To be embarrassed by BIL and SILs kids in restaurant

[LittleMermaidRose]

We were out for a family dinner last night, in laws brought their two kids age 5 and 2.

Oh my goodness it was dreadful! Youngest kid was hammering her toys off the table, lots of screaming. Oldest running around the restaurant, shouting, demanding to watch Peppa Pig, which she was eventually allowed to watch (very loudly) on her mother's phone.

That's the only time they acknowledged their kids. MIL tried her best to swap 2yo's toys for a soft book, parents just drank their wine.

FIL left early! I think he had had enough.

I know kids make noise & they were probably a bit bored, but it's the fact that the parents thought it was ok to disrupt the whole restaurant.

People were staring at us, it was so embarrassing.
I didn't feel it was my place to say something to them and I have anxiety so I found the whole situation really difficult.

My stress levels do heighten due to my anxiety, so perhaps I'm overreacting.

AIBU???

It isn't right to let your children run riot in a public place - especially not an adult place like a restaurant.

Taking them there requires good preparation (both with the children on behaviour that is allowed and in taking quiet things to keep them occupied.)

It can also require the parents to give up and leave!

It isn't an easy place to take very small children - but is isn't a bad thing to do and really is part of their education. Enough time and effort with them on this when they are small can mean much easier times in such places when they are older.

Not making excuses as clearly their parents should have addressed their behaviour. However I wonder who arranged the meal and when, I have found that family in particular are dreadful at arranging meals at 'adult dining' times that my daughter cannot manage but is expected to attend.

We always ensure we bring stuff to keep her occupied but it really doesn't help when people insist on eating at 8pm with zero understanding that young children are often in bed by that time.

Kids have no place in restaurants or pubs, IMO. Maybe an unpopular view, but I don't really care. I'm with you, OP. Your in-laws showed no thought or care for anyone else in the place, staff or visitors.

Why did no one in your family, parents or otherwise, just tell eldest to sit down and be quiet?

Exactly PyongyangKipperbang, there's always at least one poster on these threads just dying to have a pop at British people.

Thinking the parents of a kid running around in a restaurant and another who is banging a toy loudly, should perhaps put their wine down and intervene, really isn't a British concept.

It's called having a bit of thought for others and seems pretty popular the world over.

It is the parenting (or absence of) rather than the "childrening" that is the problem. Children will do what they are permitted to do.

Mine aren't perfect. Around 18m we gave up on eating in nicer places for a while as they just couldn't cope with sitting around for so long for a while. If they did need a wander, they were closely escorted to minimise the trip hazard. There's been times when a DC has been escorted to the car for a 5 minute chill out, or plans for deserts abandoned and the bill asked for ASAP. Most meals are fine because the DCs know what the boundaries are and that there are consequences for exceeding them.

Generally if other people can see that parents are making a reasonable effort, but it may be that you have a bad combination of over-tired child past their best before, and you're stuck on something like the bill being slow. Being more interested in your wine than the children from the start does raise people's hackles. I still remember frequently biting my tounge and supressing teacher mode at the end of a long week in a demanding school teaching because my "relaxing" meal out was acompanied by families with no boundaries running amok.

Intervening with other peoples' children is a minefield. I do with certain close friends and family because we have similar expectations and boundaries, and they will with mine... but it's rare because we're normally managing our own DCs to a reasonable degree. Generally parents that abdicate from active parenting don't tend to appreciate other peoples' interventions. For some reason it makes them feel criticised

My biggest problem these days is that I've forgotten how to linger pleasantly over a meal

What time was the meal? If later than 6pm it is a recipe for disaster taking young children to a restaurant when they should be in bed so no wonder they were playing up.

My in-laws booked a family dinner at 8pm once and insisted we bought DC (to parade in front of family) who were then 3 and 1. It was horrendous. 1 year old slept but 3 year old cried and didn't want to sit still. I ended up walking around outside trying to pacify 3 year old and pushing 1 year old in buggy and didn't get to eat my meal.

So if the meal was late and in-laws were ordered to be there I have sympathy with them but if it was late afternoon they really should have taken more responsibility for their children.

DD is 3. We will only go to restaurants with an outside space, even if it's just a beer garden. We will order food, then one of us will take her outside to run off some steam before dinner. Obviously not letting her irritate anyone sitting in the garden. Then she will usually happily sit and eat quietly without any drama.

If we have to keep her entertained in the confines of a table in a restaurant she does become a little restless but is usually entertained with some crayons/my phone on a very low volume until we can eat. We don't usually spend a long time in a restaurant for this reason.

The parents should have taken control of the situation.

*brought DC not bought!

My sister used to do this when her kids were little - sit and knock back the wine and expect other family members (usually me) to keep her children entertained so they didn't run riot. It pissed me off back then and it pisses me off when I see other people doing it now.

I'm far from a perfect mum but one thing I do and have always done with my own DC is, if we're in a restaurant that ISN'T just a burger bar at 12pm on a Saturday (and actually even if it IS), keep them bloody entertained myself so they don't bother other people.

It's paying dividends now that they are a little bit older because they now enjoy going out to eat because we enjoy going with them. They may not sit discussing Descartes over a crisp Chardonnay but they know a) how to behave and b) that we are there with them to enjoy their company and vice versa. So they don't muck about trying to get attention because they know they have it if/when they want it. It was a pain in the arse hovering over them in restuarants for years with books and colouring and yes iPads and whisking stray bits of lettuce off their plates before they got hysterical. I didn't actively enjoy going out to eat with them for years, but I had a vague hope that one day it might mean they could be socially acceptable enough in a restaurant that I could relax and enjoy it with them.

I have never understood people who make no attempt to curb inappropriate kids' beahviour in restaurants. Totally different with small kids if you're trying and it's not working, but then I'd just not do it because it's really not fair on everybody else (including staff, my god I've seen some harrassed staff sometimes while kids run riot).

Children don't need to be seen and not heard, far from it, but basic good manners and not disrupting other people's meals is the the only acceptable way imo.

The meal was booked for 6:30pm (by BIL, in celebration for a family thing) and we got our food by 7pm. I have no idea what the kids' normal routine is, but older child never touched her food, so maybe she had already eaten?

That would be too late for us - toddler DS is tucked up in bed by 7, he would scream the place down if we kept him out at a restaurant at that time.

You would have thought that if your BIL booked it he would have thought of that, but you live and learn. They may be entirely different children at a midday lunch.

@waterrat - expecting the parents to take care of their own children isn't anti-child, it's normal.
I have zero understanding for parents bringing their ill-behaved children to restaurants and then failing to discipline them. That's clearly unacceptable. Loud music or noises from the apps on the ipads or phones, children running around and banging their noise - unless it's McDonald's or a restaurant beside a playcentre which caters specifically for small children, this behaviour has nothing to do there.
Some parents are clearly deluded. I was celebrating my birthday in one of Gordon Ramsay's restaurants once. Nice surroundings, everything very posh and clean, great food. We left DD at home because she was too young to appreciate the food then (she was 3 at the time). There was a couple there with a boy who was 2. They were celebrating his birthday. Brought extra food for him in a Tupperware dish, just some pasta with a tomato sauce. While they ate the food from the menu. he was munching on his pasta from the plastic container. Then he started playing around with the plastic dish and running around because he clearly had no patience to sit around and wait for them.
I wish I were making the stuff up. Sadly, no. He only came in contact with the food from the menu when he blew the candle on the cake they for him but he didn't even like it and left the whole cake on the plate.
Me and DH didn't feel great about it. We booked the seat in the restaurant to celebrate something really special in my life, my round birthday and got a babysitter because we wanted to enjoy some adult time. The child didn't belong there and was clearly bored, just like the children from the OP's post. I don't understand why people bring children to restaurants if they don't instil any manners in them.

My biggest problem these days is that I've forgotten how to linger pleasantly over a meal

:o

DH and I went out for dinner on our own when we hadnt been out without the kids for a while. Ordered, drank our wine, all lovely. Meal came and 15 minutes later we were done and thinking "What now?!" :o

@LittleMermaidRose unless you're in Spain or Italy, 7PM is too late for children that age. Not surprised they misbehaved, they must have been tired and bored.

Tbh with a 2yo id decline dinner invites unless it is somewhere with a play area. 2yos do not like to sit still and be quiet and its not enjoyable for dh and I to try and force that. Its not for long, ds has been great at sitting for dinner since just over 3 so a year of "kid friendly" or "no thanks" is nothing.

Wait, so they, the lazy parents, arranged this?!

Why didnt they just arrange a sitter and have the adult centred meal they clearly wanted?

then it is totally their fault for not finding somewhere more suitable and handling the children

But yes its the adults who are judged the kids behaved normally just were not handled properly

Leaving aside the restaurant issue, I get from your other posts that you don't have a great relationship with your MIL or the BIL/SIL so was this perhaps a recipe for disaster from the beginning (pardon the terrible pun!).

You say you engage as an aunt at other times so don't see why you should have helped out at the meal, but seem to have a strained relationship over sibling rivalry between your BIL and your DH. Is it possible these family get togethers are always going to be a source of anxiety or stress for you regardless?

The dynamics seem to be a bit strained tbh.

YANBU. If they can't behave in restaurants - you just don't take them until they can. To inflict them on others who's own enjoyment is then disrupted is just plain rude.

I didnt mean that to sound harsh it's just it sounds like it's hard work for you because of your anxiety and the family history. Add screaming young children to the mix and I can see it would be stressful!

tbh whichever way you slice it, it looks like these are the sort of people who think it's okay for children to behave that way while out.

there's plenty of parents who don't think this.

It is a big problem though. The other day we were out and there was a guy with his tablet on at a fair volume, just watching TV. There were so many children making such a racket it would have made no sense to tell him to put headphones in if you see what I mean. We were only out because my sister was coming through the other side of town for work and just had time for a quick bite to eat before getting a train back - it wasn't a posh place but still I don't get why anyone lets their DC behave that way.

apart from anything else, how do you alter it once it's started?! I mean, later, when they are older?

I'd have more respect for those people on here who said they would say something/ step in/offer help than those who look down their noses and sneer.

This with bells on. Have the balls to say something or forget about it.

Bloody hell, I think I should show this thread to DH. He was apparently "mortified" at our son's behaviour in a restaurant recently.

His awful crimes were:
To not eat his dinner (not making a fuss- just didn't like it)
To slouch in his seat
To fail to say "please" when ordering ice cream

Apparently I am a hopelessly liberal parent to put up with this

I wasn't even advocating letter him get away with it- just that they were relatively small infractions and therefore warranted gentle good natured correction and not the full stern-face routine.

@unlimiteddilutingjuice other than not saying please not really anything wrong with that.