To be saddened by the transphobia and homophobia on Mumsnet?

[spannablue]

I used to come on here for a good laugh. But now there's just so much casual, vitriolic, uninformed rubbish om here!

Do people really think that trans women are secretly trying it on to take over women's space? Have you not seen what they have to go through (for some, horrific surgery; for others, lashings of abuse; job losses; loss of contact with family; street attacks)? Why would anyone choose that?

Did you know that if your kid comes out as trans, they are around 48% likely to attempt suicide, and around half of them succeed? All the literature/research on this shows that it's transphobia, stigma and bigotry that causes this, rather than some innate pathology. When a trans kid is supported to be who they want to be, those suicidal feelings tend to go away. If you've ever had or known a child with depression, anxiety, or who self harms, you'll know the fear and terror that they might succeed.

We're talking about a tiny minority of people who are trans. But what I'm seeing on Mumsnet amounts to collective bullying.

When did it become ok to be so judgmental? Have you ever actually met a trans person and listened to them with an open mind?

There are people of all kinds on social media - trans, not trans, gay, straight, bi, lollipop ladies, lawyers, teachers, academics and bus drivers. Some talk a load of crap. And others engage in intelligent, informed, openminded debate. Please consider trying out your ideas thoughtfully with these people before perpetuating the sort of hateful kneejerk nonsense which can have terrible consequences.

For the record, I'm an academic researcher in the field of applied sociology. I'm not trans. I'm a lesbian with four kids aged 3 to 25, one of whom is nonbinary.

Yawn.

It’s not transphobic to want single sex services and facilities.

Ok, I’ll bite.

Homophobia? Transphobia? Really? I’ve not seen this here tbh. I’ve seen many an opinion regarding these issues, but since when does an individual having an opinion on anything mean they have a problem with it?

What is nonbinary btw??

Just about everybody is non binary, including myself. Sorry but your kid is not special.

That suicide statistic is false, and using it in the way you have is grossly irresponsible.
Not bothering with the rest of your hyperbole.

ffs

YANBU.
I’m disgusted by it, to be honest.

What ever happened to just live and let live?

It isn't 'transphobia'.

It's justifiable anger at another manifestation of male aggression.

Because it is invariably men pushing an agenda that people have an issue with.

Rebecca non binary simply means not being completely masculine or feminine. So just like 99% of the world's population basically.

OP
What is a woman?

Hmmm, I'm fairly impartial. But your post is one of the most uninformed that I've read on this subject - about 90% of what you've written is untrue. I don't believe you're an academic or have ever done research.

There's nothing wrong with wanting single sex spaces and services, the need for them hasn't gone away just because you say so.

As for homophobia, there's nothing more binary and homophobic than telling gay and NGC kids they have to transition, or telling lesbians they have to sleep with a penis.

I haven’t seen any transphobia on MN. I’ve seen lots of discussion about possible problems that could arise from self id. I’ve found it very interesting and have had my eyes very much opened to things that I hadn’t previously considered.

I haven’t seen any signs of homophobia either. MN is far more tolerant than most of the things I come accross online.

I’m a gay man and have never seen anything homophobic - and I’m pretty sure that anything like that would be dealt with pretty sharpish, likewise racism, ageism and other bigotry.

I’m also in favour of women-only spaces being penis-free and men-only spaces being vagina-free. Some would say that makes me transphobic, I’d disagree with them.

MN has always had humour, robustness and frank exchanges of views on a range of issues from frivolous to thorny. It’s not a place for bigotry.

spannablue
I am a mother and I know we are only ever as happy as our least happy child.

I would welcome a third space for people who do not identify as their birth gender. I would support their every effort to get that. I would be infailingly polite to them as they go about their lives.

My focus is on women’s rights. For me and my daughter. For women, who are more likely to have poorer health outcomes, suffer from a pay and career differential to men despite outperforming them educationally for a generation or two, suffer pension poverty and that’s just in the first world. When women in Saudi Arabia have only just been permitted to drive, when gender selection drives abortion in developing countries, focus and energy needs to be in support of 50% of the population, not a tiny minority. That’s not phobia. It sadly just is.

Oh for gods sake you are being so unreasonable. I fully support anyone to be whoever they want to be BUT I have a 9 yr old dd. Do I want her to have to change in a swimming pool changing room next to a fully-bepenised man who’s decided to self identify as a woman? NO. Just NO. End of.

OP our of curiosity would you have sex with a trans woman who hasn't had any surgery?

OP you are David and Goliath posters will come your way !
It’s the internet and yeah- what can we say . MN is not
Perfect

I am not transphobic, I am against self-ID. I am thoroughly in support of spaces being made available for trans people but these should be extra spaces, not simply a case of women being told to make room.

Vulnerable women and girls are being endangered by the erosion of these spaces and it’s not bloody on.

Oh God! You've summoned all the usual suspects again. This thread has been done to death.

I think this is a really difficult issue for most reasonable people. Please forgive any incorrect terminology. I feel very much for people who feel they were born in the wrong body and I respect the right of anyone to live as they choose but we can't have men trampling over the hard won rights of women and inhabiting spaces where women's safety is put at risk.

Unfortunately, the despite the small numbers involved, the as you say Op, there are too many examples of where this"equality" has been abused.

I don't know what the answer is.

You’ve put homophobia in your title and then proceeded to talk only about trans issues. But anyway, I’m on Mumsnet quite a bit at the moment, being sans employment, and I’ve not seen a homophobic thread. I don’t think I’d like that at all. Could you link to one because I really don’t want to be part of a homophobic forum, it’d be good to know what I’m dealing with.