No proposal for 12 yrs, now marrying someone else!

[fikit]

I have no idea what to do.

In short - I was with my ex partner for 12 years, through university, graduate careers etc. We have two DDs together.

Didn’t worry too much about marriage before children - after DD2 was born, we talked about it and he told me that he wasn’t ‘keen’ on the idea of marriage - rolled out the old ‘piece of paper to show how much I love you’ line and I was a little hurt that I’d miss out on a celebration and all the vows, and the looking down the aisle but, but I decided not to push it. We had a great relationship, two beautiful daughters, a house I adored and in the scope of things, my happiness wasn’t contingent on marriage.

We split last year after his affair with his now fiancé. Went from me, to her, to engaged to her in six months. They are getting married in July (day before my birthday) and want my DDs there.

I am not invited (obviously) but his mother has asked that I drop off the girls in the morning and pick them up from the reception?! She doesn’t drive otherwise she’d ‘do it herself to avoid any upset(?!)’ as XP really wants the girls there. As horrendously hurt as I am about the wedding, this is very much the proverbial straw on the proverbial camel.

AIBU to be completely WTF about this? Also - what do I do? I don’t want the girls there as this whole thing is destroying me, but he is their father.

Sorry for the long post, but help, please.

Glad the wedding was as well as it could be, really (I think).

I would agree, start a new thread, or people will answer the opening post!

Personally, much as your ex has been an absolute arse, he is their dad and in the long run a good relationshio with him and his new wife will be better for the girls assuming he is not an arse with them.

Much as it is painful I would encourage them to go, have some fun, if they can, get to know their dad's new wife and have something scrummy planned for when they get back! The new Peter Rabbit movie is out on DVD, maybe movie and pizza in the living room, making smoothies, and chatting naturally about how it went. (Smoothies in the kitchen or dining room, I'm not a Neanderthal!)

If they tell you stuff about new wife, try not to overreact in front of them, good or bad, just be interested and chat naturally. Because you want them to know you absolutely can handle this.

If things go well or badly you will not be upset (in front of them) and if things go very badly you can handle it and help move things on.

Please note I have not been in your shoes so feel very free to ignore every word I say. XXXX

I think you have to make them go
But you do need to have a conversation with them about how much you love them
How much dad loves them (?) (fake it if you need to!) and how much he is looking forward to the weekend together.
You will have shared custody for years and they may not like me going but will have to. Sorry I know that’s not the greatest advice but try and do the best you can. Maybe even be short and sharp and say sorry that’s the plan we have so w have to stick with it so it doesn’t become a big conversation every time?

I have been following this thread with horror from the beginning and just wanted to say how incredibly composed and dignified you have acted.

Unfortunately this weekend is a situation of his own making. Had he not forced them to go to the wedding, they would quite possibly be fine for contact this weekend.

As for what to say to your girls and how to play it, this really is a difficult one. There’s no contact order so he can’t force you. But at the same time, he poses no threat so you don’t want this to go to court as it may force more contact than there is right now.

I think you need to sit down with your girls and explain again that daddy still loves them and wants to see them. That you understand they are confused and sad about daddy loving another lady. You know inside their hearts that they love daddy very much and that mummy cannot stop daddy from seeing them because they’re cross and confused right now. Because that’s not fair on him. And not fair on them.

Tell them it will be ok. You send them with special notes, teach their toys to give them a special hug of buy a hug toy to cuddle them, you give them the hug button on their palm and another one or two elsewhere in case this one rubs off. And of course they can draw it back in the same place. It the button goes, they have the toy.

Tell them you will be ok and that you really want them to go and have a lot of fun with their daddy and his wife. Some of this will be solidarity for you. You plaster on a big smile and tell them you’re going to do some grown up stuff.

If all else fails, what about bribery? Is there anything that would give them pleasure and would not break the bank too much? You could perhaps say that you have a surprise for them when they get back and you need them to be gone for it. But you’d have to find a big surprise. With my dd it would be something like buying a guinea pig crate and telling her we are going to the shops because I’ve found some very cute ones.

Only you know if bribery is a good plan. I’m suggesting it on the basis that this will hopefully be the big hurdle and not a fortnightly treat.

I’d definitely get them to set up their toys, ask them if there is any toy or teddy, that needs looking after when they’re at daddy’s house and make plans for what they’re going to do when they come home. Get them into the mindset that they are going but they are coming home.

Will your ex engage with you and tell you the plans for this weekend? Perhaps tell him you think it would help them to make plans before they go. Children like routine afterall. Try and get agreement that the girls will be returned if they are too distressed.

Can you talk to their aunt about this?

OP just read your update.
Don’t make your girls go to contact weekend. You are the only one protecting their emotional needs.
Let their dad step up and be there for then.

The risk is, this could break down their relationship with him ( his fault 100%) . But do any of you really need this arsehole in your life? You & the girls need a good chunk of time to process what has happened.
Can contact start off with a day out rather than a full weekend. And just with their dad not ow as well? ( although you can only request this)

Wow, what a colossal idiot he is. She's managed to talk him into jumping into a marriage he will probably regret in six months but hey, that's his problem.
You might not see it now but you are better off without him if he's that easily blindsided. There will be someone much better out there for you.
As for the wedding, if he wants his daughters there, he will have to pick them up and look after them the entire time - his responsibility.
Otherwise, I totally agree with Bedtime Tea, take the girls away for the weekend and distance yourself from the whole ordeal.

The wedding has already happened

OP - mummyoflittledragon's advice is good. How horrible for you

Speak to Ex, tell him what DD said. Tell him you have no intention of stopping her going but you guys both must work as a team to reassure her and encourage her to go.
He will think up (hopefully!) lots of great things they can do together and this will hopefully persuade her. If she still refuses to go, theres no way he can say you haven’t tried.

What justvent said...and maybe suggest just one day and night rather than the whole weekend... I don't he will agree as he seems an insufferable twat, but at least you will have tried.
It's bloody horrible sitting at home wondering how your children are and not being sure they are ok. Make sure, again, that you have stuff planned for you that weekend.
The wedding seemed to go as predicted then I guess-at least it's over with. I hope the girls just put it behind them now.

Well done OP, it sounds like you handled the wedding well.

I think the girls should go on their contact weekend but can you be honest with ex about how tricky they’re finding it? Tell him they are feeling nervous and and anxious about it rather than they don’t want to go. Emphasise that it’s a big transition for them (now he’s married) and ask if you can work together to make things easier.

Have they ever not wanted to go before?

You have acted with dignity all the way through, which will stand you in very good stead. Your ex looks like a complete arse, and while he carries on with his life, he will always be an arse. Anyone who acts like he does, doesn't deserve someone like you.

I think it's natural that your girls are saying they don't want to go. The wedding must have been confusing, and now they don't know how things will be there.

I also think you have to encourage them to go. Long term, continuing to act with dignity is in your dds' best interests. Privately go and do some kick boxing or get a dart board with his face on it. You do need to vent, but to a third party.

So sorry you have to deal with this turd. You sound great. Your dds are lucky to have you.

Defo start a new thread as some will only read the opening post.

I think that you have been very dignified and a much better women than l would have been in this situation.

Even though your D.C. are very young, their behaviour speaks volumes.

At the end of the day, it’s up to their father to encourage them to go. I would suggest that you say that overnights stop for a while and build up to it gradually.

“and XP will turn it into an argument which will make matters worse for her”

What exactly do you mean here, how will it make matters worse for a small, vulnerable child? Surely her needs come before his.
Your XP sounds controlling, going by this statement.

Well done on navigating the wedding situation with complete dignity.

He makes the arrangements as it's his wedding.

However I would let them go. If they don't they may blame you when they are older.

At 6, the children should know very very little re the split and should be shielded from the adult emotions as much as possible. As adults they can make their own minds up about their parents but as children they should be kept out of the adult affairs.

Email him. Tell him the girls are anxious about coming to his. Also say that you think they should go to his so it doesn't sound like you're against the visit. Ask him if you can speak to them together.

OP. I’d start another post on this topic.

I’m stunned at how many people on this thread are ok to say, stop contact if the DC’s do not want to go. That’s a very slippery (and dangerous) slope to go down.

Are contact arrangements agreed between you? Or are they court ordered? Either way, if you start down the path of refusing contact, you open yourself up to family court proceedings. Which are horrific. Especially for the children and both of yours are at the age that they will be interviewed if both parents cannot come to agreement on contact. Please do not open that door, no one wins.

It is also incredibly normal for DC’s to say to you that they don’t want to go. And then tell
Your XP that they don’t want to return. My ExH and I were warned about this and our DC did it to us. I stayed positive, upbeat and corralled them out the door and my ex did the same. THey settled soon enough.

Please please please do not start withholding contact. That’s not ok. I think your ExP has been incredibly hurtful and insensitive. And has moved on at such speed, it isn’t child orientated. I think you’ve handled yourself amazingly well. Continue down that path OP. Tell your exP what the DC’s are saying and that they need extra support at this time. X

“What exactly do you mean here, how will it make matters worse for a small, vulnerable child? Surely her needs come before his.”

This is also a very tricky line to walk. Children this young have a host of very powerful emotions that they cannot understand, or navigate. What they feel in the moment is ‘I want to be with mummy’ or ‘I need to say something that makes mummy happy’.

I understand the DC’s need reassurance and love but stopping contact with their father because of the children’s needs is a very dangerous area. More people need to read up on parental alienation and the volume of training being rolled out across the family system (judges, carcass etc).

Allowing a child to decide whether they go to contact and acting on that is one of the early indicators of parental alienation. Would you give your DC the choice of whether they want to go to school? No. You wouldn’t. So why is this any different. This is their father, contact needs to happen with all family supporting the children through this transition. As painful as it is that’s the reality of separation/ divorce

Totally agree with TooSassy.

I agree with PPs saying that you shouldn't stop contact with their dad. They shouldn't be given a choice, the adults in their lives make the decisions for them, because they are acting in their best interests. Although that is debatable where your XP is concerned, having a relationship with their dad is in their best interests usually. (Obviously not always but there's no indication that their dad is a danger to them.)

As one PP said, if your child said 'Do I have to go to school?', you would tell them that yes, they have to go.

I'm so sorry you're having to dal with this, though, @fikit

You really have been amazing throughout all this. I'm full of admiration, you're a star. The pp who have said that you need to make every effort to ensure contact continues are spot on. If your daughters don't see their dad it's really storing up trouble for the future. Judging by what you've done over the last few weeks, I'm sure you'll call it perfectly.

I agree don't force your DCs to go if they don't want to.

It took me a while to realise my DDs didn't like contact weekends with their dad.

He'd remarried and subsequently had children - they liked their step-siblings when they came along - but I suspect it was all more of a reminder of their own 'broken home' for want of a better term, and seeing their dad with a shiny new life and family.

They're now 24 & 22, long past the age when we've anything to do with contact, and they see their dad once yearly if that. They're not particularly interested. They've a great relationship with step-siblings.

I wish I hadn't felt contact weekends were so important back then. In hindsight he should have made more of the effort to pick them up -and if they only wanted to go for a whole day instead of whole weekend then so be it.

You sound like a great mum OP. Some of the posts sound so lecture-ish. You're handling a tough situation admirably.

You're raising your DCs, you know them best and will do what's best for them. Children understand a lot more than some adults think they do, that's one thing discovered along the way.

💐

I'm so sorry that you even have to consider this issue. I echo everyone else's good advice but I did want to say this, on page one you refer to the fiance as a lucky sod on the basis she worked her magic in getting a proposal.....I'll tell you she isn't a lucky sod you did nothing wrong in those 12 years, nothing was missing. Your a great mum for being so understanding about the MIL and the girls being present. He didn't deserve you then and doest deserve your good grace now. But keep strong whatever you decide, I think your bloody great for being so understanding xx

I would tell him that the first contact weekend he has to come to them as they aren't happy about going to his. If he actually gives a shit, he'll travel to them to talk about it and hopefully make them happier about the situation. If he doesn't, he's a useless dad. I know what my prediction is.

Re contact.Your dd1 is being loyal and the wedding that she went has made her realise they her dad has someone to love but you don't do she probably wants to stay with you to fill that gap.
I assume that they were happy to go before so you just need to reassure them that their dad loves then and needs to see them.Maybe let them know what you will do while they're away to reassure them that you will be OK.
At this age it is important that they keep contact and settle down to this arrangement so that it becomes normal again.
It is incredibly hard but if you give in now it will be more difficult and distressing.

And why exactly should he do this? Why does he suddenly have to start jumping through hoops?

Let me unequivocally tell you this. Right now there are absolutely zero grounds to either prevent contact/ change the grounds for contact.

If this ever does escalate to courts it will look like thoroughly vindictive behaviour from the OP that is based purely on her response to the fact that he got married. It will not come across as a child focussed act.

How many posters on here advising this sort of advice have intricate knowledge of family courts and the system around it? It’s thoroughly terrible advice.

If there are concerns over contact arrangements then get to a family mediator ASAP to discuss. That is the first step. Raise concerns there. And work together. Do not just start dictating contact terms. It can (and may) backfire.

Why should they be picked up from the reception? Presumably you have a shared custody arrangement of some sort? (weekends etc?) Can this not be 'his night' with the children? If he doesn't want to have the responsibility of caring for them (!!!) then surely his mother (their grandmother) can take care of them for the evening?

You shouldn't be expected to ferry them around. Some men are idiotic.