Who was unreasonable in this cafe?

[PartyRingss]

I was having a coffee earlier in a busy high street cafe and witnessed a couple of women having an argument.

It was very busy in there today and I looked up when I heard raised voices. Woman 1 was sat down at a table for 4 on her own with no food or drink. Woman 2 was stood there holding a tray with food and drink on with her two smallish children (I'd say around 4/5/6 years old.)

She had obviously asked woman 1 if she could have the table as she didn't have her food/drink but was obviously told no. That's when woman 2 started raising her voice saying she shouldn't be saving tables when the cafe is so busy whilst people with their food then have nowhere to sit.

Woman 1 argued loudly "well you should have made sure you had somewhere to sit before getting your food " to which the other woman shouted "well I can't leave my kids at a table and get food!" Woman one then told her that her dh would be here in a minute and at that moment another couple offered woman 2 the other half of their table of 4 so she sat with them and pulled up a chair to sit on the end and she made comments about "selfish people."

Meanwhile woman 1 sat defiantly for 10 minutes looking out the window until her husband had been served at the counter and came with their drinks and sandwiches. When he arrived at their table a few other tables were becoming free.

Now I know it is sense sometimes to make sure you have somewhere to sit when at a cafe where you have to take a tray and help yourself to sandwiches etc and get your hot drinks and food orders at the counter. But surely when it's busy and there are several people in front of your partner at the counter then it becomes a bit selfish, especially if you sit watching people walk around with no where to sit to eat their food. Not everyone can leave someone to reserve a table such as children for instance.

Surely by the time someone has been served other tables become free like in this case. It was so awkward watching this woman be so defiant at giving up the table for someone who had food already purchased with 2 kids in tow and rather her sit crammed up with a couple of people she didn't know, especially when her husband was quite far off being served. If it's not that busy then I don't really see an issue but it was busy and the staff were rushed off their feet.

I think woman 1 was massively unreasonable!

Mid I wouldn't say I go through life over analysing everything but I am self aware and look to see what is going on around me and help where I can. Not in a goodie two shoes way but more because it's kinder that way. People are just trained to not see beyond their own nose these days.

What do you normally do then Perfect, if waiting for a table or buying food to cook at home are “unfair” to the dcs?
If you need to eat at Sainsbury’s cafe, then you can just wait or do what the mner did on another thread and refuse to move the queue until a table becomes vacant.

What I want to know is..

Is there a time limit on how long you are "allowed" to stay and chat after you've finished your drinks/food if others are waiting?

Hunter, there is no time limit for how long you’re “allowed” to stay after you finish your drink, but I’m sure the owner wouldn’t be too pleased at loss of potential customers if you stay too long.

When I was a teenager the coffee shop I worked at had a £3 minimum spend pp at lunchtime There was only 10 tables in the coffee shop so I suppose his logic was to stop someone nursing a cup of tea all lunchtime whilst customers buying a full lunch were turned away due to no room. He was a twat though tbh!

If you where brought up correctly and have manners, you will know that the rule of eating in a cafe is to order first get your stuff, then sit down at a table.

Regardless of what had been said on here, I can't help feeling that it unbelievably bad mannered to hog a table when people who have bought food can't sit down.
I understand the argument about common sense, thinking ahead etc but think it is selfish, sorry

If you where brought up correctly and have manners blah blah blah

Ah, but who's the one stood with a tray of food & nowhere to sit??

(and its "were" BTW)

If you where brought up correctly and have manners, you will know that the rule of eating in a cafe is to order first get your stuff, then sit down at a table.

Really? In every single cafe?? Nope.

As I said ^^, there were nine of us in a cafe this week. Adding five adults, two teens, and two toddlers to the busy queue would be madness.

It could be said that arrogantly getting food then expecting there to be a table or someone to move, is far more rude.

I don't think so Primal. Assuming that harassed people looking for somewhere to sit as their food goes cold are arrogant is stretching things a bit far to fit in with your view, don't you think?

Assuming that people should move for you in a situation where it might be the 'done thing' to secure a table first, is arrogant. Woman 2 in the OP tried to get someone to move from where they were sitting and it sounds like she was rude about it.

Why would woman 1 should to give up her seat she reserved for someone else, and then have to hope that someone else would free a table for her to sit down?
I would give up 2 seats at a table, but I would not be moving just because someone else wants to sit down. i don't g in to busy places with my child because of that reason, or I try to go with someone who can hold a table for us (partner, friend) while I order.

Isl struggle to understand the mentality of pps who honestly can't see that bagging a table can, in some circumstances, be rude, entitled and selfish
I will try another way. Is it not just queue jumping?
Assuming if you queue in a cafe you are queuing for a) food and b) somewhere to eat it at the same time.

Depends on the cafe. But it seems daft to me to chance it somewhere busy, unless there's a clearly stated rule of don't sit down first.

Personally I'd not want my kids or anyone else's faffing about in the queue and getting in the way if it would be possible for them to sit down.

They'll be faffing about and getting in the way in the aisles between tables when there's nowhere to sit because of the table hogs.

They wouldn't - because we wouldn't get in the queue without having found a table first.

because we wouldn't get in the queue without having found a table first
I keep wondering, with this approach, what you recommend for those on their own?

In the particular cafe I was discussing, it would have been easy-ish for someone on their own to grab a seat. There was bar stool seating, seats outside etc. But not so easy to find space for 9.

If I go into Starbucks and there are only 2 tables left but a queue of people in front of me, then I turn around and go and find somewhere else to go because I'm not a selfish shit. A lot of people are, though, so would do things differently.

But woman 1 had the table first. Yes she should have agreed to share but it sounds like woman 2 acted a bit like a harridan. This cafe sounds awful btw.