Aibu or is school, regarding discipline?

[Imustbemad00]

Would like any information anyone can give me regarding secondary schools and discipline procedures.
My child’s secondary school is strict. I knew it was strict, partly why I chose it. However, in reality, it is causing so many problems. My child has changed so much since starting there, unhappy, suffering with mental health and has developed a bad attitude problem and I will admit is being quite naughty at school and at home. Im worried.

This brings me on to the school rules and discipline. The school penalises children for looking out of a window, or anything viewed as a drop in concentration or messing around. Even dropping a pen. They have to move through the corridors in silence and not make eye contact with anyone and can’t even mess about at break time. They have to sit and chat and be sensible. It’s like they can not have personalities.

The sanctions for bad behaviour are extreme. My child has spent a lot of time in isolation, which means out of lessons. Not learning. Not talking to another person all day. Not great for a child already struggling with mental health.

The school also give them double detentions, meaning my child is was in school for 9 hours and 45mins today without talking to another child or being in any lessons, arriving home at 6.30pm.

I try to work with them as I know my child’s behaviour is the cause of punishments, but honestly feel they are way over the top and their approach is making things worse. They say that those are their policies and that is that.

I’m thinking of moving schools but worry my child’s behaviour could worsen if boundriers were relaxed. But equally they could flourish if not so unhappy and stressed.

So Aibu to think the schools policies are over the top? Is it normal?

No, Michaela hasn’t got gcse results yet, but you only have to look at the kids’ books and the work they produce, and listen to them in lessons, to know that their results will be amazing. I saw English Lit work in Year 8 books that would easily pass the GCSE.

Yeah I don’t think my child’s school has the same level of education as the micheala school. How can it when it seems children spend more time in isolation than lessons 🙄

My children go to "strict" schools. That's not a school, it's a prison.

Move him. Poor thing.

Would be interested to know where these schools are stealing ideas and policies from. Things such as the extended day and disciplinary procedures sound quite similar with our school and micheala and they both opened around the same time

Sounds like that Yarmouth academy. Very scary stuff. I hate that they're going to achieve results just by pushing out any child who has the slightest behavioural or concentration issue, but your child's mental health is more important. Get out.

I'd move my child immediately - if the school is causing the behaviour the I'd move and I'd move if it's a mental health issue for your child - it's going to breed robots only

I think the Michaela approach will work very well for some pupils but not others. Most kids like firm boundaries so they know where they stand, but there are a minority for whom this won't work.

Looking at Michaela's policy (mcsbrent.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/Behaviour-201718.pdf), if a pupil looks out a window they aren't automatically given a detention. I know your child isn't at Michaela @Imustbemad00, but if they've been in internal isolation their behaviour must have been impacting quite a bit on other pupils' learning.

As for your child's mental health, I'd see the GP to discuss but I'd also discuss directly with the school over what support they can put in place. At the end of the day this school may not be the best one for your child if they cannot support them, so a managed move to another school that can support them may be needed.

If your son is not happy, and this is down to his school environment, it makes sense to give him the option to change schools.

I'd rather an average kid with good mental health and well rounded social skills over a high acheiving, depressed and anxious kid with crap ones. It doesn't sound like the school are teaching the person in this case.

Have a second look at the bad or rough area schools- their pastoral teams are often shit hot so might actually suit your kid better.

Oh OP, I'm sorry the school hasn't been what you had hoped for, and I appreciate that it's scary trying to decide whether to make the jump, but your child clearly is communicating with you through their behaviour that this school isn't right for him/her (sorry if I missed whether it or girl!). The school isn't doing your child any favours. Research shows how important it is that children learn social skills as well as formal education best from peers. Your child isn't being set up to transition into an adult world - whether a workplace or University. At work they don't get a detention or isolation, they get the sack. Uni they get kicked off the course. He would be far better in a place that instills the self discipline. Equally, it is impossible to maintain 100% concentration. Have a look into the research around fiddle toys to aid learning, I use them a lot when teaching adults. Good luck

Sticks and carrots work well. Too many sticks and not enough carrots at this school!

Are you sure they are punished for looking out the window or making eye contact in the corridor? As a teacher that would be near impossible to manage. It just sounds like an exaggeration. Surely every child would be in inclusion regularly if this was the case.

I am just thinking it sounds a bit like kids at my school who say they "only" did such and such.

"Why are you in detention today?"
"I didn't do anything, I was only looking out of the window but my teacher gave me a detention for no reason"
"That's interesting because Mrs X told me you are in detention because you didn't complete any work during the lesson because you couldn't be bothered"

If you and your child are not happy at the school then it might be a good idea to move.

My Lord, that sounds very similar to DS’ primary school. If he so much as cheer on a pencil he was made to spend his lunchtime break in the library sitting down staring at the table. His behaviour deteriorated immensely (he was 5 at the time), to the point where the school brought in the Educational Psychologist to assess him. After a half day of observing him she said that there were no primary problems with him, but the school’s “discipline”was creating a range of secondary behavioural problems.

The school didn’t listen to a word she said and we ended up raising a strongly worded complaint. Fortunately this worked and they did relax their discipline methods a bit but I truly wish we had moved him out of that school long before we did (eventually moved him for P7).

I’m assuming the method worked for some children, but for DS it was an utter disaster. I rarely post to saw switch schools but if you are going through anything like we did, I would- sooner rather than later.

Urgh, excuse my typos!

The school sounds quite sensible actually. Discipline is key to allowing children to learn. It sounds like your child is being isolated because of his failure to abide by the rules - for the benefit of the children who do abide by them. This is a good thing.

The cause of the problem is not the school or its rules - it's the child who refuses to accept the rules apply to them as much as everyone else. You need to address this with your child, not the school.

What’s the schools side of the story? Have you seen the procedures in action, say stood in a corridor while the kids are moving around or at break time?
As ppl have said above, a “I was given detention for no reason” will have another side to that

That's hideous. Fuck no.

It sounds horrendous. Imagine if your job was like that - 9 hours a day with no human interaction? Depression rates would be through the roof. Honestly I'd accept slightly lower grades in favour of the additional socialising skills kids learn at "normal" school. School it's just about the academic side, you learn how to exist and interact in society. That awful school is depriving the pupils of that essential education. What are they trying to prove?? Penalised for looking out of the window??? God help any kids who don't fit the extremely precise mold. Get him out of there STAT.

Who has told you they have sanctions for looking out the window?

I'm assuming that this is a private school? Also assuming U.K?
None of what you've written seems legal.

Move him and write off the money.

Send him to a state school.

Please take your child out of that school. No child should have to suffer mental health problems. My child is ten years old and suffering from various issues and it breaks my heart to see her like that.

mydogisshot I think it's been said it's an Academy. Unfortunately in many towns all the schools have been turned into Academies and that is the 'state' schools.

Assuming this is the whole version of events . I assuming you have had a few conversations in school.

Yes I would move him . My son had adhd so assume will be excluded here in a week

Academies are still answerable to ofsted.
All the schools round here became adamies about five years ago and improved.

Maybe I'm just lucky to have good schools (academies) around me.

Op needs to change schools for her son but also needs to address his behaviour at school. No one is blameless.

Do they actually teach the love of learning in schools these days or is it all about GCSEs and careers?

OP - please get your child out. If that environment was imposed on adults there would be an outcry. It sounds barbaric.