DF's have fallen out. Now demanding money for a hotel

[Roosevelt111]

False names used: Sorry this is going to be long...

I've been friends with a group of people for about 5 years. We all share the same interest. DF1 (I'll call him Dennis) used to normally drive if we went out for the day. Earlier this year Dennis fell seriously ill and now can no longer drive. DF2 (Aka Nick) has taken over driving if we go out anywhere. For many months Dennis and Nick had a problem with DF3 (Richard).

Richard has very few social skills and quite literally has no friends apart from us. He gets anxious and very upset if he's left out of anything we do as a group. For example Myself and Nick went to see Dennis when he was in hospital. Nick didn't invite Richard to come to the hospital with us because the hospital only let's two people in at a time. Richard also lives in the same town as the hospital whilst we both live significantly further away. Richard heard we'd been to see Dennis and he text Nick. He was furious. Saying we were nasty, horrible people for leaving him out and how we never took him anywhere and how he'd never be happy again until Nick took him out for the day. Nick has refused to speak to him since

Since then Dennis's health has improved and Nick has secretly (without Richard's knowledge) organised days out with just us three. I feel incredibly guilty for leaving Richard out and have met up with him a few times at a favourite local attraction. I've offered to help him. I've tried to encourage him to try new activities so he can make new friends and gain some confidence (he has very little) but he refuses these offers. He just whinges about Nick leaving him out and how he wants his friends back.

It's all come to a head this week. Next week a major (interest related) is taking place around 200 miles away. Nick is driving. Richard can't drive a car. Richard assumed he was invited in Nick's car. Only to find out (2 weeks ago) that Nick had already invited myself, Dennis and two more friends. So as a 5 seater - it's full.

He's managed to get a partway lift (train and then a lift) off someone else but the people he's getting a lift from will have to leave the event early to drop him at the station so he can get his train home. They're not happy about this and have suggested he gets a hotel room near the event and travel home the following day. Richard says Nick should pay for this hotel room because he should have taken him in the car rather than the other friends he invited. They've had a huge row and I feel stuck in the middle. I've tried to help Richard so many times but he won't listen. I personally don't think Nick should be paying for Richard's hotel given the way he behaved but maybe Nick wbu by not inviting him to start with? how can I help Richard when he won't listen or try to do anything I encourage or suggest?

Thanks for reading if you got this far

Well obviously Richard is in the wrong.

Leave well alone OP. No good can come from meddling. I think nobody owes anyone any money though.

Richard is being unreasonable.

Poor Richard. It’s mean to leave him out. None of you sound much of a friend to him.

Richard obviously can't expect anyone to pay for the hotel room. I do feel a bot sorry for him though as you can see why he's now feeling left out. But equally I can see why nick would want to avoid him as he is so needy.

I think you're doing the right thing to try and continue your friendship with Richard on its own terms by doing separate things. I would try not to get involved in the relationship between nick and Richard if you can - that's something they need to figure out for themselves.

I hate to say it but with friend like you...

It all sounds like things are done behind Richards back. High anxiety aside anyone would find it hard being left out. Excluded.

You need to check where your loyalties lie.

I am astonished at grown ups behaving so childishly!

There's a reason Richard has no friends, tell him to cop on and stop being ridiculous and high maintenance

If he hadn’t of kicked off about the hospital visit with limited number s allowed he would be in this situation. His only got himself to blame for getting nicks back up. Nick shouldn’t pay for anything An day gets to choice exactly who he lets travel in his car.

This is a classic example of why it is ok to leave people out of things. If someone is whiny, needy and massively entitled, there is no obligation to keep on indulging them. Even if Richard has some sort of MH problem or neurodiversity, that doesn't mean that the rest of you have to arrange your lives around him.

Wtf iohiop

Generally speaking, I think it best to keep out of it as whatever you do will upset someone or risk making things more complicated. Richard sounds like he blew the hospital visit matter out of all proportion though.

I think the problem is that Richard has upset Nick by the way he treated him in relation to the hospital visit to Dennis, and has decided to distance himself. Unfortunately, it seems Richard has not seemed to have picked up on this. Is Richard aware that Nick was so upset/angry following that incident? Richard was BU to send a text like that given the circumstances (visiting a friend in hospital in those specific circumstances does not require that all members of a friendship group attend at the same time- not possible or appropriate). Perhaps Nick could have raised it with him at the time?

Nick is perfectly entitled to only give lifts to people he wants to and Richard was wrong to assume a lift has been offered without checking, given he hadn't heard from Nick for a long time (unless no contact for long periods is normal in your friendship group). However, perhaps Nick could have let him know- I don't know how practical this would have been if Nick hasn't spoken to Richard for some time though. He may even have thought Richard would have guessed he wasn't offering him a lift.

Not sure why there have been any comments about the OP's loyalty?! Sounds like OP has tried to remain friends with both Nick and Richard.

Obviously it is Richard who is being unreasonable but it sounds like he must have some mental health problems that perhaps Nick could be more sensitive to?

That said, you might be better off staying out of it OP.

Nick won't be paying and nor should he. But I do feel sorry for Richard. I can see how he just doesn't 'get' it and he's hurt and hurting.

Be as good (blunt) a friend to Richard as you can be, but keep out of it as far as you can.

It doesn't help that Richard and Dennis were friends before Nick came on the scene. They got on fine and then the dynamics changed once Nick arrived.

For those of you who say I'm a bad friend to Richard, I do try. I talk to him (almost everyday) I meet up with him occasionally (he lives about 40 miles away so he isn't around the corner) I don't have a car so can't drive him to this big event. I've told him (multiple times) that I won't get involved with him and Nick but he stills says everyday how sad he is and how mean Nick is. He said before how he wanted to learn a particular skill. I found out that a local centre was offering lessons and told him I would go with him for the first session. He then turned around and said he wouldnt go until Nick agreed to take him out for the day and it was bad for his health I'm ready to give up. I've tried suggesting other activities and he refuses all suggestions

People go out of their way for people they get something back from 0 in terms of friendship. Poor Richard, he is hard work. But he acted up over being left out of a hospital visit?? Gawd' sake, he wasn't the one sick.
He has to a great extent made his own bed. I think this may be the one chance to see if anything can be done to help him understand the effect of his own actions...it will be awkward but I would try and have a conversation about his lack of understanding of social interaction and how it affects others. If he is willing to try and change by all means assist him. If he blames it all on others then I would suggest he is a hopeless cause and best gently left to his own devices. I most certainly would not contribute to his hotel costs in this particular case, why on earth should you. Entirely up to the driver who he invites into his car.

Wow, lohiop, are you a magic clinical psychologist? One who can diagnose autism on the basis of a few paragraphs of an interested party's description over the internet? It took you twenty minutes from the OP to clinical diagnosis - fuck knows why the NHS waiting lists are so long!

And FYI, my son is autistic but judging from the hordes of children calling for him to come out and play every day, there are plenty who want him around, so don't be so quick to dismiss all autistic people, hmmm?

Feeling a bit sorry for everyone here, although Nick seems a bit of a childish arse. However, Nick doesn't owe anyone any money. Be clear to Richard about that. Tell him that he has to calm it down, or things will only get worse.

Then send everyone a group text, saying "If you lot don't all stop acting like 8 year olds, I'm out".

Toxic and draining? Just shut up, iohiop.

I've told him (multiple times) that I won't get involved with him and Nick but he stills says everyday how sad he is and how mean Nick is. He said before how he wanted to learn a particular skill. I found out that a local centre was offering lessons and told him I would go with him for the first session. He then turned around and said he wouldnt go until Nick agreed to take him out for the day and it was bad for his health

Given this, I think Richard is trying to be very manipulative (I don't know if that is consciously or not)- why does he want someone he thinks is mean to take him out for the day? And to refuse to do an activity that they would probably like until that person takes him out for the day? That is very odd behaviour and I can't think of a reasonable explanation for it TBH.

In Nick's position, I would be steering well clear too. In your position, OP, I would stick with the line of "I'm not getting involved in this issue between you and Nick- I don't want to hear any more about it" and continue to see Richard as you want to.