To be heartened to see so many European flags...

[Sarahlou63]

at the Last Night of the Proms? Love the music and general English nuttiness of the concert but really pleased to see so many European flags and hats.

Again I voted remain. But I think we also need to discuss why people voted leave
And we need to listen to them
If we want to remain and get the decision reversed, then we need to change the minds of brexiteers
We need to listen to their concerns and try do policies that help

This.

My DP can’t bear to watch The Last Night of the Proms. I made him sit through a few minutes of it so I could laugh at him seething. He hates mass displays of middle classness He was doubly triggered last night because of the references to the end of WW1 which he also has strong views on. He ranted for ages about ‘why the fuck did we not have a revolution in 1918’ and how the only song he’d be happy hearing T the Proms was ‘Keep the Red Flag Flying.’ He’s like this every year. Usually I let him switch channels but I made him watch it his year for comedy value. He detests The Archers for the same reason and whenever he hears the theme tunes starts ranting and demanding that we switch off ‘this middle-class shite.’

Casper. I think it would be naive to assume that it’s as simple as that. The EU will proceed with its plan and the UK will be treated like a naughty child for not integrating. We will be gradually sidelined with no control over key policy areas that will hugely impact us.

The Proms started in 1895. Before any EU votes.

The more I see, the more I read, the more I think I would vote 'leave' if there was another vote. Which I trust there won't be.

The remainers do themselves no favours by patronising and insulting the leavers. This thread is a fine example.

“The remainers do themselves no favours by patronising and insulting the leavers. This thread is a fine example.”

Catsize - bang on.

I was at Proms in the Park at Hyde Park last night and there were many people outside handing out free EU flags...you had to pay £3 for a Union Jack. We stuck with the free flags so we had something to wave at the end - nothing political on our behalf, we just wanted a free flag! The volunteers handing out the EU flags were saying it was to celebrate the fact that the artists performing had been able to travel to the event for free without a visa.

Defrack I agree with what you say. Undoubtedly there were many reasons for the EU vote, but many certainly had the reasons you suggest, particularly the one about the UK gov constantly blaming the EU.

Britain is very divided and there is a lot of anger and class resentment being thrown around at everyone in sight. Everyone, including people like LarLarLand’s DP, needs to grow up a bit and start both talking and listening.

We were at the Royal Albert Hall last night and people were handing out free EU flags (and hats) outside, inside the venue you had to buy them.

I still think there was significantly more Union Jacks than EU flags in the venue, probably more EU hats. Also several people in Union Jack waistcoats/suits and a couple of pro-EU t-shirts.

There were plenty of other flags though too, Welsh, Japanese, Costa Rica and to someone in the audience the event did not feel political at all, just very patriotic.

YANBU. I think there were more EU flags in the Albert Hall than any other country's flag, including the UK. It was very noticeable - and I found it very comforting to see.

Regardless of what we do the government isn't going to change its mind is it?

And there you have it. This is an ultra-Tory coup and the will of the people has fuck all to do with it.

The remainers do themselves no favours by patronising and insulting the leavers. This thread is a fine example.

I don't think it's patronising to say that people didn't know or understand what they were voting for, when two years on Brexit looks absolutely nothing like what was promised by the leave campaign. Remainders have the right to continue to protest against what they see as the pointless destruction of their country.

That's because they were given out for free.

I thought it was wonderful to see those wearing EU berets and waving the EU flag singing Rule Brittania and Jerusalem with such gusto!

The thing is, it's not a case of British v European and you'd probably find just as many people who would happily wave both flags, as they're not mutually exclusive. Those who support a people's vote are as patriotic as the Quitlings claim to be. Arguably it is more patriotic not to want your country destroyed. Also, yes the EU flags were free and the British omes weren't (how i laugh at the prophetic irony of that by the way) - but if I were so opposed to something that I'd voted against it, I certainly wouldn't be doing anything that would associate myself with it. Are Quitlings scared by the thought that perhaps many of their number finally foresee the disaster that lies in store and have consequently changed their minds?

He hates mass displays of middle classness

Me too! Hate last night of the Proms.

I don't think it's patronising to say that people didn't know or understand what they were voting for, when two years on Brexit looks absolutely nothing like what was promised by the leave campaign. Remainders have the right to continue to protest against what they see as the pointless destruction of their country.

This .

I am now in the ridiculous and ironic position of applying for German citizenship under the Right to Return policy. We are applying to go back to the country my grandparents fled in the 30's . Or more accurately, one fled- the other was rescued by the Kindertransport (RIP Sir Nicholas Winton ). If we dont manage this then I will apply to Ireland as my mother was born there.
My 18 year old daughter has changed her university plans to now include a modern foreign language. She and other young people can see what's coming and they will leave this beleaguered island in droves. So, not only will we lose EU talent and brains from this country we will also lose British talent and brains.

Non goady question for Brexiteers.
How is Brexit working out for you, Leavers? Is this where you thought we'd be, two years on? What do you think about all the talented and well qualified people and organisations planning to leave or have already? It's as though the Brexiteers call to LEAVE has been heard by the very people that were supposed to fill the roles previously held by non Brits. I would laugh at the irony if I wasn't so bloody damn upset by it all.

WrongOnTinternet I’ll tell him you said he needs to grow up. I think a lot of his resentment stems from now operating within a very traditionally middle class world and seeing how social mobility is actually in decline. It makes his blood boil. Perhaps then we need to work in dismantling the fucked up class system in the UK rather than my DP?

@joffreyBaratheon I’m not sure you can call all of the compositions by Elgar “shit”.

It is possible to adore Europe, and still not want to share in everything with it .

It is possible to vote leave and yet have family representing a good chunk of the eu. It is possible to have people in the same family voting different ways.

So hanging eu flags out?

Hoof I think your forcing yourself to believe the narrow chink your looking at. Self affirming your beliefs.

Did you give a shit when an extremely poor eu country had a brain drain like has never been known before? Was that any concern to you?
Your dd maybe shitting herself because this is what her mum thinks.

Millions of bright people will be staying put and finally we can actually get more talent into the UK via normal visa route.

Honestly this sounds like one of parents crying in the playground laying grief into small dc yelling. You've killed my children...

Leave is exactly where I thought it would be.
In any tumultuous time there will be waves and waves... And chaos and working out... It was never going to be possible nice clean break because the eu is a beaurocratic morras of ideology.. Above all else!

It's a very weak argument and most leavers know there will be ups and downs.

I would like a leaver at the helm now. Someone needs to get grip and steer us out.

If any remainder is worried... Just go and read some history.

LarLarLand I was kind of expecting a worse reply. When you do tell him, please quote me correctly - I said everyone needs to grow up. FWIW I come from a similar background to your do by the sounds of it and just got lucky. I do think the born middle classes bear more of the blame because they had the money which buys opportunity, power and choice, and talking and listening is supposed to be what they’re good at. But we all need to be better than we should be right now or we’ll end up with no country at all, in the EU or out.

Morethan I do read history. Which bit of the previous 2000 years of it, or 60000 years of prehistory, did you have in mind?

AnalUnicorn and Catsize - very well said. As for the EU flag waving at LNATP - pathetic, irrelevant, will change nothing, Brexit will NOT be reversed. Time for the Remainers to get over it and stop their incessant whining.

WrongonTinternet I hear what you say about the middle classes but they are guilty of so much damage in this county. They have constructed a complex set of social rules that are pretty much impenetrable by the lower classes. If anybody does manage to join the club, more often than not they pull up the ladders behind them. I see this time and again in rL and even in this forum.

I didn't suggest it was he only reason I stated that it As one of the main reasons, not just people being racists.

I was actually supporting you and saying jot all leave voters are racists so we need to listen to them and see why they voted.

I think the vote should we reversed but to do that we need to try persuade the leave voters it's a bad idea and to do that we need to actually listen to them.

Lovely to see all the EU flags in London.

Not so lovely that Scottish flags were banned and confiscated at the Glasgow event.