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AIBU?

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Original poster

To ask all Irish women to please show solidarity today?

349 replies

RottenTomatoes959 · 29/03/2018 08:20

Please join the rallies in support of the victim in belfast today,theres rallies in Dublin belfast and cork. Enough is enough and we can not take this one lying down. Show support to the brave young woman and lets not have this trial be in vain.
Something has to change.

OP posts:
LearnAsIgo · 29/03/2018 08:34

I agree. It's horrendous what she has endured, the event itself and the trial. My heart goes out to her

Gardai · 29/03/2018 08:46

I agree. Will go, the whole thing has made me boak.
Seems we are in the dark ages here

falsepriest · 29/03/2018 08:50

Not being obtuse, just unaware of the situation. Can we have some context?

ghostyslovesheets · 29/03/2018 08:51

wish I could join you - the whole case is disgraceful I Believe Her

Laiste · 29/03/2018 08:54

Could we have a link?

Feilin · 29/03/2018 08:59

I dont know what to believe . Ill point out the majority of the world was NOT in that court room and therefore DO NOT know exactly what went on. If she is telling the truth then God love her she needs all the support she can get. Even if she is not telling the truth those men need to hang theirs heads in shame their behaviour was disgusting . That is someones daughter .. absolute disgrace .

ShatnersWig · 29/03/2018 09:14

Rotten But what are you wanting to change? Should these cases no longer be tried by juries?

NoFuckingRoomOnMyBroom · 29/03/2018 09:17

Are we talking about the Ulster rugby players rape trial here?
If so I was slightly agog at the male to female ratio of the jury & it certainly made me Hmm

AhHere · 29/03/2018 09:19

Link:

www.image.ie/life/belfast-rape-trial-114894

Eighttimeseight · 29/03/2018 09:20

This case has made me so sad. I believe her but I also think that the prosecution didn't prove beyond a reasonable doubt that they were guilty - very hard to do given the nature of the case.

LaurieMarlow · 29/03/2018 09:22

This case has thrown up some big legal issues for me. I get that consent is very hard to prove beyond all reasonable doubt.

So I'm not sure how we should be handling rape cases. A result like this will only deter the victims from coming forward. And surely there should be some special measures put in place for rape cases to ensure a 50/50 split on the jury.

The thing I object to most now is the narrative that the guys are innocent and she's a liar. A lack of conviction (which may be correct legally) does not mean that.

Northernparent68 · 29/03/2018 09:23

How can you believe her, you have n’t heard her give evidence, or read the court file.

AhHere · 29/03/2018 09:23

Link with more info:

www.thejournal.ie/rugby-rape-trial-10-3925775-Mar2018/

3EyedRaven · 29/03/2018 09:23

It’s just so depressing

ShatnersWig · 29/03/2018 09:23

NoFucking There were more men on the jury, yes, but the verdict was unanimous, so the women on the jury didn't think any differently to the men.

Stillscreaming · 29/03/2018 09:24

The marches are a show of solidarity towards the victim, from those of us who believe she was a victim of rape.

What I'd like is some education for juries on rape myths before the trial starts.

My wife was in an office yesterday with six other women when the verdict came through, she had to sit and listen to every single rape myth that had been internalised by her co workers. Myths that rape would be their own fault if they'd had a drink, wore the wrong clothes or were in the wrong place. Not a single one of those women thought that they had the right to withdraw consent, once a sexual act had started.

We're doing something wrong.

SchoolMoney · 29/03/2018 09:24

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

LaurieMarlow · 29/03/2018 09:25

so the women on the jury didn't think any differently to the men

Well that's a bit simplistic. Group effect will come into play in situations like this.

McTufty · 29/03/2018 09:26

I wasn’t in court to say for sure if they are guilty or not guilty of rape but it is obvious that these men treat women like absolute shit and need to learn some respect.

I hope the woman at the centre of all this is ok and being well supported.

Idontdowindows · 29/03/2018 09:27

The thing is, even if they get off in court, it doesn't mean they didn't do it.

Women have very little reason to go through the trauma of a rape trial (we already know that either men get off, get off lightly or get a token sentence, barring very few exceptions) and that being accused of rape and found guilty doesn't hamper their careers at all) if it didn't happen.

We also know that the rate of false rape accusations is the same as in any other crime, so very low.

Statistically speaking, it's a safe bet that they did it, even if it cannot be proved.

So I will always believe the woman until it is proven that she lied.

Usernumbers1234 · 29/03/2018 09:27

Not sure that a 50:50 jury is more likely to convict. Studies consistently show female jurors are more likely to acquit, male dominated juries convict at a far higher rate.

Usernumbers1234 · 29/03/2018 09:28

Edit - and that’s based on rape and sexual assault cases, not all cases.

ShatnersWig · 29/03/2018 09:32

laurie I disagree. If I felt convinced a woman had been raped, there is absolutely no way I would be swayed by others thinking otherwise. It would be deadlock. It would go back to the judge who would either a) accept a majority verdict or b) dismiss the jury and order a new trial.

User is right about studies.

School I'm not sure "not proven" is a particularly sensible verdict; it's not exactly in widespread use around the world and most Scottish people I know think it should be done away with.

saoirse31 · 29/03/2018 09:32

I accept the trial process is awful, particularly in this case, but I'd say awful for both sides. The four men have been found not guilty. Assuming that's the right verdict, there lives, reputations have been massively impacted despite their having broken no laws.

The victim, has not had anonymity and because of that will have this following her for years.

But the accused were found not guilty. So tbh I don't get the constant 'I believe her'. A jury sat for 40 days or around that, and took under four hrs to acquit. Unanimously. You can't ignore that. And I believe its wrong and unjust to decide that you'll always believe or disbelieve one side purely because of their sex.

In Ireland, (republic), people accused of rape are not named unless found guilty, and then not if its family. I think that's better approach.

Allthewaves · 29/03/2018 09:34

Honestly Iv half followed the case and I'm torn. It was an awful situation. On one hand I cant see why she would go and say she was raped if she wasn't raped - who would make their life even more hellish. On the other hand I do believe she went into the situation giving consent then changed her mind BUT I don't think this could have been proven beyond reasonable doubt.

It's why many rape cases are hard to prove as it's victims word rapist