Friend slapped daughter hard

[Daffodildainty]

Some friends were visiting from another country. Last night there was a mix up about the arrangements and I went out of the restaurant to meet my friend and her daughter - a 19 year old uni student . They were arguing on the pavement and as we entered the venue With me walking ahead of them I glimpsed my friend slap her daughter really hard across the face - I continued inside and eventually my friend arrived without her daughter who had returned to the hotel. She mentioned the slap but said her daughter had called her a name and pinched her hard to which she retaliated. I said it was not a good situation but took the cowards way out and didn’t tell her how shocking it was. We continued the evening. I feel badly for not intervening WWUD?

Okay I'm going to be controversial here.

If physical assault is okay to do on your child as punishment by some nasty people then:

• sexually assaulting your teen is ok if they are being provocative;

• your child exhibits bullying behaviour so you mind fuck them into oblivion.

Now you'll be saying of course not - that's disgusting - and you'd be right.

A child can not defend itself from violence. So you are abusing a child by default when you hit them as unless they are a burly 15 year old, are unlikely to be able to hold their own.

Of course sexual assault is not appropriate as punishment. Why? Many reasons but mostly because it's invasion of body. Now what is hitting someone? Look at highlighted sentence above.

Why is mind fucking a child not acceptable? because it teaches the child it's OK to harm someone as long as it doesn't leave visible scars - what do most people say is OK as long as you don't leave visible marks?

Exactly.

Notanother- really weird analogy but also the “child” we’re referring to is a 19 year old adult

If physical assault is okay to do on your child as punishment by some nasty people then sexually assaulting your teen is ok if they are being provocative

What about protection rather than punishment? If you had a child that was reaching for a fire and you slapped its hand to teach it that it's a bad idea or even if you pulled the child away, you are assaulting it and "invading its body".

Pulling the child away from a fire would obviously be ok!!

I wouldn't be shocked that an adult mother and daughter can be so angry with each other that they lash out physically, pretty much everyone has their breaking point.
What is shocking is that your friend didn't seem to be shocked at herself, upset or ashamed. But then I guess in some cultures parents still feel a right/ duty to chastise their adult children for disrespect.
I suppose as a friend, 'are you alright? is dd alright? did you know what you just did is a criminal offence in the uk? do you row like that often?' would be places to start the conversation??

Not a child. A 19 year old.

Still a daft analogy. It’s well known (and normal, and natural, however undesirable) to lash out when angry or upset. Most people can lose control and be pushed to this limit.

No one gets so angry and upset they lash out and sexually assault someone.

@glintandglide I was referring to growing up with corporal punishment.

In this scenario I expect the Mum has done this before. Because in general a Mum would be upset at hitting her DD, even if provoked. OP says she was Blasé about it - so it clearly didn't upset her.

I think the daughter was indeed very wrong but the mother was just as wrong - more so because she raised that person. I can understand retaliation - pinching hurts! But many scream out/swear not hit.

I got pinched once by a child with severe SN and bit by another with severe SN at 14. It was amazingly difficult but I didn't lash out.

I'm not saying I'm perfect and I know we don't always act the way we hoped we would. But if I were to hit in anger I would rightly be upset I lost control and that I'd hurt my child.

@busybarbara Yes but that is ultimately going to be an act seconds later the child will be glad you took re: fire. Whereas if you hit a child they won't turn round 5 minutes later and say 'Thank you Mummy - so glad you did that for me.'

Sorry wizard i wasn't referring to a child. I get what you're saying.

IF VIOLENCE IS NORMAL AND ACCEPTABLE IN YOUR LIFE YOU NEED TO SERIOUSLY RE-ASSESS YOUR LIFE

^^ THIS.

19 years or 19 months you don't slap someone.

I would be reevaluating the friendship.

IF VIOLENCE IS NORMAL AND ACCEPTABLE IN YOUR LIFE YOU NEED TO SERIOUSLY RE-ASSESS YOUR LIFE

THIS.

It's not normal or acceptable in my life. I've been in an abusive relationship. Sometimes I retaliated and hit back out of sheer anger, pain and humiliation.

If someone hit or pinched me tomorrow I can't guarantee I wouldn't hit back. Some people are more hot tempered than others which is why I don't go around initiating violence - you don't always know who you're dealing with.

I am absolutely gobsmacked at anyone thinking it's ok to slap another person, unless in self defence ,across the face. It really isn't ok to slap your child - 19 years old is legally an adult. How humiliating and crushing for the dd.

Those of you saying it's none of the OP's business, we should turn a blind eye against physical abuse when we witness it should we?

What would you do xsquared? What would you do in this instance to really make a difference?

I have friends I am best friends with and share everything with and friends I meet once or twice a year for dinner and friends who range in between

In no case could I see my friend hit her daughter across the face and sit down and have dinner with her as if nothing happened. This would be a shocking thing to witness. I am absolutely astounded at the number of posters who think it is acceptable, normal and none of the witness's business. Truly weird.

And as to what you think might happen if the OP protested - well maybe the friend might be told that hitting her daughter is not acceptable. Rather than the message she gets if you say nothing which is that it IS acceptable

In these circumstances I would say to my friend "what on earth happened - I just saw you hit X across the face". "but she pinched me" wouldn't be an acceptable answer

This thread has been one of those threads on MN which are so far removed from my experience of life - and anyone I know ditto - that it makes me wonder am I in a parallel universe. I don't know anyone who would witness a woman slapping her child - of any age - across the face who would not be shocked and call the woman out on it. not one.

Slapping anyone across the face is poor.
If I witnessed a friend doing that I think I’d have a conversation about it but ultimately I’m not sure they’d still be my friend

My mother slapped me across the face several times before the age of 10 and also considered spanking (hard enough to bruise) with a wooden spoon to be an appropriate punishment for 'talking back'.

My dad left shortly afterwards and at 11, so did I. My mother and I are N.C. now, in case anyone else thinks that it has no lasting effect.

I bring up my own children without laying a finger on them, no matter how angry they've sometimes made me and two more kind, respectful kids you'd be hard pressed to meet. The cycle doesn't have to continue into the next generation. OP, teaching out to the daughter would be a very kind gesture as I would guarantee this is part of a long-term pattern.

I guess I would express disapproval of what just happened, and suggest that she was rather heavy handed with her daughter. I would be shocked to see this happen with anybody I know, especially in public as in the op’s situation.

I grew up with corporal punishment, from my mum, either being slapped or caned. Once she slapped me so hard that my nose bled. It was usually over things like back chatting but I never swore or physically did anything to my parents. Unfortunately, it’s the culture they grew up in where it was okay for parents to physically discipline their children. This only went on until I was 9, not 19.

I am absolutely gobsmacked at anyone thinking it's ok to slap another person, unless in self defence ,across the face. It really isn't ok to slap your child - 19 years old is legally an adult. How humiliating and crushing for the dd.

The daughter pinched the mother and called her a name. DO you think the mother was humilated?

I've been "pinched" by an adult, it's nasty and if on the arm will bruise. It'sn ot really a punch by an adult at that point, children "pinch".

Still a daft analogy. It’s well known (and normal, and natural, however undesirable) to lash out when angry or upset. Most people can lose control and be pushed to this limit.

It was a daft analogy. Sometimes people simply need to use violence to escape a situation. It's not normal to want to rape someone because they "dress provacatively* I mean, really, wtf?

But that isn’t likely to be effective or achieve anothing xsquared. You and some other posters seem to have taken the view that those not “challenging” her are condoning her actions or turning a blind eye but what we’re really saying is what’s the point? There isn’t really any effective action to take at this point.