Just got told that I'm racist toward my own child

[jumpiin]

I was at the park with my son, not many people there just one other lady with her two kids. I smiled at her on the way in and she gave me a dirty look. Bit strange but just ignored it. I was playing and we were having a great time, we were laughing and I called him a cheeky monkey affectionately. This lady storms over to me and tells me not say that around her children (she was black for the record) she was very rude and stood right in my face. I asked her what the problem was and she gave me a big speech I can't exactly how she worded it as I'm fuming but she basically said, me calling my own baby a cheeky monkey was racist because he's mixed, she also said that I was ignorant and that I needed to educate myself because I know nothing about my own child's race. She then told me that I'm "just another one of those girls who thinks a brown baby is an accessory". She then stormed off and I've come straight home as the afternoon was ruined and I'm still reeling! I assume she made these assumptions because I'm white, I've taken the time to learn about my DPs culture and DS is learning to speak English and Swahili and as for seeing him as an accessory that's just ridiculous, he is the most precious and important thing in my life. Aibu to think that she was in the wrong here and that she is a part of the problem? And to think that I can call my child whatever I want as long as there's no malice behind it?!

OP YANBU of course.

I don’t blame you but then I don’t blame the shouty woman either.

I blame the people who made it an offensive term for blacks in the first place.

I blame the football fans who threw bananas on the pitch, I blame the thugs who probably called Stephen Lawrence a monkey before they stabbed him. I blame my ex-friend who regularly calls black people monkeys.

I blame them for shouty woman’s defensiveness.

I get the connotations behind ‘monkey’ but it’s about context. OP. You meant it affectionately & that’s all that matters.

I call my kids cheeky monkey and I don’t care who overhears.

Save the distaste for when someone is actually being racist, yeah?

I love a thread where white people discuss what is racist and what isn't.

When I moved to England I had a broad Welsh accent - I had a lot of comments about my mother's fleece, my father's sexual proclivities and "mint sauce" and "lamb chop" were mentioned in the playground a lot and people used to shout "baaa" when I walked past at school. Just as people used to insult the Irish by calling them Paddy. So white people suffer from racism too. Why aren't we allowed an opinion?

I wonder if the connotations of this phrase are changing.

I know 'monkey' has been a very offensive term in the US for years. I had assumed UK usage was rather different - that the term could be a terrible racist insult or really quite neutral, depending on the context (awful football supporters throwing bananas onto a pitch as an act of aggression against an opposing black player is not the same as a parent calling their child a 'cheeky monkey').

It seems like this is now shifting and that 'monkey' in any context, even when used by a parent, is deemed offensive?

love a thread where white people discuss what is racist and what isn't.

I lived in Leicester and went to a primary school where I was one of the only white children there. (In a school of 650) We didn’t do Christmas, I had to wear a sari and do Diwali dances, there were posters in re about Hinduism, Islam, Sikhism but not Christianity.
The teachers were spiteful and made me cry on a regular basis, I think it’s incredibly narrow minded to assume just because someone is white they have no experience of racism

To all the people staring how ok this is... This is not just any old white person saying it to another white person. It is a white mother saying it to a mixed race child. So it is not ok. Context is key.

To HER mixes race child. Affectionately. Her cheeky monkey.

Babymama a white mother saying it to a random mixed race child whilst walking down the street is racist.
A white mother saying it to her mixed race child while he was, presumably, acting like a cheeky monkey, is not.

I'm sure that the OP just doesn't on a day to day basis think about the fact that her DS is mixed race, to her he's simply her DS. Any more than I constantly think about the fact that my DDs are adopted. They are my DDs.

Exactly. I don't even register that DHB's mixed race, although racism gets my back up more now, and threads about stupid people like the other mum in the OP make me think WTF?

Call your son affectionately what you want but you may have to prepare yourself for how others may react to it (outside the home).

She was being very rude to you and to a total stranger is not on at all! I hope you're ok.

But to all the white people saying they call their kids that, that is fine and of course it's not racist (as white people haven't been called monkeys as a form of insult/abuse) but POC will define their own experience from that phrase, it's not your job to understand 'what all the fuss is about' or 'I lovingly call my kid(s) that all the time...' and compare it POC's thoughts/feelings on it.

It's not the 'racism olympics', comparison isn't the topic here. That other woman was awfully abusive to you and she had no right.

I think you need to check your privilege OP. As a white person, it's not up to you to determine whether repressed groups find something offensive. If a person of colour tells you they find something offensive, it's rude and privileged of you to proclaim otherwise. People like you are helping to maintain ingrained institutional discrimination again oppressed groups, and you should be ashamed of yourself.

I'm mixed race and wouldn't say that to my child.
I'm sensitive to that word because of my past experiences.
Op I understand you havenn't had those experiences and I you're obviously not racist but I would urge you not to use that word.

It's understandable that the OP is defensive, she clearly wasn't intending to be racist as she loves her DS. Also, as I said earlier in the thread, I doubt it even crosses her mind day to day that her DS is mixed race, he is simply her DS who she loves. There's no need to be so hard on her, there's obviously no racial prejudice on her part.

Also, the other mum clearly had a problem with her before she opened her mouth, it sounds as if she has a problem with mixed race relationships.

But the OP does need to learn from this, that in fact there is a racial difference between her and her DS and in time he will be aware of it. Same as I have to accept that however much I might like to forget that my DDs are adopted and don't share my DNA, it's a fact that won't go away.

I would of like to reply ( but probably would not of thought of it quick enough ) Monkeys , apes , chimps , gibbons are all cheeky I was just stating a fact .

I called my first baby my little monkey. She was just like one - thin as a rake, never sat still, cute little monkey type face. The UK does not have any US connotations to this word.

Also about 83% of the UK is white and plenty in areas where just about no one is black. I don't think we can be expected to censor our language just on the off chance someone near by in a park might not like the words we use to our own children. Of course if we were beating them with a stick in the park then yes people should intervene but that would be a different matter.

Monkey were always one of our favouite animal actual. My mother always wanted them. It was never and is not now anything to do with people who aren't white.

I wonder how long it will be before zoos are not allowed to call any of the primates monkeys .

About 2 years ago while I was at work with a small group of work mates plus 6 boss's , one of whom was fairly new .
I was asked to turn a hard to access (very narrow gap about 5 foot out of my reach) switch off so I said I cant reach it , hang on I will get the pole , the newish boss started of on a tirade YOU CANT SAY THING LIKE THAT ! it is racist , i am like huh what and went to get the pole , 2 mins later I came back I could still hear this idiot ranting ( my colleges knew what I meant but just let him carry on with himself )
I then showed him my 7 foot long wooden pole and turned the switch off .
We then christened the pole Filip ( pronounced Philip ) as this is a popular polish boys name .

@Xenia That's your opinion and solely yours. If you don't understand/can't see how that can be offensive to some people who aren't white/non poc, then that's your reality.

Like I said in my post, it's not for you/any other white/non poc to determine what is and what isn't acceptable in regards to other people's experiences with it.

I don't like the term, but OP can decide what she feels is right as that's not my child and I wasn't having a go, just that it's important to open a dialogue to another's perspective

She sounds deranged. You are obviously not racist, she is just mad. Hope you meet nicer people there next time

@Angie169 I think you're missing the point entirely

Monkeys (the animals) are called monkeys, that won't change lol it's the fact that poc have been reduced to not human/less 'superior' than whites/non poc

For what it's worth, your colleague/boss sounded like a right douche and his argument was totally pointless, ridiculous and unnecessary. You did nothing wrong.

My husband is Caucasian, as is his ex, and he calls my stepdaughter Cheeky Monkey! Race has nothing to do with it!

My DD is very long and very slim, we call her spider monkey, never thought anything of it

@EdiShowers you sound like an Everyday Feminism article

Lizzie it's not comparable to adoption at all! What a strange thing to say.

It's obviously not the same. I was just pointing out that the OP probably forgets about the fact that her DS is mixed race, because to her he's just her DS. And of course she'll constantly hear her mum friends calling their DC 'Cheeky Monkey', so she probably does it unthinkingly.

Judo, yes I agree with you but for those of us who don't mean it as a nasty racial slur we have a freedom in English law to go to a park and call our own child whether mixed race or not a cheeky monkey. However I agree it is helpful that we all learn what terms other people find offensive and then we can take a considered view at the time. Sometimes I will shut up altogether and not speak in some contexts because my received pronunciation can go down badly - so just how I look and speak could offend some people and I can put on a bit of a regional accent when that is wise. However it is a difficult balancing act between not offending others and giving in to censorship. I have on my piano sheet music with the N word in it as that is how it was written in anbout 1927. For a 1938 film with it in they changed N to another more acceptable word for 1938. (I only have the old version because I bought it second hand as I am too mean always to buy stuff brand new on the internet). Now using that as an example I would not sing it with that word out of this house nor even take the music out of the house because I know how offensive that is to many and the last thing I ever want to do is upset people; although there is a bigger issue here - do we censor the past, censor the Bible, censor Shakespeare. Context is the big thing here.

In my own context my parents were fascinated by our origins from monkeys and my father would show me from about age 5 and up every interesting article in the Times showing the ascent of man, new bones found in Kenya etc etc and our closeness to monkeys we always saw as a wonderful thing, how evolution worked etc just as I've shown mine that most people in the UK we now know have not just our own traditional genes but also neanderthal genes.

Anyway a useful thread and I shall certainly not be calling anyone cheeky little monkey any time soon.