AIBU to think parenting a wilful child can be really miserable?

[Hackedoffwithit]

I have namechanged so I can say what I want without reproach.

I'm so tired of parenting a wilful 7 year old DS. I have tried so many approaches, so many ways of parenting him - we have had SO many discussions about it that I can hardly bear to talk about it with DP again - and I have taken so much on board about my own personality, my failings and made huge efforts to overcome whatever I'm contributing to it... and yet...it gets us nowhere.

He's a great kid - funny, bright, emotionally really astute. But he's also utterly disrespectful to me quite a lot (far more than DP), unmovable once he wants something and if denied, can go on and on and on and on - never giving up - which is so exhausting and makes me want to shoot myself. And sometimes he's rude a lot to me, at home and out, so rude that despite taking the approach of asking him gently to 'be nice, use a nice tone,' I want to scream in his face that I'm his mum, show some respect.

Today I had enough and snapped after several things. Sent him to bed without reading. He was upset but even though he understood why, he couldn't let go of the fact that we'd denied him reading time. He's apologised but only because he really wants to read. He's still calling out about it now, 45 mins on.

When he's good, he's AMAZING. And don't get me wrong, I absolutely love him to bits.

But I find him so challenging and such hard work. It's just really upsetting. I feel stuck in treacle with it.

Slutty, maybe that's where we're going wrong?
maybe we need to start?

adding in wine into every sentence? predictive text? clearly God fate someone telling you that you SHOULD be including more wine in your life? ?
Maybe?

For the scenario in the park, I think booellesmum has it spot on. Give them a chance to correct themselves (kids often forget themselves...adults too, tbf) and if they don't stop, they have to go home.

And then take them home, right there and then. If they scream, cry, kick up a fuss, bite you, hit you, whatever, just ignore it and carry on.

I know it's really hard though. I'm lucky that mine are both pretty placid, but it is definitely the luck of the draw in a lot of ways.

You are the adult. Your ds will do what he can get away with.
Stop trying different things and be consistent.
Him having tantrums isn't a sign what you do isn't working. He will push and push until you give in and this gets worse before it gets better once you decide to be firm with him.
If you are worried about him getting upset he will play on that.
Ask for help and advice from professionals because we don't get trained in parenting and it can soon get overwhelming and confusing.
It's not about changing him, it's about changing what you do and how you deal with it.

Sorry OP where does it say in your posts that you have tried?

You 'snapped' after several things had already happened - not consistent
You were worried that disciplining him in the park would make him look silly - !

I know its probably really old fashioned but he sounds as though he desperately needs boundaries

Actually if you and dh are 'fiery' then perhaps your tolerance of what you will put up with is lower than mine.

I don't take any shit from my kids - even if my hormonal teens shout at me I take the moral high ground. They always apologise after. We are a team, I'd do anything for them but I am also a good person and don't EVER deserve rudeness or belittling.

sarky but is that the most helpful way you could think of delivering that advice?!

I think with mine it is partly poor behaviour and they need us to bring them in line, just like all kids, but it is sometimes that they are driven personalities yet not yet fully in control, and again boundaries are needed, I agree, but at those times a head on collision won't help.

But you are right that boundaries are needed (and I think the OP agrees) and I agree rudeness shouldn't be accepted (to the mother or anyone else).

I don't take any shit from my kids - even if my hormonal teens shout at me I take the moral high ground

I'm surprised at how many parents DO take shit from their kids.
It is like they are frightened of them being upset. They will get into arguments with them, offer bribes, plead with them to be good. Children are very resilient and they are not stupid. They know how to get their own way and if tantruming works, then why not?
They feel a lot more secure if they know there are boundaries and that certain behaviours won't be tolerated.
So long as a child is loved and gets positive attention they won't be scarred for life if you are firm with them when needed.

I understand. My nearly 4 year old doesn't argue because his speech isn't that great but he will run like the wind when I'm trying to get him to do something, climb everything, yank my hair out in handfuls, trash his bedroom and every bedtime is a nightmare. But sometimes he is lovely, like when he comes home from preschool, shouts mummy and gives me a big hug.

sarky but is that the most helpful way you could think of delivering that advice?!

This.

Please don't come on here and take the moral high ground. It's so unhelpful.

I started out saying I've tried lots of parenting approaches - these include being very boundaried and intolerant of bad behaviour. I've said DP is very clear and firm.

We're not a pair of pushovers.

I am absolutely the last person to dare to take the moral high ground! But you are over thinking this! The first thing you can do is have a zero tolerance policy to any rudeness. It won't cure everything but it may help you to put your own feelings first.

I think there’s been crossed wires due to nuances being lost in written text.
I absolutely agree a zero tolerance to rudeness, no matter where you are, out for a meal, in the park, in the house. Just flat out zero tolerance. Immediate consequences. (Not being smug or taking the moral high ground, just years of experience with 3 wilful bairns plus advice from Mum about raising a wilful child me)

margaritabythesea I'm actually a bit scared now, we appear to have exactly the same 10 year old DD, everything you just wrote applies to mine, to the last letter! Even down to her kicking off when I'm not at my best. She hero worships me and we have very similar personalities.. I think she struggles with seeing my weaknesses

OP, I would have taken him out of the park right away, and I would be delighted if his friends had seen me do it, it makes life a lot easier in the long run, because kids will hate being told off in front of friends, and you are showing that you'll discipline them in all situations, regardless. This is a powerful thing and it's a good lesson for them to learn for when they are older, especially when peer pressure etc becomes a thing - people aren't going to hesitate to challenge poor behaviour in an adult because "they don't wnat to embarrass them" are they?

All loving parents want to have confident, happy children, but in the long term, we are raising confident, happy humans, and that means being a good citizen, behaving in a civilised manner, learning consequences.

My stubborn DD is an amazing child, smart, funny, hard working, nothing but praise from school etc. I adore her and I look forward to see the woman she'll become. But it takes a strong woman to raise a strong woman, and I have had to be firm and ride out so many storms. It's not over yet, I have a feeling the teenage years will be the hardest yet. But it'll be worth it to see DD grow into her personality. But I can see how if I'd taken a different approach, DD would be an impossible nightmare of a child

My 8 year old DD is like this, and often tells me I'm mean, it's my fault, etc. She shouts (a lot) and is disrespectful. She has admitted that she would never be like that to Daddy. If I discipline her (I only hit her if she hits me, and then not hard), she will hit me back and say "but you hit me", and doesn't get that I'm the adult and trying to instil some respect and discipline. It is a battle but I'm hoping it will eventually get better. She's not always like that, and is usually lovely, but when she is tired, or not getting her own way, it can be hell.

wixi if you hit her, how are you teaching her that hitting is unacceptable? You're not. You're teaching her that, in some circumstances, hitting is ok. So, how will she ever learn not to hit?

My 7 yr old boy is like this. It's exhausting. His siblings are easy so I don't blame myself. Totally agree with lots and lots of exercise. And also lots of opportunities to come to his own decisions (not about everything, but things that seem appropriate). Talking through scenarios before they happen and finding solutions - eg bathtime is a massive Flashpoint for my son, so tonight I will tell him that he has 20minutes of free time and within it, he has to wash all over. He can either take the full 20 mins to fight about every step or race with himself to wash all over and still have 17mins of free time. That sort of thing works, but it requires me to have mental energy, and of course after 10 other battles you don't have any spare!

wixi don't hit your children ffs

Oh I have one llike this.
I had the most lovely conversation with his teacher in year 3 (he was very good in school, I was just desperately seeking advice). She has 3 boys and one like this. She said to me that if her strong willed one had been her only she would have thought it was her parenting, but as she has 2 others, she realises it is his personality.

ds is now 15, and here are some thoughts from over the years:

1. there were definitely low points that lasted for months years Around age 7 was one of the worst
2. I did lose it with him, and got really cross and shouted often . While I don't recomend it, it did actually seem to reset the boundaries. Sometimes he needed to kick the boundaries and for me to draw the line in the sand again
3. The flip side of this is that he is a very strong character. Not easily led, a definite leader, has amazing qualities. At 15 he is very together, self organised, thinks deeply about the future, is very much - I'm not doing drugs/getting drunk every saturday, I want to get my education and get a life. Seeing this as being a strong person, rather than his strong will battering mine helped.
4. I eventually realised that getting into arguments doesn't work. He can argue the hind leg off a donkey and in later years he has admitted that he mostly did it to wear me down to get his own way. Eg the reading in you example, he would know PERFECTLY that it was justified, but by going on and on about it, he might get me to offer a compromise etc. The irony of this is that I have always been, once I've said no, then it is no. He can't talk me round, but he spent 10 years trying. I remember him saying to his little sister, - no use arguing that one, she's said no.

To get past the arguing I realised I didn't have to explain and go through it with him 20 times. After he has gone on about it 2/3 times, I would say - I'm not talking about it any more, the subject is closed, my decision is final, and then refuse to get into more conversations about it. (it was very very hard to keep my mouth shut) that did get rid of a lot of the 'miniature lawyer in my house' feeling.

oh, and I menat to say
it is bloody hard work.

Oh yes and the person who told me - we think that good parents have well behaved kids. They don't. All kids misbehave. Good parents are the ones who respond well when their kids misbehave.

Even more great advice, thanks a lot.

It all boils down to: no means no (but pick what battles you're going to say no over).

But can I just stress that even though he has hit me in frustration, it would never occur to me to respond in kind. Ever.

Yep.
I was out with just my "easy" child the other week and started crying as it was such a different experience compared to being with both of them.

I love 1,2,3 magic (Google it). U count child for whining, negotiating etc. So they get 3 warnings (for different behaviours) in a defined period then consequence. Swearing, physical violence gets automatic time outs/ipad removed for a time

And iv been bit in the ass with taking stories away before bed and then takes hours for mine to go sleep. So I avoid that punishment.

And I can't give an inch or takes 2 months for them to obey 'rules' again.

OP we’re all just doing our best aren’t we? We all have good days and bad days and sometimes really really shit days and sometimes on-top-of-the-world awesome days.
Find what works for you in all this and run with it. The rest of it, meh, leave it on here.

Fully agree about not hitting though, especially to teach a kid not to hit? Makes about as much sense as teaching them road sense by running them over!