DS1's Dad's Wedding - declined by school

[Idontbelieveinthemoon]

DS1 is in Y7 at High School. His Dad is getting married this year during term time and, obviously, wants DS1 to be there. School have refused the leave of absence request and stated that they expect DS1 to be in attendance on the days he was due to be away (it's a destination wedding so not something I can change, alter or even adapt to suit school; the actual wedding is on a week day and DS1 would be missing the whole of the last week of summer term).

So as not to drip feed DS1 has great attendance, is achieving well and all homework is on time and never gets into trouble. He also has ASD and can suffer from Anxiety at times and has been particularly anxious about being able to attend the wedding.

Am I able to appeal school's decision and challenge this? It seems awfully unfair that they've refused an application for a wedding of an immediate family member; being part of his Dad's wedding is a huge thing for DS1 and I can't see another way through this; he has to go to the wedding, he has to be there as it's his family.

Would it be U to challenge school's decision or is it best to leave it as unauthorised absence and just take the hit when they fine DH and I (they've written to us separately to advise that we'll be fined if he isn't in school on those dates)?

reading through posts here, it's unlikely school have much leeway with decisions like this as they're likely to be governed by the LA's blanket policy.

School don’t have much leeway with the fine for unauthorised absence, that’s up to the LA. The decision about whether it’s authorised or unauthorised is usually at the head’s discretion. Plenty of HT would authorise this but a lot seem to pull the ‘it’s not us our hands are tied’ line.

As others have said, go anyway. If you get a fine you could try appealing it.

Did anyone read the link I posted above?

It was very useful re the law etc and mentioned weddings being authorised and about specific dates counted.

It's a good start to know where you can stand

I'm more surprised that school don't deem his Dad's wedding an "exceptional" circumstance.

The thing is, that a "destination" wedding is the same as a holiday, in as much as you can book one in the school holidays, but it costs more. So people choose to do it out of the school holidays to save
money, just as they do for other holidays. Claiming that it's not the same as a holiday because there is a wedding involved doesn't cut it with the school.

I am not unsympathetic by the way, just saying it as the school sees it.

I suspect you won't actually get fined, and I hope you don't. They have to give you the spiel about fines and they have to follow certain rules. They are probably pretty sympathetic in reality, but their hands are tied as to what they can and can't authorise.

One thing I would be careful of is making sure that the school know he is going anyway and that it is your decision not his. Don't let them wind him up about it. My daughter - much you her but with similar issues, worried herself sick about us just taking her out. Her head was very good. Called her I to the office and told her that it was ok to go and to have a great time. (Despite writing the unauthorised letter). This was really important to her as the unauthorised letter made her feel that she was doing something very wrong.

Just let him go. I guess your biggest challenge is dealing with where the "rule breaking" clashes with your DS's ASD, as it may continue to be very challenging for him.
One of my cousins got married 3 years ago on a weekday and her sister did not attend as her DC (5 and 7 ish at the time) were refused authorised leave. I think I wasn't alone in thinking the less of her. You know in your child's family what is a big deal. And this is. He should be there and he's bound to have a brilliant time.

you can't plan when someone dies but if you're planning the funeral you can choose when it is

This is not really true. At some times of year, it's very hard to book a funeral on a convenient date. My mother died just after Christmas and we had to wait three weeks for an available slot, so we took the first one that was available. Also, the whole family had to travel 400 miles to get there and funerals are much, much more likely to be on a weekday and at very short notice. So the level of flexibility is significantly less than for a wedding - in addition to the fact that everyone is stressed and sad and significantly more in need of compassionate treatment.

Did anyone read the link I posted above?

I missed it initially but have just gone back and read through. It's a good starting point, thank you!

I guess your biggest challenge is dealing with where the "rule breaking" clashes with your DS's ASD, as it may continue to be very challenging for him.

Absolutely, Eliza, and I suspect it will have an impact on DS1's feelings towards the wedding as it draws nearer. I'm unsure as yet what to say to DS1; I can't lie and say school have authorised it, but I'm tempted to just be a little glib and just say "it's fine, you're going to the wedding and you'll have a great time".

Honestly, as a teacher I’d never ask for time of for my kids for stuff like this. I’d just ring in sick. End of term he’ll be doing nothing of major impact anyway.

Appeal, but be prepared for the fine. I’d still let him go.

*If a pupil/student is absent for two days either at the beginning or end of a half-term or term, the school will ask for evidence of their illness (medical certificate) or, in certain circumstances, request the Education Welfare Officer to visit.

This is an extract from my DDs school policy - presumably to challenge the idea that you just phone in & say he's sick as a number of pp have suggested.*

One local school round our way started asking for medical certificates to certify absence in such circumstances. The local GPs circulated a letter laying out exactly what they thought of this policy, and, perhaps not in so many words, but very nearly, where the school could stick it . Honestly, this kind of stuff is sabre-rattling, but mostly if you have good attendance that's all it is.

This stuff makes me virtually speechless with disgust and fury, though. The very idea that they'd spend money sending out welfare officers for a 2-day holiday before half term, in a climate where schools barely have enough money for pencils

frogsoup

Those who are saying that no learning takes place in the last week of the summer term, are you actually teachers?

If your children come back telling you they watched Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs i in the morning and ii in the afternoon, are you suggesting that you need to be a teacher to conclude that no learning took place that day?

After all the palaver people get here I was very annoyed to discover the primary school in the next village (and a different LA area) was merrily granting permission for multiple children to go on skiing holidays during term time providing they weren’t taking more than 3 days off at once. I don’t know how their head is getting away with it. The lack of consistency across different areas is extremely unfair.

Though I totally get why in your case OP you wouldn't want to lie.

Mammasmitten
Meteorology?

The school have no right to be threatening your DH with a fine. It's parents and/or those with PR that can be fined.

That does mean that my ex, who hasn't seen the girls for months, could be fined if I take them out of school even when he doesn't know, but there's nothing to do with DH in it. He has no legal responsibility for the children, or their education, as their step-father.

Can’t believe you even asked permission. I just told them what dates my children wouldn’t be in school. Receptionist once started telling me they’d let me know their decision once the panel had considered my application and it took three attempts to get her to understand It wasn’t an application, I wasn’t asking for permission and I couldn’t care less about their panel or decision so there was no need to let me know the outcome.

Let him go and pay any fine.

What annoys me about the blanket ban is that there's no discretion on anything. Of course head teachers know who is taking the piss and whose attendance is suffering because of a chaotic home life. At our school people blatantly take the piss and don't give a shit about whether or not their children are missing out. So loads of families go skiing the week before or after February half term, with no thought that this is prime learning time. Our local piss taking family took all the kids off to Spain the week after Easter and then complained that their yr 5 kid was kept in at playtime to catch up. Otoh, people who take their kids in the last week of Christmas or last week of summer when there isn't any formal learning at all, (panto, Christmas quiz, Christmas play, Christmas lunch, games afternoon) - those requests, if they're for situations like op's should be looked at with discretion. Not all school weeks are equal. My sister came over from nz last year, first time we saw her in 5 years. Her kids were given authorised leave for 3 weeks and a learning plan. I took my kids out for a week in last week of term so we had as much time together as possible (holidays just not the same at all) and couldn't get it authorised, although the head gave us her unofficial blessing. We didn't get fined.

Be aware that some councils are now issuing ASBOs alongside fines. My local council does this.

He11y it's delusions of grandeur isn't it. I got a letter last term announcing that the school was delighted to say that they were authorising my DSs absence for a music exam. As if I was going to let him miss a music exam if they'd said no!!!

There is no way I would want to pay a penny towards the fines incurred by an ex of my partner, - just sayin..

Be aware that some councils are now issuing ASBOs alongside fines. My local council does this

My local council has recently announced that they won't be issuing fines for holidays in term time any more. Ridiculous to have such wide discrepancy

All those saying that no work gets done in the last week at school in year 7 are incorrect in many cases. Do you have any year 8s at school now? Did really do no work at all during the last week of summer term last year? All week?

Many good secondary schools nowadays end their academic year at the end of June and start the new academic year at the beginning of July. DD’s school works at full pelt until the penultimate day of term. Only the last day at her school isn’t a proper school day.

This system works well at DD's school, and they have seen their GCSE results increase, and their ofsted rating improve.

“As if anyone plans their wedding around school ”

Why wouldn’t you? Especially if you want school age children to attend. It is a tad selfish IMO.

“Personally I'd have had him develop a virulent stomach bug that very sadly coincided with the last week of term”

Do you really think the school's attendance officer is going to believe that? All it will do is mark you out as that parents who tells lies.

croprotationinthe13thcentury - ah, teachers are "little Hitler's" (sic).
So predictable. I knew someone would slag off the teaching profession!

@frogsoup No idea what shit you are chatting. lol It’s very simple and requires no further explanation or examination.

I really wouldn't be listening to those saying to phone in that he's sick - as your DS has ASD I would imagine that this would cause him some anxiety - what if wants to tell classmates about his DF's wedding on his return? It's also just a bit off considering you've already applied for the time as holiday.

School attendance is IMHO well-intentioned. We are very lucky to live in a country that provides free education to all DCs and I can understand why they brought in a system to penalize those parents who persistently take their DCs out for holidays at crucial times. Unfortunately these days they have to try to have a blanket system, or imagine the outcry and the suing of head-teachers when one DC is granted the dates and another families DC is not.

In this case if the fine is levied, I think it's fair enough. DS's DF presumably knows school dates - or if he's not even that involved should have the wherewithal to ask or check - so his choice to go ahead and book the wedding outside of those dates. I presume it was done on a cost basis so £60 ( or £120 if levied per parent as he should absolutely pay the total fine) will be much less than what he saved by booking outside of school holidays.

Utterly ludicrous OP. If a parent's wedding isn't exceptional circumstances, what is? I'd be contacting your councillors and MP.