to say, about Kate Spade's apparent suicide?

[Standandwait]

... that there are two things I take away from this:

1. there are a lot of people out there who you think are just fine and should be so happy but just aren't... not only Kate Spade, what about Robin Williams? Be aware others may be fragile and try not to hurt them.

2. if you think you're worthless and a failure remember there are probably other people out there who admire you and wish they were like you. Don't kill yourself get help.

The media are reporting Kate spade was indeed very ill. Depression, possibly worse. If this is the case then I believe her act was a symptom or an outcome of her illness, and not one she would have taken had she been well. It is selfish by definition, but she was not being selfish when she did it, as she was too unwell and mentally lacked the capacity to rationalise her acts due to her illness.

I suspect this would be the case for the vast majority of people who sadly commit suicide.

A friend committed suicide a few years ago. I am firmly of the belief that someone who kills themself cannot see any other way out of their situation. They may also think that what they are doing is best for those around them, not just them. It is easy to judge and say how awful it is and how could the person have done that to their family, but it's far more complex than that.

Being told "don't be angry, it's ugly. You must forgive"

Oh ugly, oh we can't possibly have that ugh.

Incredibly sad. My heart goes out to all of you who have had to deal with something like this, whether you have been suicidal or have been devastated by someone else's suicide. Is difficult to imagine anything worse.

I personally think all feelings around this are valid. Who am I to judge someone who is in such a desperate place that death seems the only option? Likewise, who I am to determine whether the feelings of the loved ones left behind are appropriate.

Love to you all.

Over the years I've lost 3 family members and 2 friends to suicide. They were all severely depressed. To me depression is cancer of the mind. If left untreated it can be fatal.

This is really sad, and thoughts are with her daughter and all those on here who’ve lost friends and family.

I agree with the ‘lacking capacity’ idea for many people who commit suicide, rather than the person choosing to fuck up their kids lives. I’ve got kids and I have had suicidal episodes where I’ve made serious attempts. At the time it seems like the best, in fact only option, and everyone’s lives would be better without me. When I’m better I end up being absolutely disgusted that I could even have considered doing that to my kids, ashamed of how I behaved and get petrified it will happen again. It’s like there are 2 different people. Maybe many of those that succeeded would have felt the same as I do, if they’d survived.

I am very depressed and have recently been suicidal, I genuinely think my dd would be better off without me. Reading all the comments here from
those whose relatives have killed themselves has made me think differently. I’m glad mn have let this thread continue.

4dogs can you get in touch with the samaritans? They have an online option which disguises who they are and are good to have during moments of suicidal ideation.

Or you can just present yourself at a hospital if the feelings are overwhelming and you feel you will act on them. I did that once as having had a parental suicide I really couldn't put my family through it again. I am now fully recovered but please know your options for emergencies.

www.samaritans.org/how-we-can-help-you/contact-us

thanks cheery, i am under the care of the community mental health team so am ok and not currently feeling suicidal.

I find it so sad that so many people still don't understand mental illness. Comments like, she had so much going for her, no money issues, etc etc just confirm the person saying it has no clue about depression etc.

Suicide can be a rational decision. If you hate your life, you change it. One option is to end it. I tried to kill myself a few years ago. I didn't have depression and I didn't seek help - nobody could bring my partner back to life, nobody was going to give my job back and nobody could stop the bullying (which was actually ramped up after the suicide attempt). I couldn't bear how I felt and one night, a few hours after I'd been out with my closest friends, I just went for it. I didn't tell anyone, I just got on with it. It was a snap decision. A bizarre fluke means that I am still alive today. I've still got my suicide note, I don't remember writing it but my throat closes up if I look at it.

Surviving was a chance to see how upset and sometimes angry my family and friends would have been had I died. It was also a chance to start again. I'm now happy as a clam and wouldn't dream of doing it again as I'm having too much fun. And my mother told me she didn't like the suicide note as it was "too short".

Aaarrrggghh - I am so sorry you feel that way. Please go to the GP and tell them that. It's for them to help you with the next step.

Year, 3 out of 4 people do have no clue what depression is like and thank goodness for them, because anyone who has knows how awful it is. It is only natural that people look at the life of a millionaire who is also a mother and have these questions. I do not judge people for not understanding. Many do not know what it is like to live with cancer or a child with drug addiction. People are bound to wonder.
Blueyacht- glad some serendipitous interruption happened for you- and thanks for sharing your reasons. All suicides are not the same-but the cliche it is a permanent solution to a temporary problem, is true to anyone outside of the situation. For someone who feels like they are in hell every waking minute, that way of existing is an incredibly crushing problem that cannot be solved. Poor Kate, that she could not access help that may well have stopped this event happening now, but who knows how long for. I just hope her daughter gets the help that she is most likely going to need for years to come.

This thread has been had for me to read although I wanted to contribute. My mum took her own life 5 weeks ago using the same method as Kate. She was found and revived and taken to hospital and we made the decision to let her go 10 hours later. I wish she had died at the scene as it was beyond horrific. One of the hardest things for me is that when someone commits suicide people seem to feel they have a right to know about it. Within hours of my Mum passing away I had acquaintances contacting me to ask how my mum died, was she depressed? It's fucking ghoulish I've been very angry with her, with everyone I come into contact with but I do know that the person who killed herself wasn't my mum. She was the last person you could possibly imagine, the last person you would ever expect to even be depressed. We lost my mum in January when she became ill and turned into a different person

Twatty I am So so sorry for your loss
May she rest in Peace

Stories like this must be so painful

So sorry - it’s so early and so raw

twatty I'm so sorry you had to go through that, and sorry that you lost your mum.

Sorry twatty

Twatty so sorry this is a dreadful time for you. Ignore people who ask, find support and help if you need it. xxx

This thread has made for such hard reading. My sister's husband's father ended his life, when he was in his 20s. He had been in combat in the Vietnam Conflict and injured to paralysis. I guess he must have felt he was better off dead to them, for the veteran's benefits they would receive upon his death and he could not do the manual jobs which where the only things he had done to provide for his family so he shot himself. My BIL and his sister have never borne him any ill-will in that respect.

My daughter died nearly 6 years ago, when she was 9. I won't lie, I wanted to join her. Sometimes, I still do. I hang on, for her sister and brother.

In the journey that is child bereavement I have met many who have been bereaved by suicide.

And in the nature of my knowing them I cannot get it in me to be angry at those who have taken this path. I just can't, and some of them, it was really horrible how they came by that, really horrible. I can't say 'committed suicide' for those parents, because it implies criminality and their children did not commit a crime by ending their lives, even the one who ended his life after perpetrating an act of criminality due to undiagnosed schizophrenia.

Yes, they left so much, the gamut of emotions, but bar annihilators it is usually an act of extreme desperation and extreme illness.

I am so sorry for those who are left with so much anger. Their words have given me reason to live further.

Is it a choice? I'm not entirely sure. I have been there myself.

Death is the ultimate peace. I have seen it myself. I live with it every day.

However we meet it, or come to it, it comes.

I have known one person who left a letter, saying they believed their relatives would be better off without them, and another who did not go through with a suicide and told me they had believed the same thing.

expat and twatty

Death is the ultimate peace.

My son is currently a mishmash of emotion, medication, despair and sadness.

Sometimes I wonder if the kindest thing I could have done would have been to let him go. Of course, that’s nonsense (stood by and watched as your child tried to hang himself, hardly) and yet, there is that little voice that wonders.

I would not keep a pet alive as my son currently is.

And there is nothing I can do to help.

I know immortal

Not even comparable but a friend of mine declared himself suicidal . I called , rallied friends and he is in strong medication now

But I know that his main issues wouldn’t change and there was a little voice that said ‘ well if he dies at least he won’t be suffering ‘

I think having seen depression it really is hell . We don’t accuse terminally ill people of selfishness when they head off To dignitas

Immortal I hope he can recover . It does and can happen - but it’s a hard path

Well, yes, it can, but sometimes it can’t.

We accept without question the fact that some illnesses and diseases are incurable but we don’t for mental health.

My son has autism. Autism can’t be cured. If it could - god, what wouldn’t I give, if it could

I find it , for me, useful that my father didn't leave a note, I would have tortured myself mulling over it. It is simply hell to bear but sometimes we have to bear the unbearable, certainly reading as much as one can about suicide, finding specific counsellors, helps, eventually, anyone recently bereaved by suicide, this is a crucial stage and you will find your own way through. As a teacher I see more and more cases of pre teens dying from suicide. The biggest risk is not family members but proxemity, in that if one teen dies from it there is usually more. Anyone working with young people knows this. I am hopeful that with consistent awareness and educational that people who feel have suicidal indentation don't feel ashamed and seek help. This of course relies on all from not being frightened by it when told by someone who feels like this. I firmly believe that my father would have lived if the current thoughts, openness and help was available he would have lived. But there is a dreadful crux, if someone is really determined they will do it. I think there are a lot of cases where people want out of the utter misery but don't know how to do it without suicide. Spike Milligan used to present himself to hospital and beg to be put to sleep until the depressing/ideation was over. A rational solution.