would hope that I'd try and help in individual situations where I could (although many men have also died after being stabbed when breaking up fights etc).

@Eagleitarian

It's not your fight.

The best that you can do, that any of us can do, is to raise our children to be decent human beings and to be decent human beings ourselves.

Authuritis You didn’t answer any of my points about White History month, Straight Pride, the Paralympics or getting rid of autism friendly cinema screenings or over 60’s swimming sessions.
Eagle Thank you for acknowledging that men are not subjected to sexual harassment on anything like the scale that women and girls are. That’s a start.

Why all the whataboutery Arthuritis?

@PCPlumsTruncheon

And no one is answering any of my points either - just accusing me of being a man or making stuff up.

Why do I need to answer your questions?

So you can accuse me of making things up? Or dismiss my views?

I've made my views clear.

No one is responsible for anyone else. That's it.

Men face different problems to women but they are real and they deserve that to be acknowledged.

Women face problems different to men and they deserve to have them acknowledged.

Why all the whataboutery Arthuritis?

Is that just a made up word?

I was trying to put across the difficulties that I've seen the men in my life - family, friends acquaintances - face.

But apparently they are all made up.

None of you believe me.

You don't believe that I'm a woman.

So why are you bothered what I think or what my views are on anything?

Clearly I am irrelevant to you so why bother asking?

Oops sorry Arthuritus. Didn't realise you were a man.

@McFugget

Isnt against the rules here to deliberately misgender someone?

You all think you are being so clever.

All you are really doing is showing your ignorance.

Is this how you treat women in general?

Be little them, mock them, sneer at them?

Isn't that what you accuse men of doing?

And yet it's ok for you to do it to me?

How does that make you any different to the men that you despise - the men who mock and belittle and invalidate women?

You're apparently so in favour of women yet you just want to knock me down?

Two women a week and 84 men is sadly a drop in the ocean for our society

Can you clarify what you mean by this? It's not murder statistics because that would equate to almost 5000 murders a year, which far exceeds the actual number committed.

It's how many men kill themselves each week.

Apologies if caused confusion by not compare like for like. The two issues most commonly discussed seem to be the two women murdered weekly and the 84 male suicide (although the latter is hardly touched upon in comparison tbh, possibly because us men don't talk about this type of stuff as much).

I’m the one that has to escort children to the outhouses in actual bear country. All night long. I don’t have a penis.
But yes.
Toxic masculinity is a problem for men and women. And the culture of masculine violence is why so many women die at the hands of men, men die at the hands of men, and men die by their own hand, whereas women use softer suicide options and often fail in their attempts.
It still doesn’t mean it’s women’s job to fix toxic masculinity, just because men are more successful in their suicide attempts, and women aren’t. Added to which, women often decide to suffer in for the sake of their caring responsibilities. I’ve discussed this a lot with suicidal men, and those that recover do often cite their children as factors. So men taking in more caring responsibilities would help there too.
Still can’t see it being cited to relieve women of the care task though.
It’s enough to use the statistics to prove that men have it harder, without accepting that men have a responsibility to themselves to sort it out.
Always the woman’s work.

To be angry because women suffer periods and pregnancy seems a bit ott. Women can choose to do sport/ study certain subjects, have babies, follow a certain career. Most men are not great footballers at school or heads of big businesses they can be weedy. Not that bright, depressed, bad socialises, lonely , get beaten up , to generalise life is soooooo much easier for them is wrong. We are all muddling through.

Women are sexually harassing men all over the country on nights out...bingo!!!

Do please try harder.

Obsession with DBS checks preventing someone working in a school

Mums in a playground calling a male teacher a paedophile (awful and wrong)

Major major issues with men apparently being the most vulnerable

Arguing more about teacher son being vulnerable than teenage daughter who was actually sexually harassed.

My god but going away and reading it all in one go makes it so much clearer.

Authuritis The fact that you won’t address any of the perfectly reasonable questions I asked speaks volumes. And you have blown your cover by talking about ‘misgendering’. You have been on a thread of nearly 1000 posts from beginning to end dismissing the challenges that women face that men don’t face.
I really hope you are a man because it depresses me to think that there are women who think the way that you do.

If the man you keep referring to with the DBS check wasn't falsely accused of a sexual or violent incident by a woman then he's got nothing to worry about has he?

Only certain roles qualify for a standard DBS and that just gives convictions and cautions. Enhanced DBS is only for an even smaller number of roles and can include any information the Police hold (but not always) and barring will check if that person is barred from working with certain groups due to a safeguarding check.

If it wasn't a sexual or violent incident then I don't understand why you keep bringing it up on this thread because then it's just about 'people' making false allegations and men and women could equally be victims and not 'women making false allegations against men and ruining their lives'.

And as an aside, yes some men may be falsely accused of sexual or violent crimes against women but I look at criminal records and DBS checks nearly every day and people don't tend to be honest about them when chatting to people they know - especially if they've been accused of a sexual or violent crime against women or children.

Also, nobody, particularly not me, has been complacent about suicide rates among men.

What isn’t on, is to use that figure to stop discussion about women’s rights, and to silence women talking about it.

Absolutely, the levels of male suicide are a worry particularly among young men and war veterans.

Why are you then using that to attack women? Ask yourself that.

Instead of recognising it for what it is, it’s own issue which does need to be addressed.

Why are you using it to attack, malign and belittle women discussing something which is important?

Because in the end, for some people, all that matters is men.

That’s what it really boils down to.

Which is exactly why feminism is fucking needed.

Precisely hen. It's not that no-one cares about male on male violence or male suicide. I care deeply and have a successful career based around trying to tackle some of the issues.

But the violence and abuse unequally perpetrated by men against women is important. Women need to be able to discuss it without 'what about the men?' being constantly suggested.

And anyone going on to a thread about male on female violence and saying 'but men are more at risk of violence from other men' is insensitive, offensive and trying to shut women down. It's also irrelevant to the discussion.

When the overwhelming majority of male victims of violence are victims of women, when the overwhelming majority of murdered men are murdered by a woman (usually a partner or ex partner), when 85,000 men in England and Wales are raped by a woman every year and men are routinely harassed and threatened (usually with rape) on the streets, at work and on social media..then you can try to distract us with 'but what about the men?'

And this is a thread to discuss eomens and mens rights and how they affect each other.

So yes you can discuss womens and mens rights.

And for the final time I AM A WOMAN

And it doesn't matter how many times you say different it doesn't alter that fact.

Strong arguments you've all got

• you're a man

• and you're lying. The things you say happened actually haven't.

Well tough luck. Yes they have happened, no I'm not lying and no I'm not a woman.

And I am so glad that my world view doesn't align with yours.

For any of you with sons - I feel so sorry for them. I can't imagine how it feels to be them knowing that their mums hate them simply because of their sex.

You keep harranguing me fir not answering your questions - I've answered way more than of you have.

Most of you have ignored my questions and when you've been proved wrong - misquoting me or lying about what I've said - you've just skipped over that and resorted to calling me names instead.

Bullies the lot of you. And far far worse than the men you claim to better than.

Think on. Think about what it makes you for having such a stereotyped view of a woman that the only way you can deal with opinions outside of that view in your head is to say they come from a man!!!

I am not a man.

And anyone going on to a thread about male on female violence and saying 'but men are more at risk of violence from other men' is insensitive, offensive and trying to shut women down. It's also irrelevant to the discussion.

Yes but this isn't a thread about male on female violence is it?

So it's not a relevant argument.

This is a thread about the rights of men and women and if one affects the other.

So take your agenda and discuss it on the relevant thread.

@PCPlumsTruncheon

I really hope you are a man because it depresses me to think that there are women who think the way that you do.

Well I'm not a man I am a woman.

Sorry that depresses you.

That fact that other women have views like you and others on this thread depresses the hell out of me too.

I was referring to the poster upthread who was banned for doing just that. Going onto a thread about womens fear of male violence and making it about male on male violence.

For what it's worth, I believe you're a woman. It's just that you've acted like a man on this thread. Including dismissing discussing female victims of male abuse as 'an agenda'.