to wonder how I was supposed to use this toilet?

[sleepingdragons]

DD and I got drenched in the rain today, proper torrential rain! DD's skirt was soaked through.

We were on our way to meet family for lunch, so we headed there and I took DD to the toilet.

DD was freezing. My plan had been to strip her bottom half to her pants in the ladies and hold her skirt under the hand dryer for as long as I could.

But when I got to the toilet I found it was unisex. There were a bunch of cubicles coming off a busy communal sink area, with a couple of middle aged men in there when I got there, and more men coming and going while we were there.

What would you do in this situation? What do you think I should have done?

Also - AIBU to think that restaurants and cafes are going to use the new trend for unisex facilities as a cost cutting measure, so we're going to see loads more of this kind of thing?

Rufustheyawningreindeer It was a slight novelty to do all of that in the toilets at this event the other month, simply because I’d never been in that situation before, to the extent that I noticed it was a new situation. But it showed me very quickly that there’s nothing more to it beyond a moment of ‘oh! That’s new!’ which you could see in the faces of the blokes too 😂 yet everyone managed to do their business, whatever they may be, and leave anyway.

I just can’t get het up about having a wee/changing a tampon in a cubicle next to another person doing whatever they’re doing.

walking

Oh god im not sure i could manage to stand next to a bloke checking his nose hair

(I do not check my nose hair in front of anyone!!!)

I can’t say I have nose hair to check so it’s all good for me 😂

Oh god im not sure i could manage to stand next to a bloke checking his nose hair *

I think I'd just be trying not to smirk as I walked past lol

I do find it sad that an argument against unisex toilets are men are dangerous and we should protect our kids from them.
So does that mean kids shouldn't ever be alone with their dads or male family members or brothers?

I do find it sad that an argument against unisex toilets are men are dangerous and we should protect our kids from them.
So does that mean kids shouldn't ever be alone with their dads or male family members or brothers?

This isn't supposed to be a thread about the dangers of Self ID, I deliberately didn't go down that route as I wasn't interested in debating Self ID here - I was interested in the situation DD and I found ourselves in.

But I just have to say - this logic is screwy.

Men are a danger to women and children. I really wish it wasn't so, but it is. Of course NAMALT and we tend to trust men we know. I found my ex grooming my friend's little sister though, so sometimes we get it wrong, and it's closer to home that we think.

How you deal with that risk is up to you, but to pretend it doesn't exist is naivety.

It's sad that violence and sexual abuse exists. It's not sad that we notice and comment on the fact that the perpetrators are mostly men.

What I find upsetting about most of the responses on here is the "I'm cool with it so pipe down you ridiculous hysterical person you should be cool with it too" attitude. Surely we should be trying to respect the privacy of everyone... it's almost like saying there aren't that many disabled people so let's not bother providing facilities and women fought for single sex facilities for years! In the developing world it's a lack of these facilities that stops girls attending school etc. It's just ignorant and privileged to ignore the fact that MVAW exists and females are uncomfortable for a fucking reason. Urgh.

I suspect a lot of the women complaining would feel comfortable doing make up - or at least retouching - in a public toilet. So what's the difference with a public space? One difference is, the public space has men in it too.

Nope, it has zero to do with men's presence.

The reason I feel comfortable putting make up on in a public loo and not in general public spaces is because the loo is more likely to have mirrors to help with application, there's usually counter space to use during the process and I can check my appearance before being seen by the "general public" to make sure I've not got lipstick on my teeth or eyeliner smudged across my face for the foreseeable future (I don't mind the odd person seeing the "work in progress" in the course of them also being in the public facilities at the same time).

Also, if I am in a public space I am usually there for a reason - out for lunch with friends/doing an activity with DD/working etc - so to actively take out my make up and start doing it there and then is the height of ignorance to anyone I am with at the time and is actively impacting on other people. It's one thing to pull out a tube of lipstick for a quick touch up, or to check your hair in a mirrored surface whilst in a public space but anything more intensive and ideally it will be done where it is going to inconvenience and be witnessed by the fewest people, and that is usually in the loo rather than a more general space.

Doesn't make it okay though does it Zzz

But unisex does provide facilities for women to go to the toilet.
It also provides it for men and children and all other identities.

You go to toilet in privacy the only real shared section is the handwashing area

But they have privacy in the cublicle. If they chose to take clothes off in a public area they don’t have privacy. The sink area isn’t really designed for things which require “privacy” it’s designed to wash your hands!

It it was open plan toilets with no doors then I could get the privacy argument!

Actually given how many mothers won’t let their older sons go into the gents toilets then I can very much see a place for more unisex toilet areas to stop that beinb an issue

Handwashing area that is usually closed off from any public place. In clubs, train stations, restaurants, universities, whatever. I don't want to be alone there with men. I don't feel that a cubicle provides enough privacy within that environment. Why is that so weird. Many women feel the same way. You're basically telling them all to just shut up and deal with it.

"Actually given how many mothers won’t let their older sons go into the gents toilets then I can very much see a place for more unisex"

Umm right .. this is so illogical. You're relying on the presence of women to make the space safer, rather than the absence of men

You're relying on the presence of women to make the space safer, rather than the absence of men

Or maybe they are relying on being able to go in with their sons...?

walking

If you haven't checked your nose hair how do you know you have no nose hair to check

Soup fair point

I'm hiding this thread now as finding it too depressing. Feminism really is going backwards. Yay gender neutral everything. Ffs.

Actually given how many mothers won’t let their older sons go into the gents toilets then I can very much see a place for more unisex toilet areas to stop that being an issue

That doesn't stop it being an issue at all.

The point is about not letting your DC go into a public toilet with strange men unaccompanied. If it's unisex then it doesn't open up an option, the DS still has to go with the mother. It closes down an option for his sister who previously was allowed to go into the ladies unattended though.

The sink area isn’t really designed for things which require “privacy” it’s designed to wash your hands!

Have you all forgotten what the word toilet means?!!

The ladies wasn't just designed for just going to the toilet. It was designed for "doing your toilet".

It was always a place you could take a moment to wash and refresh yourself (do make up or whatever).

WHY DO THEY ALL HAVE MIRRORS if it's just for peeing, eh?

Since when is touching up your make up private?

I actually think it's completely legitimate to say it's hysterical if you're worried about your five year old wearing pants while with you near men you don't know.

You wouldn't stop a five year old from going swimming because there might be men in the pool! And you would rightfully be considered hysterical and a poor parent if you did.

It's is unpleasant to sexualise children in this way. No harm could possibly come to a child wearing pants in the presence of her mother, even if others were around. To treat this as some kind of terrible vulnerability, as though the mere existence of a child in pants has something to do with sexuality, is one of the creepiest things I've ever heard.

Regarding doing makeup in front of men - it's a personal preference for women as to whether they personally want to, but it's misogynistic to suggest that putting on makeup should be something private and hidden. It feeds into that idea that women should always appear effortlessly flawless for the benefit of men. I won't personally judge any woman who chooses to only do her makeup privately or in front of women, but I do think it's enormously helpful to normalise the idea that makeup doesn't happen magically behind closed doors, and that it's not a secret private routine to maintain mystery and glamour for men. To that end, I'll happily continue to do my makeup in whatever public space is convenient to me, regardless of whether men can see.

I also find OP's points about the original meaning of 'toilette' a bit disingenuous. Yes it originally encompassed washing / prinking etc and yes those are still activities many will do in their own bathrooms at home, but clearly public loos are not intended for the purpose of having a full wash, hairstyle and blow dry. There is a world of difference between using a public loo to touch up your lipstick and fix a stray hair and expecting there to routinely be private facilities for a full toilette routine...

Why couldn’t a family member dive you to the family members house or alternatively get a taxi, I’m failig to see what the big deal is, A, as I was their with family, I would have wrapped DC in a suitable jacket, and left her with the family while I dried her clothes.

Your making a mountain out of a mohill.

"If it's unisex then it doesn't open up an option, the DS still has to go with the mother."

It means that a male who needs some level of supervision when using the toilet can now have that without someone complaining about him being in the ladies.