Remainer 'moral superiority'

[coffeeaddict]

I voted Remain but I dithered and I can see both sides of the argument. (Am I the only one?! Everyone else seems to be so polarised.)

What gets me, especially when I've read discussions on here, is all the very vociferous Remainers who talk as though they have a claim to the moral high ground.

I find the accusation that Brexiteers are 'racist' particularly weird. Europe is mostly white like us. How does race play a card? If anything, letting our borders open to all and every European (majority white) means necessarily less room for other people from different countries and therefore different races.

In fact, what is the EU? A band of rich, predominantly white countries banding together to be more powerful. Fine, this might be best for our trade and prosperity. It might be pragmatic. We might like feeling we could go and live in Spain one day. But that's not the same as being morally 'better'.

But a lot of Remainers behave as though they are inherently 'virtuous' and Brexit is inherently 'evil.'

I don't get it.

The working classes used to have careers, jobs, pensions, strong unions. Affordable housing. Then 1979 happened. Look forward to the Tories scrapping their own ideology.

If working class people voted out due to anger and resentment then they are about to become angrier. Pawns in a right wing game.

Iheart
I don’t think any of the economics add up. You’ve got remainers desperately trying to push the idea that locally made and bought food is not the best thing for the economy and for stability.

Which is clearly, false.

The leave campaign wasn’t honest but at least didn’t pretend that everything was dandy already.

That’s one clear way to turn people off.

Going back to Mary Beard and the woman in Boston on question time and similar situations that have played out time and time again

What was needed was I am listening, I hear what you are saying, yes in some areas we have allowed business to take advantage of EU workers and that you have lost becuase of that and that isn’t fair, yes we do acknowledge that some areas have struggled with high levels of EU immigration and changed lives for people there and that hasn’t always been positive for them

People don’t just read up on economics and stats (we can easily be manipulated) and not many of us understand the complexities of the EU many people vote on their experience, they listen to those who have similar experiences and form their opinion this isn’t anything new this isn’t exclusive to the EU referendum it is what happens in elections and referendums

If Remain had engaged , if they have addressed immigration, if Remain had acknowledged struggles, if Remain has made promises to make changes to improve people’s lives they would have I believe won

Everyone’s vote is as valid as the next persons no matter how they come to make the decision they have done that comes from living in a democracy

The leave campaign never spoke about using more home grown produce. If you apply that to white goods, cars etc the U.K. is screwed. The 1950s are over.

Isn’t the government supposed to improve people’s lives? Seems like people took domestic problems out on the EU.

Spot on enthusiam

So, moving forward, and seeing how we are apparently all in agreement that "nobody is blaming the EU" - how will Leaving the EU improve anything at all for anybody at all?

Ghost

Speak to people, rather than focusing wholly on the media. You’ll find very different reasons why people voted leave

TheElement

We ARE leaving the EU. Stop pretending it’s not going to happen.

I agree with a PP on a soft Brexit being more suitable

And yes their is proof that their is discontent within Europe and towards the EU

The rise across Europe of right wing populist parties

"Certainly in the NHS our wages would have been higher but for the constant import of cheap workers whether they be from within or outside the EU."

No it wouldn't! The wage rises in the NHS have been controlled by the government.

There are still shortages and wages aren't rising.

Again quoting the stuff about EU immigrants under cutting wages and the pressure on infrastructure is simply inaccurate. Its a nice myth to blanket yourself in though.

"The rise across Europe of right wing populist parties"

None of whom have leaving the EU as a policy. Many of whom had been in government in the decade previous to this one.

Confirming your bias much?

Mother you’ve seen it here.

We need a pro-leave Labour Party.

A proper socialist party that can lead us into a new era (whatever it may be)

I agree Corbyn isn’t right. His attack on women’s rights have completely turned me off him

My in laws voted leave. The Turkey poster and boris being a “nice man” won them over.

I’ll remember that when the supermarket shelves are empty. Populism never ends well.

"Speak to people, rather than focusing wholly on the media. You’ll find very different reasons why people voted leave"

MAny of whom just like you, have their own version of what leave will look like.

You're going to disappointed.

What attacks on women’s rights?

Of the 10 best countries in the world to live, Norway and Iceland are in the top 5.

This doesn’t have to be as bad as everyone is making out, there is no evidence that it will be.

" don’t think any of the economics add up. You’ve got remainers desperately trying to push the idea that locally made and bought food is not the best thing for the economy and for stability. "

Well we've discussed your utter lack of economic understanding. The other point is just a strawman that you have created.

Ghost

Go check the feminism board. It’s not really the right thread for all that.

The are EU sceptics and believe in nationism

That isn’t in line with being in the EU their agenda maybe not to leave it but it certainly different to how it is run now

What the EU means to the people in Central Europe is very different to the UK down to history

"Of the 10 best countries in the world to live, Norway and Iceland are in the top 5. "

Both of which are in the single market, EEA, rule takers from the EU, pay into the EU, and have FOM, and are subject to ECJ rulings on.

So why are you using them as an example?

Fact is, as lives get harder under the Europe umberella, which they’re set to, no doubt about it, people will increasingly choose to leave when they can